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A Summary of Increased Repair Cost Problems (for BW/EA)

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
A Summary of Increased Repair Cost Problems (for BW/EA)
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Ratajack's Avatar


Ratajack
02.15.2013 , 08:55 AM | #421
Quote: Originally Posted by slafko View Post
I guess Toyota customers weren't entitled for the bug in their breakes to be fixed.
You miss the point, entirely. Expecting a bug in you brakes that causes unnecessary wear or risk to t he driver and occupants is fine. Expecting a bug in the electronic door opener which allows it to also act as a remote engine starter not to be fixed would be entitled.

Not entitled-Toyota, please fix the bug in my brakes, and also the one in my electronic key fob.

Entitled-Toyota, please fix my brakes, but don't touch my electronic key fob.

Now, let's look at another example. Toyota fixes the bug with the brakes. To do this they use a newer brake pad which is more expensive, so everyone costs go up for brake repairs down the line. Each Toyota owner has at least 3 options to deal with the increased cost:

A-Take car to Toyota dealer, pay increased dealer costs.

B-Take car to another mechanic to have brakes serviced, pay less than dealer.

C-Buy parts and do brake service themselves, or have a friend do. Cheapest method.

They can also refuse to use either of the aforementioned options, choosing instead to demand that Toyota fix their brakes, and everyone else's, for the cost of the bugged brake pads, while still using the newer more expensive brake pads.

Not entitled-I'll just have to pay a little more for the factory service, or I'll give up some time on a Saturday afternoon to change my brake pads and save a few bucks.

Entitled-It was cheaper with the bad brake pads, Toyota. I expect that you will lower the cost for me and everyone else to what it used to be. I refuse to pay more even if the brake pads are more expensive.

Kiniski's Avatar


Kiniski
02.15.2013 , 09:02 AM | #422
The Happy Valentine's Day from Gree post has a inmediate response from BW/EA admins, and the hunderd of pages and 5 star threads related to repair prices, don't have even a view from admins, that's the point of view of BW/EA about his customers.

Ratajack's Avatar


Ratajack
02.15.2013 , 09:02 AM | #423
Quote: Originally Posted by iamthehoyden View Post
Ah, there we go, this is actually a decent argument.

Repair costs are a traditional gold sink in games, as are auction house/gtn fees. In both cases, the mechanic works...and this is important...as long as the amount taken through repairs and fees isn't exorbiant. If the price gets too high people will engage in fewer activities that lead to repair bills and will sell fewer items.

Where the "too high" bar is will vary from person to person. When meeting this cost becomes burdensome to a significant number of players, then you have a negative impact on the game. From my observations of the forums and chat in-game, this change is creating just that scenario.

Now, the good news is that repair costs are only one potential gold sink in a game economy. Putting very highly priced mounts or pets in the game is an effective way to get large amounts of credit out of the system.

In short, the positive effects of using repair costs as a gold sink are replicatable through other methods and the negative effects appear to be significant. Which is why I would like to see them cut repair costs across the board (for both moddable and unmoddable items) to what moddable items used to be.
Again, high priced mounts and pets are NOT universal credit sinks. Some will choose to buy them and some will choose not to buy them. Repair costs are universal.

Socialist's Avatar


Socialist
02.15.2013 , 09:04 AM | #424
The real question is why does it have to be that expensive?

Really, how does it serve the game to have such exorbitant repair bills?


If only they made crafters to be able to repair gear cheaper, effectively creating a new sector in the economy, making those previous sink credits to flow amongst players... But no, they just raised the Sink Tax for no apparent reason.

Sometimes I wonder who is behind all those fantastic (sarcasm) decisions we've been having since forever.
The Karamazov Legacy - Battle Meditation

Free 7 days sub and possibly character transfer -> http://www.swtor.com/r/gYl7KJ

RorCorps's Avatar


RorCorps
02.15.2013 , 09:06 AM | #425
Quote: Originally Posted by Kiniski View Post
The Happy Valentine's Day from Gree post has a inmediate response from BW/EA admins, and the hunderd of pages and 5 star threads related to repair prices, don't have even a view from admins, that's the point of view of BW/EA about his customers.
Someone who has no clue whatsoever how the forum admins work. They can't comment on crap like this. This issue will take time to sort out, since there will need to be data obtained.

