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Sniper 2.0 PTS!


kvandertulip's Avatar


kvandertulip
02.20.2013 , 08:46 PM | #21
Is anyone else nervous how the damage reduction to TS/FT is going to affect SS/MM dps?
Wiseposterior - Sharpshooter Gunslinger
Wiseglutes - Seer Sage
Likewise - Dirty Fighting Scoundrel
<The Cleverlynamed Legacy>

miglor's Avatar


miglor
02.20.2013 , 09:42 PM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by Synavix View Post
While a lot of these changes will affect PvP a lot more than PvE, we didn't really need a lot of buffs in PvE. We'll have a few rotation changes, a little more mobility...but as long as our DPS potential is relatively untouched in comparison to other classes we'll be in good shape. I'll leave discussions about whether we'll be buffed/nerfed in PvP to people who know better than me.

As far as the nerfing of hybrids, it's a welcome change in my opinion. I've loved both the MM/Eng and Leth/Eng hybrids for our class, but they're a lot more difficult to balance around and (for the most part) have brought a lot more unbalance to the game from other classes.
Why? Its much harder (in terms of energy management) for optimal DPS. More dots to juggle and just overall more buttons to mash. Why would you NOT reward the better player? Trying lethality again after having played hybrid for months makes lethality seem like something 2nd graders can master.

There should be reward for better players, and I think hybrids kinda gives that to us.

Synavix's Avatar


Synavix
02.20.2013 , 10:19 PM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by kvandertulip View Post
Is anyone else nervous how the damage reduction to TS/FT is going to affect SS/MM dps?
With adjustments to other areas of the tree and alacrity I think SS/MM will still have potential, but I'd need to see more before knowing for sure. It's certainly an awkward change though.

Quote: Originally Posted by miglor
Why? Its much harder (in terms of energy management) for optimal DPS. More dots to juggle and just overall more buttons to mash. Why would you NOT reward the better player? Trying lethality again after having played hybrid for months makes lethality seem like something 2nd graders can master.

There should be reward for better players, and I think hybrids kinda gives that to us.
There's really nothing wrong with that line of thought, but I'm looking at it from another way. Like I said, I enjoyed the hybrids for sniper/gunslinger...but they've caused a lot of questionable issues in PvP with sages, guardians, and even early commandos (hybrid grav spam healers). It's difficult to explain why XXX class should have viable hybrids while XXX doesn't, and in the end just makes for a lot of extra balancing for unintended synergies.

As far as PvE, I compare it to the PvE balance argument that "every DPS spec is a pure DPS (and classes that can heal shouldn't be punished to have lower DPS)". While it's nice to think that DPS potential should be tied to difficulty in some way, in a "perfect" balance situation every class should be capable of the same DPS and offer varying difficulty skills for different players. Marksman and Lethality snipers already put out some of the highest DPS potential in the game (depending on fight for MM), and to have another sniper spec on top of that that puts out even MORE is a bit much. Better play should always reward better numbers, but not because one spec is "better".

There is also the old WoW argument that top tier talents should be something unique to each spec that makes each spec what it is, and when a large portion of a class chooses not to take their top tier talent it means it's poorly designed.

All that said though, I think if BW put more time into balancing the game (especially in PvP) and hybrid specs, I am actually a fan of them (in theory). They often reward intelligent gameplay and spec decisions. I just prefer a balanced game with no hybrids than an unbalanced one with.

paowee's Avatar


paowee
02.20.2013 , 10:37 PM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by Synavix View Post
While a lot of these changes will affect PvP a lot more than PvE, we didn't really need a lot of buffs in PvE. We'll have a few rotation changes, a little more mobility...but as long as our DPS potential is relatively untouched in comparison to other classes we'll be in good shape. I'll leave discussions about whether we'll be buffed/nerfed in PvP to people who know better than me.
In comparison to:

Current Marauder 4pc PVE set bonus:
  • (2p): Reduces the rage cost of Vicious Throw or Dispatch by 1.
  • (4p): Reduces the cooldown of Frenzy or Valerous Call by 15s.

2.0 Marauder set bonus:
  • Weaponmaster's Gear 2pc PVE: Now increases Ravage damage dealt by 8%.
  • Weaponmaster's Gear 4pc PvE: Now in addition to reducing the cooldown of Frenzy, also makes activating Berserk increase all damage dealt by 4% for 15 seconds.

Sniper PVE set bonus SO FAR remains the same in 2.0:
  • Target Acquired energy and
  • Reduced energy cost on Takedown.



From the little information that we have right now (no parses, logs, skill tree changes) it looks like Marauders, our pure DPS melee counterpart has the lead with this one.

Marauder - 1
Sniper - 0

Republic < Intrepid > The Harbinger slinger sage vanguard dps
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Selenial's Avatar


Selenial
02.20.2013 , 10:41 PM | #25
Yeh the spotter ability is sweet.
We tested it today and its pretty simple:
30 stacks means you can see a stealthed player without any buffs to stealth from 30 meters away.
When stealth is increased by 15 (Ie sneak) you can only see from 15 meters.
Passive adons to stealth, like +5 perma, means without sneak you can see from 25 and with its 10 meters...

However this isnt a major deal, from 15 meters a scoundrel can roll or a shadow can force speed still making it to their target, it just mainly now stops stealth caps....
Evil is a word used by the ignorant and the weak. The dark side is about survival. It's about unleashing your inner power. It glorifies the strength of the individual.
Zarys Sorcerer Cathinka Scoundrel
Force In Balance - The Harbinger

Synavix's Avatar


Synavix
02.20.2013 , 10:45 PM | #26
Quote: Originally Posted by paowee View Post

Marauder - 1
Sniper - 0

It's alright; at the end of the day we know who has the bigger guns. :P

Tordos's Avatar


Tordos
02.20.2013 , 11:09 PM | #27
Headshot and Eviscerate should not be removed.

waznpride's Avatar


waznpride
02.20.2013 , 11:25 PM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by Tordos View Post
Headshot and Eviscerate should not be removed.
All PvE only skills like headshot and eviscerate were removed from all classes. And honestly, they were only used on trash mobs in FP/OPS because you couldn't stun/incapacitate/slow any bosses anyway. They were a total waste of money/quickbar slot for 95% of all situations.

Synavix's Avatar


Synavix
02.20.2013 , 11:30 PM | #29
I enjoyed Headshot for trash adds on fights. Used it a lot on FB&SC adds or mini adds on fights like Bonethrasher and Foreman Crusher. I can't say I'm really sad to see them go, though. I think the original idea of adding them was good, but they didn't turn out to be as useful as the Devs probably hoped...and for almost every class it was just a wasted ability.

paowee's Avatar


paowee
02.20.2013 , 11:32 PM | #30
You guys are probably still busy on the PTS (i have to download 10gb more ) but can anyone confirm if we have the Take Down proc talent in Lethality?
Republic < Intrepid > The Harbinger slinger sage vanguard dps
swtorboard.org dps blog.class guides.end-game stuff
16 man | 8 man DPS leaderboards | Galactic Starfighter Records