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Delta Squad vs. Master Chief


TalonVII's Avatar


TalonVII
02.26.2013 , 01:37 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by Ventessel View Post

I never said blasters were lasers, but rather that their power output seems considerably lower than that of the Covenant weapons. Additionally, MJOLNIR armor can stand up to just as much damage, but likely has better shields.

And the commandos are certainly fast, but the Chief is decidedly super-human. I would pit him against many Jedi in terms of speed, and his armor provides considerable heft and strength augmentation for melee combat. I don't see the Deltas surviving a close encounter with Chief, especially not the ambush he's likely to pull using his motion sensor/radar.
IMO both suits Katarn III and Mjolnir are equal in defensive terms. Also in HUD, radar and other passive systems.

Only thing MJOLNIR has on Katarn is the strength enhancement. In a conventional warfare, i still think the Command squad would take down MC.

Have to remember, both have the same kinds of training, infact a commando is trained in everything the MC has. ONLY edge MC has is his speed and strength.

But to counter that you have 4 just as leathally trained commandos with gear that is just as good, and the tend to have more of it.

IMO simple numbers and tactics take down MC. It's not like MC is going to 1v1 each delta till he kills them all. Remember Clone commandos are trained from birth to be 4 fingers of a fist. They move, live breath as one.

GL trying to get past that. Yes in a 1 on 1 MC mops the floor. 4v1, whole different story.
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Rauzgriz's Avatar


Rauzgriz
02.26.2013 , 01:43 PM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by TalonVII View Post
Yes in a 1 on 1 MC mops the floor. 4v1, whole different story.
Not to mention that delta is more likely to ambush MC, not the other way around, since an ambush is probably easier to set up with 4 than with 1.
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Ventessel's Avatar


Ventessel
02.26.2013 , 03:52 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by Rauzgriz View Post
Not to mention that delta is more likely to ambush MC, not the other way around, since an ambush is probably easier to set up with 4 than with 1.
But the Deltas don't have the Chief's motion detector. And he has Cortana giving him tactical info and analyzing anything he misses.

The Chief's speed and strength, even allowing for the armor to be otherwise equal, will allow him to tear through the Deltas if he ambushes them. Like I said, one or two would die within a second or two of his ambush, and if the others react quickly enough, he'll disengage and circle back later. The radar systems of his suit confer an immense tactical advantage, something that the Deltas just don't have.
The Heir to ChaosAdded Chapter Sixteen-- 17 APR 2013
“People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.” ~ George Orwell

TalonVII's Avatar


TalonVII
02.26.2013 , 05:19 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Ventessel View Post
But the Deltas don't have the Chief's motion detector. And he has Cortana giving him tactical info and analyzing anything he misses.

The Chief's speed and strength, even allowing for the armor to be otherwise equal, will allow him to tear through the Deltas if he ambushes them. Like I said, one or two would die within a second or two of his ambush, and if the others react quickly enough, he'll disengage and circle back later. The radar systems of his suit confer an immense tactical advantage, something that the Deltas just don't have.
Actually they do. If you actually play Republic commando OH yes they do have a motion sensor. Why you can't take totally what KT says, also have to take into account the clone command game too.
Pretty, so what do we blow up first? -Wraith Squadron Motto
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Ventessel's Avatar


Ventessel
02.26.2013 , 09:24 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by YoshiRaphElan View Post
While Boba's fighting the Gunny, Chief gets Delta Squad from Republic commando!
They didn't have motion sensors, if I recall. Or advanced A.I.
The Heir to ChaosAdded Chapter Sixteen-- 17 APR 2013
“People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.” ~ George Orwell

YoshiRaphElan's Avatar


YoshiRaphElan
02.26.2013 , 09:33 PM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Ventessel View Post
I think MJOLNIR Armor is dramatically superior to Katarn battle armor, though. It has considerably more shielding and protective qualities, since it can stand up to fire from Covenant plasma weapons, which appear to be much more advanced than CIS blasters. Just looking at the effects on target, blasters leave carbon scoring, but plasma weapons will straight up incinerate the target.

Additionally, Chief has sufficient speed and agility to take Delta by surprise. Onboard a ship he can get the drop on them easily, since his armor's HUD has a built in motion tracker/radar. If he ambushes them, either with plasma grenades (they'll stick to the commando's armor and game over) or by rushing into melee combat, the fight would end quickly.

