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please stop telling people to " Go look it up online"!!

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Flashpoints, Operations, and Heroic Missions
please stop telling people to " Go look it up online"!!

Frog_brains's Avatar


Frog_brains
05.06.2013 , 11:17 AM | #1
As the tittle states, please stop telling people to go look something up online. Almost daily I see someone ask a perfectly acceptable question over general, and there are people who take the time to try to help the person out. ie on makeb the h4 savage skies, "how do you destroy the turrets?" we've all been there. we were all confused for a second, then either figured it out or got a response from the in game community. we said, Ty, they responded Yw, and we moved on. But there's always people who's default answer is to tab out and check online!

I mean are these people completely relying on outside sources to learn to play the game. I might be in the minority but i like to 'learn' how to play the game by 'playing' the game and not having it scripted to me by someone outside! it happened to last week on makeb doing the weekly [toboros courtyard] where you kill the golden fury "boss droid". The ops leader kept spamming 'oh make sure you check online for tactics blah, blah, blah' i dropped group because i can't stand that. I found another group recently that needed a tank, now my tank is in full 69 gear augmented and i've got over 38k health, and i've also tanked every boss, in every FP, Op, world boss fight there is I know how to tank. just give me the basics and i'll be fine! I don't need /want to have to tab out of a game to learn how to play it! I can learn to play the game from playing the game! (wow what a concept!) oh and btw for those that don't know how easy that fight is here let me explain it!

Spoiler
This is not an overly complex mechanic! and definately easily explained in chat in game.

If you're the type of player who wants to be given everything, doesn't like surprises and wants to have your hand held throughout the entire game (and unfortunately there are people like that) then go ahead go to the website and spoil everything for yourself. But there's no content in this game that a decent player can't figure out through playing it a couple of times or just with a few tips typed in through chat.

paowee's Avatar


paowee
05.06.2013 , 11:24 AM | #2
We're you guys using voice comm? Much easier to say that out than type it down too
Myabe the raid leader was busy spamming or trying to recruit people. During that downtime it may be a good idea to do a quick alt tab while the guy who is organizing that raid, well, is busy organizing that raid. When I pug HM raids, I always make it a point to ask if the person has done it before. If not I, i then "suggest" to watch a video or read up on dulfy while i'm spamming the fleet looking for more people. Is that the case in the raid group you were in?
Republic < Intrepid > The Harbinger slinger sage vanguard dps
swtorboard.org dps blog.class guides.end-game stuff
16 man | 8 man DPS leaderboards | Galactic Starfighter Records

manco-capac's Avatar


manco-capac
05.06.2013 , 11:33 AM | #3
If we're talking about boss fights on operations and such, while pugging, is a fair expection that if you havent done that fight before you at least read the tactics.
Dont see anything wrong with that.

And you don't want to read it on a web page (which already has been made) but you expect someelse to type it all that for you to read ? I just don't get this. Honestly.

There are some guilds that specifically ask people to not read tactics from guides, because they like figuring things out while playing, learning the mechanics and making strategies as they go. That's perfectly valid. But we're talking about a guild with a specific goal in mind.

When you're pugging, have the decency to read the tacts before you go in there. And seriously, why someone else has to type stuff for you to save yourself from alt-tab ?

Astarica's Avatar


Astarica
05.06.2013 , 11:34 AM | #4
Usually the guys who say 'look it up' don't really know how to do it themselves.

Frog_brains's Avatar


Frog_brains
05.06.2013 , 11:45 AM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Astarica View Post
Usually the guys who say 'look it up' don't really know how to do it themselves.
i think that's most of it! they don't want to explain it and take the responsibility for the wipe if it goes wrong. The thing i'm saying is that, they're asking you to look up the fight that isn't even that complicated! I mean what's so hard about typing when the aoe, thrash, knockback etc happens go click here, or kill the adds or whatever. Im not saying if it's a super complicated fight not to do some research first, but what's wrong with peer learning? even if you've watched the tactics online it doesn't mean success the first time you actually do it in game. Watching and playing aren't the same

paowee's Avatar


paowee
05.06.2013 , 11:58 AM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by Frog_brains View Post
i think that's most of it! they don't want to explain it and take the responsibility for the wipe if it goes wrong. The thing i'm saying is that, they're asking you to look up the fight that isn't even that complicated! I mean what's so hard about typing when the aoe, thrash, knockback etc happens go click here, or kill the adds or whatever. Im not saying if it's a super complicated fight not to do some research first, but what's wrong with peer learning? even if you've watched the tactics online it doesn't mean success the first time you actually do it in game. Watching and playing aren't the same
There's

1. Watching the fight
2. Peer learning (like you said)

The most preferable choice, to reduce the risk of wipes, so that people can get back RL and finish their agenda in game is as fast as they can is

3. Watching / reading AND peer learning.

The raid leader is already going to "peer teach you." It's going to help, even if just a little bit--for everyone's sake, especially for those who have cleared it before and want to get back to their other responsibilities, if those who have no idea how the fight goes alt-tabs and do some light reading while the raid leader organizes the raid.

