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Selecting need for loot


Beaunidle's Avatar


Beaunidle
03.20.2013 , 09:17 AM | #381
Quote: Originally Posted by cidbahamut View Post
Here's the other side of that scenario:
I run through a flashpoint on my Sorc and no Sorc gear drops. There's some sweet gear upgrades for Khem that drop, but I'm not allowed to take them so I walk away from the flashpoint completely empty-handed.
That's how it goes sometimes, tough luck.

If there was Heavy Str/End gear dropping it means you had at least 1 Juggernaut in the group who can use it on his/her actual character. By rights and common convention it's theirs unless they chose not to roll for it. You couldn't have seen the "sweet gear for Khem" drop if it wasn't for that group member being there.

Ratajack's Avatar


Ratajack
03.20.2013 , 09:18 AM | #382
Quote: Originally Posted by Risq View Post
Hmmm, that's not what I get I guess.

If you're character is there, and is healing as a Commando for example, and you see some gear that drops with Cunning on it. You can't immediately put it on and heal better to continue helping the group. At best you suddenly heal worse.

But if you have a healing Companion that uses it "they" might heal better.

Here's another way of looking at it. Most everyone would like to gear their companions better. And if given the chance would do so. But if you roll need on it, they assume you're actually going to wear it on the character your playing with.

Other wise everyone should know up front you're rolling need for your companion so that "they" can roll need for their companions as well.

If you don't say "I'm rolling need for my companions" and then you do, you've robbed them of a chance to also roll need for their companions.

That's where the idea of ninja'ing loot comes from.
This is where the root of the problem lies. What happens when you assume? If people took a couple of minutes before the run begins and decide as a group how loot will be divided, there would be no need to make assumptions. If the group does not agree on loot rules, then if you choose to roll greed, you may lose to someone rolling need. Losing a roll is not ninja'ing.

SWGEvictee's Avatar


SWGEvictee
03.20.2013 , 09:18 AM | #383
Quote: Originally Posted by Jedlosson View Post
How hard can this be to understand?

If your character needs it, select NEED
If your companion needs it or you intend to vendor the item, select GREED
If you do not want the item to spam your inventory, select PASS

If you do not accept this social convention, good luck finding a group after a while, you are gonna be in most peoples' ignore list.
The fact that you are putting placing the item on a companion thereby benefiting my ability to proceed through leveling content at the same level as someone who merely wants to vendor it off.

Until end game content is reached player character and companions should take precedence over vendoring off an item.

Icestar's Avatar


Icestar
03.20.2013 , 09:20 AM | #384
Interesting to see this discussed here aswell, we have several threads discussing this topic in the Flashpoints, Operations, and Heroic Missions forum.

Anyway, all Bioware has to do is change the lootsystem to a common sense one, like many successful MMOs has done and this kind of problems will go away.

The community does not seem to benefit from a anarchy lootsystem, it needs to be changed so items that drop ends up with the character that can equip and benefit from the stats. They already have made it halfway with bosses only dropping loot that can be used by the different classes in the team, why not go all the way?

Anyway after reading thousands of posts regarding this topic, I am still astonished that Bioware has not commented even one time regarding this. They ask for player feedback, the loot distrubution threads contain lots of it

ZionHalcyon's Avatar


ZionHalcyon
03.20.2013 , 09:20 AM | #385
Quote: Originally Posted by SWGEvictee View Post
so what I'm taking from all this is that if I dare to hold a differing opinion I am a jerk and should merely sit quietly and accept uncivil behavior toward me even though I did not attack anyone with my initial statements.

And I am a hypocrit for being upset about you being upset that I dare to hold a differing opinion.

Really?
No, not really. What you should take from this is that there are people all over with varying different opinions, and yours is no more special than anyone elses, and if you decide to share an opinion that goes against the social norm then you should expect some push back. What makes you a hypocrite is criticizing others for their opinions while behaving like yours should be above critique - and THAT is what makes you an epic, selfish jerk.

Risq's Avatar


Risq
03.20.2013 , 09:21 AM | #386
Quote: Originally Posted by cidbahamut View Post
Here's the other side of that scenario:
I run through a flashpoint on my Sorc and no Sorc gear drops. There's some sweet gear upgrades for Khem that drop, but I'm not allowed to take them so I walk away from the flashpoint completely empty-handed.
No, never said that and most folks aren't suggesting that you "do" that.