Chief would either kill one or two commandos and disengage to continue stalking them, or wipe out the whole team in one swoop. Remember, MC can flip over large vehicles (including tanks) with his armor's augments. Without his armor, he weighs roughly 400-500 lb. and inside it he weighs 2000 lb. His bone and muscle density has been augmented with grafts, etc. and his neural system reacts 55 times faster than a normal human's. This guy is a fiend in melee combat. I believe in an earlier thread like this there was an anecdote of him maiming or killing three ODST commandos during a training exercise. When he was twelve.


Honestly, I've always felt that the DC-17m was underpowered. It traded punch for versatility. It's a single shot grenade launcher, or a light carbine, or a marksman's rifle. Master Chief tends to favor using more specialized weapons to accomplish specific tasks. He frequently changes equipment during a mission to adapt to changing circumstances.

And there's also the fact that I believe blaster weapons are rather low-powered to begin with, at least compared to Covenant plasma weapons. Now, Tenloss Disruptor rifles are another story...
Actually, I don't think a single plasma grenade would bust Katarn armor, for one reason. In a Republic Commando short story, a commando jumped on a thermal detonator to save a bunch of people, and all that happened was a huge dent formed in his chest plate and bruised him. Two plasma genades might take a commando down, but the first might just dent the armor and take down the shields. Now, that wouldn't stop Chief from just squeezing the life out of them or snapping their necks, but I am certain they could stand up to most of his long-range weapons, including everything up to the rocket launcher. That would probably be game over.

Ventessel's Avatar


Ventessel
02.26.2013 , 10:03 PM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by YoshiRaphElan View Post
Actually, I don't think a single plasma grenade would bust Katarn armor, for one reason. In a Republic Commando short story, a commando jumped on a thermal detonator to save a bunch of people, and all that happened was a huge dent formed in his chest plate and bruised him. Two plasma genades might take a commando down, but the first might just dent the armor and take down the shields. Now, that wouldn't stop Chief from just squeezing the life out of them or snapping their necks, but I am certain they could stand up to most of his long-range weapons, including everything up to the rocket launcher. That would probably be game over.

The sniper rifle goes through the armor of tanks... that would likely fly clean through one of them.

While I'm inclined to agree with you about the grenades, there are two things that make me question that:

1. We don't know how the yield of a plasma grenade compares to a thermal detonator.
--> Although we do know that thermal detonators are supposed to be pretty darn powerful, that leads me to my next point...
2. The book where this happens was written by Karen Traviss, and I know I'm going to piss off a lot of Fandalorians by saying this, but she seems to lack perspective in her writing from time to time. So either that was a pretty low powered grenade, or the Katarn armor is absurdly powerful.
The Heir to ChaosAdded Chapter Sixteen-- 17 APR 2013
“People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.” ~ George Orwell

YoshiRaphElan's Avatar


YoshiRaphElan
02.27.2013 , 10:06 AM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Ventessel View Post

or the Katarn armor is absurdly powerful.
Katarn armor is absurdly powerful.

But it's supposed to be.

TalonVII's Avatar


TalonVII
02.27.2013 , 04:26 PM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by Ventessel View Post
They didn't have motion sensors, if I recall. Or advanced A.I.
For the love of god YES CLONE COMMANDOS HAVE MOTION SENSORS. No they do not have advanced AI.

If clone commandos didn't have motion sensors, how the hell could they toss up remote sensors and tie into them to track oh gee MOVEMENT.

Don't believe me? In the very first RC book by Karen Traviss. And ontop of that, it's in the Republic Commando GAME, which the books are based off of, and the game is tied into ROTS, so it's cannon.

Please guys, if you really are guessing, read the books, look it up, or play the frakkin game.
Pretty, so what do we blow up first? -Wraith Squadron Motto
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Ventessel's Avatar


Ventessel
02.27.2013 , 11:56 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by TalonVII View Post
For the love of god YES CLONE COMMANDOS HAVE MOTION SENSORS. No they do not have advanced AI.

If clone commandos didn't have motion sensors, how the hell could they toss up remote sensors and tie into them to track oh gee MOVEMENT.

Don't believe me? In the very first RC book by Karen Traviss. And ontop of that, it's in the Republic Commando GAME, which the books are based off of, and the game is tied into ROTS, so it's cannon.

Please guys, if you really are guessing, read the books, look it up, or play the frakkin game.
The commandos may be able to set up remote monitoring equipment, but they do not have an internal radar system with their armor. No HUD tracking enemies movement around them.
The Heir to ChaosAdded Chapter Sixteen-- 17 APR 2013
“People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.” ~ George Orwell