It sounds like you are in a pick-up group. Pick up groups have a LOT of downtime. During which people mostly semi-afk, alt tab, take a water or bio break, and in your case, you could have probably do a quick alt-tab for some light surfing :P. Like you said the leader is already going to peer teach you (and everyone else for that matter). He is going to call out what made or caused some wipes, maybe type something in chat very quick when a major mechanic is about to happen, he/she also took the time to organize the said PUG---- and all one has to do is maybe get into mox or voice comm, if not then do a quick research while the PUG readies itself up.
Republic < Intrepid > The Harbinger slinger sage vanguard dps
swtorboard.org dps blog.class guides.end-game stuff
16 man | 8 man DPS leaderboards | Galactic Starfighter Records

manco-capac's Avatar


manco-capac
05.06.2013 , 12:01 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by Frog_brains View Post
I mean what's so hard about typing when the aoe, thrash, knockback etc happens go click here, or kill the adds or whatever.
Why do you want someone else to type something that has already been typed, probably much better worded, better formatted than what you can possibly do on ops chat ? What makes ops chat text much better than guides that are proven useful ?

If you can't be arsed by reading something in a web page, why someelse should be arsed to indulge you ?

Quote: Originally Posted by Frog_brains View Post
even if you've watched the tactics online it doesn't mean success the first time you actually do it in game. Watching and playing aren't the same
That has nothing to do with this. Of course, specific group compositions, gear, etc will change everytime. Otherwise everybody would have gotten EC NiM on farm after the first week after tacts were release.
Yes, online guides aren't a guarantee. Nobdy said that. But neither is ops chat. Main difference is, in one case you can learn the basics of the fight in your own time, the second requires someone to type it for you and waste everybody else's time.

Seireeni's Avatar


Seireeni
05.06.2013 , 12:18 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by manco-capac View Post
Why do you want someone else to type something that has already been typed, probably much better worded, better formatted than what you can possibly do on ops chat ? What makes ops chat text much better than guides that are proven useful ?.
I actually find it more easy to learn if I read the tactic at the same time as I look at the surroundings where the fight will happen. Instead of "there will be a random shield at place x" you can look at the area and think "oh, the shield is going to be just there, next to that rock!". I hear there's going to be aoe that has to be dodged, I can already think where to stand and where to dodge it without messing anything up. Not to mention that you get the strategy just before the boss, so you most likely don't confuse it with the strategies of the other bosses.
Of course, the same situation can be achieved if you read the strategy to that boss just before the fight, but that would also mean the group has to wait. So it's either that the group does nothing while you read or someone from the group explains the boss, and at least I don't mind explaining the strategies in most of the fights.
There is a face beneath this mask but it's not me.
Red Eclipse - And a few other servers too - The Firslay Legacy

NoFishing's Avatar


NoFishing
05.06.2013 , 12:29 PM | #9
Oh look, it's this thread again.

So, having someone type out in ops chat the mechanics ("just give me the basics", "what's so hard about typing...") of a fight works for you. But the same person asking you to go read what dulfy has written on the same fight is off limits? Even though you could certainly find and skim what she has written in about 2 minutes, freeing everyone else up to go grab a quick bio and a drink. Yep, perfectly logical and reasonable argument you make here. /sarcasm.

NoFishing's Avatar


NoFishing
05.06.2013 , 12:39 PM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by Seireeni View Post
Of course, the same situation can be achieved if you read the strategy to that boss just before the fight, but that would also mean the group has to wait. So it's either that the group does nothing while you read or someone from the group explains the boss, and at least I don't mind explaining the strategies in most of the fights.
The group either waits while you go read something already written about the fight.....or they wait while someone types out the mechanics for the umpteenth time because people can't be asked to go read something outside of the game.

We don't mind explaining mechanics in voice chat (and you will be invited to our guild's voice chat if you are joining us as a PuG, and strongly encouraged to join if you have not done the fights before). Because it is faster, clearer, and you can be reminded of upcoming phases during the fight. But if you force me to type them out, the entirety of the instructions you are going to get are "don't suck". If I'm charitable, and you are a tank, you might get "tank sunder, don't let him catch you or anyone else, CD on The End....and don't suck!"