DarthTHC's Avatar


DarthTHC
02.15.2013 , 09:06 AM | #426
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
Again, high priced mounts and pets are NOT universal credit sinks. Some will choose to buy them and some will choose not to buy them. Repair costs are universal.
Again (read a few posts up), repair costs are not universal. They just require slightly more effort to control than avoiding the purchase of a speeder.

Additionally, repair costs, if they are too high, drive away subscribers which decreases revenue for the game's publisher which can't possibly be a good thing for the game.
Human beings see oppression vividly when they're the victims. Otherwise they victimize blindly and without a thought. ~ Isaac Bashevis Singer

Ratajack's Avatar


Ratajack
02.15.2013 , 09:07 AM | #427
Quote: Originally Posted by Angry_Ferth View Post
If this was an intentional change, and if the ultimate goal was to remove money from the game, they probably would be less willing to create vendor novelty items at this point because it would directly compete with the cartel market.

In order for repair costs to work as a money sink they need to be innocuous enough that community doesn't mind that they are there, yet high enough to actually compete with all the sources of income this game has.

Frankly, daily quests are the biggest contributing factor to inflation and credit bloat in the game, they could easily have left repair costs alone and decreased the the value/frequency of vendor trash from daily zones and reduced the daily rewards themselves.

Or they could do a little of both. Honestly, I believe this fix is not working as intended. As has been pointed out before, if you read the actual patch information regarding this change it only states that Enhancements weren't being factored into repair costs.

At most this should be a 50% increase to repairs (33% if the shell item also incurs it's own repair costs.) so people should probably being seeing a repair cost increase from ~3000 to ~5000 for the gear damage inflicted from a death at 50 in decent progression gear. That, to me, is not unreasonable.

If they are indeed looking to reduce the amount of money in the game then they should look to stem the inflow rather than try to increase the outflow.
If they nerfed the credit rewards from dailies, and the trash drops from mobs in the daily areas, the outcry on the forums would make this debate look like a standing ovation. All one has to do is go the WoW forums and check out the threads about the reduction of gold drops from old raids, and vendor prices for drops from those raids.

Socialist's Avatar


Socialist
02.15.2013 , 09:08 AM | #428
Quote: Originally Posted by RorCorps View Post
Someone who has no clue whatsoever how the forum admins work. They can't comment on crap like this. This issue will take time to sort out, since there will need to be data obtained.
Or they could come out and say:

Hey folks!

Yes, it seems you folks are generally unhappy with the repair prices. I will forward your complaints to the devs for further analysis. I'll keep in touch!



Just to be kind, just to show they actually have a communications team. Even if such response does not aggregate much, it officially aknowledges they know the issue being complaint at.
The Karamazov Legacy - Battle Meditation

Free 7 days sub and possibly character transfer -> http://www.swtor.com/r/gYl7KJ

DarthTHC's Avatar


DarthTHC
02.15.2013 , 09:14 AM | #429
If the goal of the repair cost increase is to remove credits from the game, the devs did absolutely the wrong thing.

In the economy of this game, you have people who are perpetually broke. They grind enough credits to do what they want to do, do that thing and get them near broke again, then they grind more credits and the cycle continues. These are the people who pay the most repair bills. These are also the people who do not horde credits.

Then you have the people who horde credits. Tens to hundreds of millions at a time. They have so many credits because they know how to make them but they are equally adept at NOT SPENDING them, much like the uber-wealthy in the real world.

But here's the thing... the uber-wealthy will buy exotic cars. The uber-wealthy will buy yachts. The uber-wealthy will spend $10,000 to $100,000 on a suit or dress for a special occasion.

If you really want to reduce the number of credits in the game, the way to do this is not by taxing the people who constantly churn credits. Everything they get goes right back out of their hands anyway.

You need to give the wealthy something to spend their money on. They're smart enough to avoid the "taxes" you're trying to impose with your increased repair bills. They're smart enough to avoid any tax you try to impose.

But if you give them something suitably sexy to buy, some (not all, but some) of them will buy it.
Human beings see oppression vividly when they're the victims. Otherwise they victimize blindly and without a thought. ~ Isaac Bashevis Singer

Ratajack's Avatar


Ratajack
02.15.2013 , 09:14 AM | #430
Quote: Originally Posted by iamthehoyden View Post
I think there's a very good chance you're right. I wouldn't be at all surprised if what they were really trying to fix were cases where people would rip mods out of shells, sell the shell for full price, and then sell the mods (or re them). Maintenance is coming through tonight, have to see if they fix this.
If the new repair costs are bugged, the bug should obviously be fixed. The costs should be working as intended.