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Developer Update: Overview of the Planet Makeb

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Developer Update: Overview of the Planet Makeb
First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

Twickers's Avatar


Twickers
03.12.2013 , 12:43 AM | #91
I'm just going to pop in to say that open world PVP area idea didn't work very well, the endless waves of QQ made it pretty clear that people HATED the idea and I cant say I don't disagree, as I got QUITE tired of getting into groups for the heroic 4 and people were flagged, so whilst healing them I ended up getting flagged and at risk for PVP which I have zero interest in, and a LOT of people now have a very negative reputation on shadowlands for greifing people during the event as well as some guilds.

Overall I would recommend not trying this sort of thing again.
The loneliest people are the KINDEST, the saddest people smile the BRIGHTEST, the most damaged people are the WISEST, ALL because they do not wish to see another soul suffer the same way they did. - Author Unknown

Krorne's Avatar


Krorne
03.12.2013 , 12:44 AM | #92
Quote: Originally Posted by CourtneyWoods View Post
Hey TUXs,

Unfortunately, I don't think Makeb quite fits your specific requests. As I stated previously, it offers similar open world PvP to other same faction planets in our game.

I would be curious to hear your thoughts on the Relics of the Gree event. This was definitely a step forward for us in creating an event which had incentives for Open World PvP.

As Chuixupu said, something like what you were describing would be something we would definitely have an announcement around and we have no information right now on any systems like that for Makeb.
Courtney,

Thank you for taking the time to post in the forums. I and many others really appreciate when you and the community team do so. However, I will reserve the right to disagree with your statement about the Gree event taking a step forward in terms of open world PvP. While the daily's themselves were entertaining and profitable (world boss looks cool--haven't done it yet), this is not the PvP we're looking for..... I stated in another forum of the apparent disconnect of what open world PvP is---between what BioWare thinks vs. what many PvP folks expect (sorry, but we do not want PvE mixed with our PvP). Quite frankly, keep it simple--give us PvP XP for killing opposite faction (similar to what was once on Ilum), regardless of the planet period. I garantee you that the PvP community at large will take care of the rest.

While the Ilum "project" was a noble effort, I feel that you guys simply put too much thought (and time) into this aspect, given all of the other technical asperations/challenges you all had at launch. Doing the simple thing would have given you guys time to add more substance to PvP later on down the road (PvP objectives, true battle grounds, bounty-hunting--yeah I know . Oh well just my two cents, hope this isn't taken as an attack.

On a positive note, the changes on the PTS thus far for 2.0 are excellent. But please for the sake of the PvP community and even those with the slightest of interest, please, please, please, have the dev team move open world PvP up on "the big wall of crazy." Currently WZ's (though a nice diversion) & Ilum are not going to hold the complete interest of PvP centric folks....... Thanks for your time...........
KRORNE GALAXY [AzM]
Steward of Azalus
Su Bunky Dunko

Laurreth's Avatar


Laurreth
03.12.2013 , 02:40 AM | #93
Quote: Originally Posted by CourtneyWoods View Post

I would be curious to hear your thoughts on the Relics of the Gree event. This was definitely a step forward for us in creating an event which had incentives for Open World PvP.
I thought it was good, and I'd actually hoped that you'd leave some daily quests on the planet to lure people there.

Still, things were sometimes rather lame, even on a PvP server. Maybe it was because of the whole thing (i.e., Jar'kai Sword) being a German server, but we quickly had a culture of mostly peaceful queueing in the central dome.

Still, having such a focused area where interactions were more likely was surely exciting, and I guess with the Treaty of Coruscant still d****** (seriously, the profanity filter is bananas) its flimsy cloth over the whole matter, not beating each other up on first sight is not entirely incompatible with the setting.

