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Selecting need for loot


CelCawdro's Avatar


CelCawdro
03.19.2013 , 01:13 PM | #301
And to make my own stance known - if someone winds up needing on something that would have been of use to another member of the party, I stop pulling and simply ask, "Why?" Sometimes they were simply new to the game. Sometimes they just apologize profusely and promise not to do it again (as they were aware of what they were doing). Some simply say nothing and charge headlong into the next pack, solo. I've never actually encountered someone needing for a companion, although if I did, I would simply ask them to ask before they roll next time. And then if they fail to do so, use the game mechanics provided to deal with the situation.

Ratajack's Avatar


Ratajack
03.19.2013 , 01:19 PM | #302
Quote: Originally Posted by Lostpenguins View Post
I'm going to stop you right there. Companions are an integral part to A PART of the game. And that's really solo play.

But are they integral to FP's? No. FP's were designed for group content, which is 4 players. When 4 players are grouped, you cannot summon companions. Thus, if companions take a back seat during group play, then the same goes for loot for them as well. In fact, you can't queue for the LFG tool WITHOUT 3 other players, thereby the LFG is putting you into a system where, once again, your companion takes a back seat.

Operations are larger group play and you can't even summon a companion during operations. So, by extension, no loot for companions.

You cannot assume that your solo play gives you priority for loot that is obtained in a group setting. If so, then it can be easily justifiable for someone to take an item as they "need the credits" to sell it to buy better upgrades for their character on the GTN. Yet, that's a clearly a greed roll even though it's just as justifiable according to your statements.

If you want to use that loot for solo play, then solo those instances.

In the end, you and I clearly believe the other person is wrong. And that's fine. I'll go back to my original point: It doesn't matter how you feel here. You're in the minority and if you choose to act the way you seem to feel, then you're just setting yourself up to be ostracized by the community. And that's that.
I can queue in the LFG as a solo player, in a group of two, in a group of 3 or even in a group of 4. I have used the LFG tool in each of those situations.

Is solo play not a part of the game? That would make companions an integral part of the game, maybe not the entire game, but an integral part of the game, nonetheless.

The PLAYER and not the character or the companion helped to produce that loot and therefore has the right to roll however he see fit.

CelCawdro's Avatar


CelCawdro
03.19.2013 , 01:22 PM | #303
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
I can queue in the LFG as a solo player, in a group of two, in a group of 3 or even in a group of 4. I have used the LFG tool in each of those situations.

Is solo play not a part of the game? That would make companions an integral part of the game, maybe not the entire game, but an integral part of the game, nonetheless.

The PLAYER and not the character or the companion helped to produce that loot and therefore has the right to roll however he see fit.
And again, as the game provides that option, you are entitled to that right. As long as you also know that you are subject to another game-presented option that is the right of the rest of the group to exercise.

Lostpenguins's Avatar


Lostpenguins
03.19.2013 , 01:26 PM | #304
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
I can queue in the LFG as a solo player, in a group of two, in a group of 3 or even in a group of 4. I have used the LFG tool in each of those situations.

Is solo play not a part of the game? That would make companions an integral part of the game, maybe not the entire game, but an integral part of the game, nonetheless.

The PLAYER and not the character or the companion helped to produce that loot and therefore has the right to roll however he see fit.
Um, you can queue solo, but you're definitely not solo'ing the instance. You're waiting for 3 other people to queue with you. It's a group effort to uses the LFG tool. Because if no one else on the server clicks the LFG tool, then you can never do it "solo". That's a really bad way to try to spin solo into the LFG tool...

And companions may be an integral part of the game, but you could do this entire game w/out using a companion. It's harder, but doable. If you can solo the gear that drops in FP's with just a companion, then you're more than welcome to needing all the loot. You can't just justify taking gear for solo play earned through group effort.

Emencie's Avatar


Emencie
03.19.2013 , 01:32 PM | #305
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
There's no extreme verbiage that I'm aware of. I simply used a real life situation in which "social convention" was used as justification for taking away another person's rights. Isn't that what is happening with regards to loot? People expect the "social convention" of need is for character only to trump another person's right to roll on loot he helped produce. In addition, people are threatening consequences if someone actually has the stones to stand up for their rights and roll need. I've seen mention of consequences ranging from the offending party being yelled at and insulted to being "named and shamed" on fleet in the hopes that no one will group with the offending party.
By that logic... we should all roll need on everything. Every single person can use ever single drop in the game weather for companions or selling. And every single person in a group helped produce the loot that was dropped.

