Why rise of the Hutt Cartel is a failure

I think they were saying that MMORPGS are not RPGS in the strictest sense, and they are right. Ive yet to see a MMORPG allow you complete and total control over what your character does like a real RPG. Real RPGS are pen and pencil tabletop games where ya buddies and you get together and play a character. That will never happen in a true MMO, the devs couldn't be omniscient enough to be able to write that game. MMORPG is more of a fantasy genre (fantasy in the general state of having a fantasy) where you can become someone else for a bit and have some basic control over what a character does (physically for the most part) and do stuff you could never do, whether its fighting zombies, killing sith or jedi or fighting the forces of Mordor.

That is so much my opinion of RPers mostly. I play my story in my head, and sometimes talk about it with my buddies, but to rp it in-game, when so many lore-monkeys just love to jump down someone's throat for any small discrepancy, no thanks.

Yeah all RP games are plagued with people playing characters completely alien to the lore. Ironically I think I've seen as much Star Wars based RP in Champions Online as I have in TOR.

Why ignore the story? That's simple. The story makes every player character the Chosen One. That's boring and does not lend itself to a multi character story.

I guess we probably will see more MMO's with a story-focus, as many would have likely been in development with the assumption that they would have to compete with the massive hit that TOR was expected to be. Don't expect to see it in any that are starting from scratch since the launch and underwhelming performance of TOR kind of proves it's not money well spent.

You're making a basic complaint about the whole genre that is completely out of touch with reality. We don't have the technology to handle what you suggested... so you basically made a really bad statement lacking in forethought.

And, I don't care if you were talking to someone else... when you post on the forums, it's fodder for all, not just for that guy. If you wanted to keep it between you and the other person, should have taken it to PM's. It doesn't matter how polite it is, when you make open forum posts, you're standing on your little soap box for all to hear.

And when I hear stuff such as:
I have to stop you and ask you, "Do you actually think about what you're saying before you say it? You're critiquing a genre (specifically ToR here) as if you know better."

Ironically, you're little post of your "polite discussion" started with you butting in to 2 other people's convo... according to your understanding of how forum posts go. If that's the case, then, "Hi Pot. Nice to meet you. I'm Kettle!"

Until you can get some super AI that can be a GM moderator in a persistent world... this will never happen. Being right in the strictest sense is silly when applying it to a computer game. It's obvious that you can't do everything you so desire in a game. Even in ToR, you simply can't land anywhere you want on the planet... you can't even sit in any seat you desire. What the person was saying was obvious, but what's the point? This game will never become a pen-and-pencil RPG where you can literally say and do anything you want.

Except that Lord British's new mmo just got funding and hasn't even gone into development yet And I wouldn't count SWTOR out yet. Its basically been mismanagement not bad development. If BW had been allowed to keep the game another year, woulda likely been way better, but EA wanted their money and released it anyway. Then BW's lack of understanding of MMOS stepped in, at launch, adding servers was a bad idea. They shoulda just had the servers they had, and we would have not been in the mess they have been trying to fix since. The lack of a rename and server transfer, those are considered mainstay's of the industry these days. Its not the story that hurt SWTOR its EA's overhanded management strategy and BW's lack of experience.

The very fact that I see a ton of threads on the forum decrying the lack of continued class arcs and companion arcs kinda tells me that the players want more story.

This game is terrible for "those people". I've never seen such a hostile and elitist crowd in any other game. They can be fun to annoy though.

Fun tip that really annoys Star Wars lore Nazis:

- Ask what a Mandolorian is, when they explain it say "Oh. So they are Star Wars-ified Klingons!"

I guess the point is, you started an argument that wasn't needed. I was trying to clarify that. No MMO can ever be as freeform as a pen and pencil game, period. SWTOR, Champions, LOTRO, WoW, none have that ability, and until you get said AI, none ever will, so why start arguing the point with him in the first place when all he was saying was that MMO's cannot be true RPG's.

I see that as more of an indication of what matters to the people who stayed, not the 75-90% who left in the first three months before any novelty in the stories would have gotten old.

And for once, I agree with ya hell the race of Mandalorians died out way way in the past. Its a culture now, not a race.

But yeah, this IP has so much canon, near-canon, "out right not canon" written about it, its funny to see some folks spout stuff off. Hell, Lucas once said himself that he thinks the books are awesome, but he will ignore them if he ever writes a new story. I supect Disney will too. God I hope so...hate the Yuuzong Vong, the flip-flop dark/light side of the twins, and the constant and complete ineffectiveness of Luke. And hated the