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[SAGE] Elidhu's 2.0 PTS Review

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Sage / Sorcerer
[SAGE] Elidhu's 2.0 PTS Review

Ekot's Avatar


Ekot
02.25.2013 , 01:16 AM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by Garell View Post
[SAGE] Elidhu's 2.0 PTS Review Aimed at Devs and Players!



I do however feel confident enough to say that all 3 dps specs are viable for the content currently out on the PTS and it would be beneficial for people to become schooled and efficient in playing all 3 and change spec according to whatever boss or game mechanics you come up against.

I hope this hasn't been too boring and that game developers and players alike gained something from reading this.

/Elidhu

Embrace the Rage!!!
Thanks for a great run down of the Sage Class on PTS atm.

/Conji

Garell's Avatar


Garell
02.25.2013 , 01:22 AM | #22
Appologies for not getting my parses sorted last night but i've been busy crafting etc and doing Sv on 16 HM. Lots of people including devs have asked me about the "TF hybrid" spec. I honestly didn't take the time to test it on PTS as i ran it through simulations on live about 2 months ago and found it wanting. However, wuth the talent changes and the success people are having i will make sure to parse that spec also. Maybe before the raid tonight if the fleet dummy isn't too busy

Hakkology's Avatar


Hakkology
02.25.2013 , 06:08 AM | #23
I really would like to hear some good news about Telekinetic Sages, some good dps values. Currently it looks way weaker compared to other specs. Anyone already familiar with the class able to test it ?
Hakko of the Red Eclipse ( Telekinetics Sage )

fearrious's Avatar


fearrious
02.25.2013 , 09:07 AM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by Garell View Post
Appologies for not getting my parses sorted last night but i've been busy crafting etc and doing Sv on 16 HM. Lots of people including devs have asked me about the "TF hybrid" spec. I honestly didn't take the time to test it on PTS as i ran it through simulations on live about 2 months ago and found it wanting. However, wuth the talent changes and the success people are having i will make sure to parse that spec also. Maybe before the raid tonight if the fleet dummy isn't too busy
I ran a test on it on the ship dummy and found it to do ~2300 DPS (no chance to resist, though i had 216 accuracy). It runs into force issues very quickly because of disturbance. That could change if you are smart about alternating tk throw and disturbance. TK wave also seems like its not worth it because it is not buffed by some talents further up in the TK tree.

For a reference, I was getting ~2600-2700 on the same dummy with TK and ~2500-2600 with balance and hybrid. Again, this is a lvl 50 dummy with a lower armor value and a no resists, meaning that these numbers are inflated.

EDIT: TK Log - ~2400, with armor debuff, screwed up a little bit near the end, otherwise it was holding up at about 2500. Stats: 1230 Bonus Damage, 106.15% accuracy, 22.58% crit chance, ~69 crit multiplier, 5% Alacrity. Server Lag: 23 ms. No augments.

TK Log 2 ~2400 Armor Debuff for beginning and end. Stats: 1218.7 Bonus Damage, 108.06 Accuracy, 23.30% crit, 66.92% crit mult, 4.06% Alacrity.

TK Log 3 - taking miss out of the equation ~2600. This test was with 0% added accuracy. Stats were: 1217.5 bonus damage, 23.37% crit, 69.49% Multiplier, 7.76% Alacrity. Done on the lvl 50 ship operations dummy. The purpose of this test was to test how the spec will scale with alacrity. I don't know if this distrubution is attainable, but if it is, the spec can easily push 2700.

I think it will scale alot better once we can get more alacrity in the mix.

One concern with the spec: The initial burst with cooldowns is really really high. I am afraid sages can rip aggro off of tanks even if they give the tanks a head start.
Onomoro, DPS Sage and Derpadin, Vanguard Tank
Raider of Stoic on The Shadowlands
5/5 16 Man TfB.
http://www.stoicguild.org

DarthZak's Avatar


DarthZak
02.25.2013 , 09:21 AM | #25
Ill just copypaste what I posted on MMO Mechanics

Ok so I did a 2200 Balance parse
http://www.torparse.com/a/144114

My stats are

WP: 2555
Power: 995
Force power: 1874
Accuracy: 108.13
Crit chance: 26.20 (338 rating)
Crit Multi: 70.06 (360 rating)
Alac: 72 rating

No stims, all buffs and no on-use relic (forgot to pop it in the beginning so I didnt bother)
My build: http://pts.swtor-spy.com/skill-tree-calc...100&ver=20

Note that there are 2 points in the Balance tree I couldnt place so I put them in Containment. This is of course optional since there are other skills to put them in but none of them affect DPS
Oh and there was a TK Sage parsing next to me so he took a few of my DoT's

I thnk in an ideal environment the Balance spec should hit around 2400~


EDIT: did a 2nd try, this time with more accuracy (109.06 - 360)) and crit (27.71 - 436) and less power (897) and Surge (67.61% - 288)
http://www.torparse.com/a/144131
I also forgot to put the new stuff in my augged belt+bracers so I switched that and this round I did use my relic. Also this time there was no Sage around to steal my Balance ticks
Its also a bit shorter since my phone acted up and the app crashed.