Ultimately, I don't think truly "open" PvP would work in this game (for performance-, balance-, and some other even more basic reasons), but having opportunities to casually meet up and beat the snot out of each other makes things far more exciting, and since people won't really do that without a numerical incentive, I'd very much love to see more of those events.
Rüstige Rentner auf Jar'Kai Sword — schau einfach mal rein ☺
“I like how the whining about "censored" butts started instantly but it took 2 days for someone to notice the legs are also ****ed up” — rantboi

Octom's Avatar


Octom
03.12.2013 , 03:18 AM | #94
Quote: Originally Posted by CourtneyWoods View Post
I would be curious to hear your thoughts on the Relics of the Gree event. This was definitely a step forward for us in creating an event which had incentives for Open World PvP.
There were 0 incentives. You received NOTHING from killing another player. Handing over warzone commendations for completing a mission no different than any other simply because of it's location was also wrong from the stance of game design. I now have hundreds of warzone commendations on characters with 0 Valor and attained them on days where I never had to kill another player.

All the PvP area of the Gree event did was add (in great numbers) to the black list of members our guild won't play with. You created problems and hatred and forced most of us to simply rule that mission out as one to be tackled daily.

Those that enjoyed slaughtering others who didn't want to be there in the first place gained absolutely nothing from it - no valor, no commendations for kills, no gear tokens, no nothing worth their time. Simply queuing and leaving Ilum is far better time spent for anyone who cares about PvP. Forcing PvP on those who didn't want it was extremely unpopular, and you didn't even reward those who took advantage of it.
Quote: Originally Posted by AdamChattaway View Post
doe snot

LarryRow's Avatar


LarryRow
03.12.2013 , 07:54 AM | #95
Quote: Originally Posted by CourtneyWoods View Post
I would be curious to hear your thoughts on the Relics of the Gree event. This was definitely a step forward for us in creating an event which had incentives for Open World PvP.
First, the good:
1. I could tell you guys put some serious effort into optimizing Ilum for large skirmishes. Very smooth performance relative to what I was used to.
2. Your genuine attempt to make interesting OW-PvP was appreciated.

The bad:
1. FFA PvP is just not how people envision OW-PvP in a star wars game.
2. Not being able to tell who was grouped or on what faction was confusing and irritating.
3. Not worth the time invested, even for pvp fans, if you wanted to complete the mission and progress the character.

In the future, I think OW-PvP should incorporate the following:
1. Faction vs faction
2. An objective to fight over that can only be enjoyed by one side at a time (e.g., faction buff)
3. A mechanism to keep the sides even or fairly even. I think a queue to get in would be best.

I want to fight the other faction. I want something worthwhile to fight over where I'm not incentivized to kill trade. I want the fight to be fair. The above three constraints satisfy these three conditions.

Thanks for taking feedback!
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CharlesBoyd's Avatar


CharlesBoyd
03.12.2013 , 02:37 PM | #96 Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread. Next  
Quote: Originally Posted by xorcist View Post
One problem I am concerned with is, from the looks of it. The planet Makeb seems to be way over populated with human species. Meaning human NPC's. Who if any are the native dominating sentient species? Is there one?
Hi Xorcist,

While there is no native sentient species on Makeb, the planet's flora and fauna are quite unique and exotic, and the sentient population is definitely not exclusively human. Twi'leks, Zabraks, Nikto, Weequay, and many other species make their home on Makeb.

Thanks for your question!
Charles Boyd | Lead Writer

CharlesBoyd's Avatar


CharlesBoyd
03.12.2013 , 03:51 PM | #97 This is the last staff post in this thread.  
Quote: Originally Posted by Costello View Post
You bring up the story as covered in chapters prologue to 3 and it is clear that the Imperial stories are for the most part pointless. No matter what choices the Warrior, Inquisitor, Agent and Bounty hunter have made they are losing, with the players being the hero of the new age they are shown as not being up to the task of those that have come before.

So with that in mind what is being done to allow for the Imperial Player choices to have an effect on the galaxy and the story of the old republic. What lies in store for Imperial players who so far have seen very little other than in fighting and pointless story arcs that are unwritten in the Republic story arcs? When will the Empire strike back or will Rise of the Hutt Cartel be nothing more than pointless running around tomb raiding for the Empire players which will end up going no where.
Hi Costello,