ZionHalcyon's Avatar


ZionHalcyon
03.19.2013 , 01:33 PM | #306
Quote: Originally Posted by Taminy View Post
I haven't heard one "need for companions" player state they have the balls to ask if the group is ok with it before clicking need. This seems more like the type of thing someone does and hopes no one cares or notices but if caught they try to justify it after the fact.

If you want to need for companions, say up front and let others need for their companions too.
Agreed. I have never, NEVER had an issue with people needing for comps AS LONG AS they ask first, and don't go against the group and roll need anyway when someone says "No, I need that for my main".

If a person wants to solo play, you can do that 1-50 without flashpoints and get all the gear you and your comp need for that in quests and off the GTN. Flashpoints are designed for Group Play, and if you don't play nice in groups, then don't expect people who do to tolerate that crap.

BobaScott's Avatar


BobaScott
03.19.2013 , 01:38 PM | #307
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
There's no extreme verbiage that I'm aware of. I simply used a real life situation in which "social convention" was used as justification for taking away another person's rights. Isn't that what is happening with regards to loot?
Not even close. To compare someone's real life tragedy to social politeness in a video game is out of bounds.

Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
People expect the "social convention" of need is for character only to trump another person's right to roll on loot he helped produce. In addition, people are threatening consequences if someone actually has the stones to stand up for their rights and roll need. I've seen mention of consequences ranging from the offending party being yelled at and insulted to being "named and shamed" on fleet in the hopes that no one will group with the offending party.
These consequences you mention are within the same rights you are affording a loot ninja. They include the right to vote kick them out and to warn others of these offenders. While I have seen the former a few times, I have never seen someone outed in general chat. Not saying it doesn't happen, but it is much more rare if it does. Besides, how would anyone know when a warning is sandwiched in a thousand jaws jokes, insults and LFG calls? Not sure how to yell at someone unless they are in voice chat. Otherwise it is just caps lock. How is any of this to compare with the real life stuff you mentioned?

SWGEvictee's Avatar


SWGEvictee
03.19.2013 , 01:41 PM | #308
eIMO players mainly do the low level flashpoints to get the gear that drops in them to enhance their ability to play the rest of the game while leveling. Gear that directly benefits them in progressing through the game whether it's worn by them or their companion should be able to be rolled on. Not something they would only strip a single mod out of or vendor, but something immediately able to be worn and used by them in the entirety of their game at that level.

End game is another story completely. From that point on a companion gas no role in advancing through the gear tiers and thusly no one should roll need on and end piece of gear for a companion.

That is what I was saying earlier before things devolved into a snipe fest.

cidbahamut's Avatar


cidbahamut
03.19.2013 , 02:01 PM | #309
Quote: Originally Posted by SWGEvictee View Post
eIMO players mainly do the low level flashpoints to get the gear that drops in them to enhance their ability to play the rest of the game while leveling. Gear that directly benefits them in progressing through the game whether it's worn by them or their companion should be able to be rolled on. Not something they would only strip a single mod out of or vendor, but something immediately able to be worn and used by them in the entirety of their game at that level.

End game is another story completely. From that point on a companion gas no role in advancing through the gear tiers and thusly no one should roll need on and end piece of gear for a companion.

That is what I was saying earlier before things devolved into a snipe fest.
That and the fact that endgame gear distribution would result in massive drama even if companions didn't exist.

HakkaP's Avatar


HakkaP
03.19.2013 , 02:04 PM | #310
Okay OP think about it this way.

What if everyone rolls like you do? You would have 3-4 players rolling "need" on every good drop. It would make it really hard to get anything for your character

How long have you been playing? For your sake stop doing it, or you will find it very hard to find groups in the future. The game is easy as it is. You dont need your comps to have superb gear.

Need for character, greed for companions. End of story.

Want to boost through a flashpoint? Ask your guildmates or real friends.