The spikes are around 2600 but all in all I dont think Surge/Power should be sacrifced for Acc/Crit. Missing 1% with my previous setup was acceptable imo
The Peacecraft Legacy
Elycia , Mariemaia , Minagoroshi

Darth_Dreselus's Avatar


Darth_Dreselus
02.25.2013 , 11:22 AM | #26
Link to build is broken, obv it is 36 Balance but I am wondering how many point you got in Seer.
No One Important Died Tavernus - Sorc / Taverna - Mara / Pintus - Op / Gintonica - PT
The Red Eclipse. Sweet Dreams to all my Harbinger children.

DarthZak's Avatar


DarthZak
02.25.2013 , 11:32 AM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by Darth_Dreselus View Post
Link to build is broken, obv it is 36 Balance but I am wondering how many point you got in Seer.
The links keep dying one me, no idea why

Anyway I have 3 points in Penetrating Light in the Seer tree and thats it.

Im not sure whats better, Clamoring Force or Psychic Suffusion. PS would give me more use as a support DPS and as Balance I dont get that much benefit from Clamoring Force
The Peacecraft Legacy
Elycia , Mariemaia , Minagoroshi

Garell's Avatar


Garell
02.25.2013 , 11:57 AM | #28
Loving the discussion guys, keep it up!

PTS is a bit crowded so it's making it a bit difficult to do decent parses

khak's Avatar


khak
02.26.2013 , 12:04 PM | #29
okay got a good parse on the pts this morning (only time 60+ people are not nuking the 55 op dummy) rounded out to about 2181 with the tidal force build i mentioned earlier( my numbers earlier where on a 50 dummy) forgot to mention it in my earlier posts but here is the link to my build
http://pts.swtor-spy.com/skill-tree-...0000000&ver=20

and here is a link to my parse
http://www.torparse.com/a/145358

the one i have in mention is the 3rd one from the top but I have done others throughout the morning which you are more than welcome to look at.

This spec revolves around using presence of mind to cast disturbance when mind crush is not about to come off cd(<2 sec ish). I preferred to use it as a filler over project mostly for right before either weaken mind(if u can somehow know when its coming off cd without confusing your dot with others on the target bar) or force in balance came off cd. Why force in balance since its the same cd as mind crush well if i have psychic projection up i pop disturbance with presence of mind and then use force in balance into a psychic projection proced tele throw which (usually procs presence of mind). if tidal force procs and I get presence of mind from the psychic projection tele throw I use tele wave into my instant mind crush then go back to spamming tele throw. yes there might be a few secs esp if u get unlucky where mind crush's uptime goes down a little but the gain u get from the instant nuke from tele wave i feel can possibly make up for it or if ur luck is not piss poor surpass it.

This is also on a single target and from what I have witnessed since I started playing with it it may or may not be close to the numbers to what other sages are parsing on the 55 dummy on pts with traditional specs and the bal/tele hybrid that elidhu tested but after hearing onomoru mention to me on live and from the posts that disturbance is actually mathematically a dps gain i think this spec could possibly be viable single target spec and possibly be superior in an aoe fight which i have not tested yet.

anyone else dabbled with this spec or something similar on the 55 dummy or in a S&V on aoe fights like the first two bosses to see how this spec does? If my guild gets a full group together tonight for hm S&V ill look at my parses to see if the dps gains or losses from this spec are worth it

Nibbon's Avatar


Nibbon
02.26.2013 , 04:02 PM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by fearrious View Post
3) While force management issues in balance were not really fixed, the spec seems to play better. Surge should still be a priority because of the amount of damage that relys on DoTs. 15 ticks instead of also helps in the long run.
-Onomoro
There was never and still is no force management issues with balance - if you have force management issues, you are doing something terribly wrong.

I'd like to note I hit 2650 DPS on the ship dummy (NOTE: lvl 50, not the fleet which is 55) - I was using exotech stim but no adrenals - I was also fully augmented in the +18 WP augments, which is something some people seem to be lacking. My guess is, adjusted, I'm hitting Elidhu's numbers on the fleet dummy. I don't have the parse for that one, but I will revisit it soon and get one if I can.

I have to disagree with the 110% accuracy assessment, especially if it is taking 400+ secondary stat points to get there. This needs some real in-game testing, but my guess is the sweetspot is closer to ~200-250. I definitely noticed a flood of misses in the new endgame op with 0 accuracy (and subsequently, a huge range of inconsistent results on the fights). I was able to hit ~2100 on the first fight and ~2300 on the second (mind you, there are some things to AOE in both fights that inflate the DPS a bit). I did indeed top the DPS meters on just about every attempt.

All in all - I'm stoked about the Sage changes and feel like we are at a good place. In fact, I'd go so far as saying they shouldn't change a thing about Sages as they are on PTS. I also got into a WZ without anyone cheating and I totally took everyone apart - new shield ability was quite useful - and I soloed smash specced people very easily.