I would disagree with the assertion that Imperial players' actions were pointless. While the Empire as a whole is in a tough position at the start of Rise of the Hutt Cartel, it's likely that they'd have been completely obliterated without the actions of the Imperial players who eliminated a number of massive threats both internal and external. Without the players, it would be impossible to act on the opportunities Makeb presents, and if the Empire is indeed going to strike back, it will only be accomplished through the leadership and battle prowess of the players.
Charles Boyd | Lead Writer

dsapp's Avatar


dsapp
03.12.2013 , 07:30 PM | #98
Quote: Originally Posted by phalczen View Post
Don't equate "objectives" and "incentives." Also, open world PvP means something a little different to everyone. I think of it as when pvp can happen in the regular game world, not in a timed instance that you get teleported to and from. But just because its happening in the regular game world doesn't mean it can't be objective based, or incentivized, or both. I'll use Star Wars Galaxies as a comparison, since TUX would be familiar with it and can agree or disagree with my comparisons. I considered Restuss to be a form of open world pvp ... it had timed events (dropships, the Emperor's Hand spawn) and quests that could be completed easier when your faction controlled the ruins. But it was all happening in real time, not in an isolated "instance" and what happened in Restuss in many ways changed the dynamics of the faction conflicts for hours or even days. The battle itself was not scripted or objective based. It was the same with the static bases. Furthermore, battles in any of these zones often led to smaller skirmishes with starport hopping, with pvp going on for hours and hours waxing and waning. I wouldn't consider these zones as "free form" but they provided a tinder that fueled a larger fire in subsequent hours that was truly pvp for the sake of fun, even though there were some incentives.
From what I just read about Restuss, it reminds me of Wintergrasp somewhat. And from what I can tell, there were objectives. However, that isn't necessarily Open World PvP. It's more of an Open World Battleground. Open World PvP happens in places that aren't specifically set up for PvP. That particular area was specifically set up to be made for PvP. The same goes for Wintergrasp in WoW. You had one defending the keep and one attacking. It happened every couple of hours and whoever won gained many benefits like being able to farm for crystallized elements, run the raid inside of the keep, enable sets of dailies, and gain a 5% faction wide experience bump. However, I wouldn't call that Open World PvP. It's not the same as raiding an opposing faction's city or fighting massive battles in low level areas of the map. To me, THAT is Open World PvP.

Darthdaedric's Avatar


Darthdaedric
03.12.2013 , 09:07 PM | #99
Quote: Originally Posted by CharlesBoyd View Post
Hi Costello,

I would disagree with the assertion that Imperial players' actions were pointless. While the Empire as a whole is in a tough position at the start of Rise of the Hutt Cartel, it's likely that they'd have been completely obliterated without the actions of the Imperial players who eliminated a number of massive threats both internal and external. Without the players, it would be impossible to act on the opportunities Makeb presents, and if the Empire is indeed going to strike back, it will only be accomplished through the leadership and battle prowess of the players.
I disagree. The Republic and Empire characters start on equal ground. Yet the Empire loses every single planet except Taris, Korriban and Dromund Kaas (although the Republic still wins the battle at Dromund Kass).
It's very disheartening that you play through the story and your actions have no consequence because of word of god says your faction sucks.

Presbytier's Avatar


Presbytier
03.12.2013 , 09:18 PM | #100
Quote: Originally Posted by Costello View Post
You bring up the story as covered in chapters prologue to 3 and it is clear that the Imperial stories are for the most part pointless. No matter what choices the Warrior, Inquisitor, Agent and Bounty hunter have made they are losing, with the players being the hero of the new age they are shown as not being up to the task of those that have come before.

So with that in mind what is being done to allow for the Imperial Player choices to have an effect on the galaxy and the story of the old republic. What lies in store for Imperial players who so far have seen very little other than in fighting and pointless story arcs that are unwritten in the Republic story arcs? When will the Empire strike back or will Rise of the Hutt Cartel be nothing more than pointless running around tomb raiding for the Empire players which will end up going no where.
The problem with this assumption is that if it went the other way i could easily make the same argument as you from the Republic's point of view. Someone has to win and someone has to lose; most likely it will be some form of back and forth. Just as the joker said to the Batman" I have a feeling we will be doing this for a long time".
"Being a Jedi will involve making such life and death choices. You'll have to face terrible ordeals. It is very easy to become trapped into a corner with nowhere to go."―Ulic Qel-Droma