What I'm saying, and not sure if I've stated correctly, is if you want it for a Companion just say "Hey that would work on Khem I'm rolling need on it" , and then someone else who has a companion who can wear the same gear may say "Hey that would also work on Lt Pierce for my Juggernaut" and then they roll need as well.

That way "both" of you have an equal chance at getting it for your companion.

Otherwise the one who rolls Greed for his companion is hosed because when you roll need you are guaranteed to get it no matter what over them.

But if you're defending your right to not say "anything at all" and then need roll, and afterwards defend your right to have done that, that's just wrong. That defense just keeps everyone else from getting a equal chance at gear because a roll at 1 of "Need" beats a roll of 100 at "Greed" every time.

Or you could just tell everyone at the start of the run to role need on everything and only abstain if you don't want anything. That also works.

But players who roll need for companions without telling why shouldn't be surprised when others won't play or group with them when they do this.

If you want to be fair just tell everyone what you're doing, don't stealth do it (not saying you are, but using the royal we and you).
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Squadrons: 367 238 xx

Lostpenguins's Avatar


Lostpenguins
03.20.2013 , 09:25 AM | #387
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
This is where the root of the problem lies. What happens when you assume? If people took a couple of minutes before the run begins and decide as a group how loot will be divided, there would be no need to make assumptions. If the group does not agree on loot rules, then if you choose to roll greed, you may lose to someone rolling need. Losing a roll is not ninja'ing.
There's always going to be assumptions in this game, as there are in RL. Do you assume that a dps knows to try and not pull aggro off the tank? Do you assume someone in a group finder who is a healer knows that their primary job is to heal the group? Or do you ask them that as well? Do you assume when you write something in English that they speak English and can understand you?

There's going to be common assumptions in this game. Loot rules are basically that way. Hopefully the OP gets it now. Secondary is whether he agrees or not. Etiquette doesn't require agreement, only compliance.

cidbahamut's Avatar


cidbahamut
03.20.2013 , 09:26 AM | #388
Quote: Originally Posted by Lostpenguins View Post
It doesn't matter if it benefits you better with leveling. Your companion did nothing in the flashpoint, therefore your companion gets no priority on loot. I just find it funny that you want to take group-earned loot, take it, and use it in a way that only benefits solo play. Rather silly.
If someone acquires a single piece of gear from an entire run, why do you care if it gets equipped to a companion instead of to a player character? It's not your loot, so why would you feel so strongly about how a player uses it?

ZionHalcyon's Avatar


ZionHalcyon
03.20.2013 , 09:30 AM | #389
Quote: Originally Posted by cidbahamut View Post
If someone acquires a single piece of gear from an entire run, why do you care if it gets equipped to a companion instead of to a player character? It's not your loot, so why would you feel so strongly about how a player uses it?
Because the impact of that gear profoundly affects a player more than a companion - as I said in an earlier post, PRESENCE stat affects comps much more than gear does, and you can get comp gear suitable to your level just by doing quests.

There is no statistical reason to gear comps from flashpoints. Socially, its a slap in the face if someone rolls need on something for their comp that you can use on your main toon.

You don't have to agree, you don't have to like it, you just have to understand that IS the social norm expected when grouping and if you deviate from that then prepare to be blacklisted - if people put you on ignore, you won't be paired with them any further. Enough people put you on ignore, well, get used to some VERY long flashpoint queue times.

Lostpenguins's Avatar


Lostpenguins
03.20.2013 , 09:33 AM | #390
Quote: Originally Posted by cidbahamut View Post
If someone acquires a single piece of gear from an entire run, why do you care if it gets equipped to a companion instead of to a player character? It's not your loot, so why would you feel so strongly about how a player uses it?
If the loot could have gone to someone else's toon but another user took it to equip their companion, that's not right. "How a player uses it" is not an excuse. If I roll need on everything so that I can vendor it all, that also falls under the "not your loot, so why would you feel so strongly about how a player uses it" argument.

The general consensus of the MMO community is that gear must be a direct benefit to your character. With TOR, that has extended to your toon and does not include your companion as many of us look at them as pets. They may be an extension of the character's toon, but they're not the toon, else you could bring them everywhere you go, but it's obvious you can't. Therefore, the belief of "must be a direct benefit to your character" does not apply to companions as it doesn't affect all aspects of the character.

Seriously, if you want loot for solo play, go solo the content to get the loot. The people who group will group to allow the loot to go to the group.