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Shadow Tank @ Lost Island


mikebevo's Avatar


mikebevo
02.04.2013 , 12:06 AM | #11
Healer here, can't really help except to say read Kabolt link. I have healed many HM FP, HL LI and Operations with the person that wrote that write up. While the Shadow Tank is not his main, he is the reason that as a healer I personally believe the shadow tank is the best tank in the game (or at least my favorite to play with).

No real way to know what the problem is without being there, but this statement at least tells me at least part of the problem is you.
Quote: Originally Posted by Rahizm View Post
I assume Resilience is not really useful
Even on my dps shadow I know Resilience is Very useful.

Personally if I were tanking, I would also read write ups on all the different healers so that you have some clue of their abilities. As a healer i have done that with the other healing classes, the tanks and dps, so that I am better at my role as healer or dps.
Quote: Originally Posted by Rahizm View Post
I've told the healers (because I ran it multiple times) to focus healing on me, and I presumed they did. I mean, if the DPS need healing on that boss they must be colorblind or something, anyone should be able to spot those yellow marks on dee floor..
Any decent healer is going to focus on the tank, but none that I know are only going to heal the tank. I heal whoever needs a heal whenever they need a heal. I would agree with you and then do it the way I was taught no matter what the tank told me. I know a shadow tank can pretty much become immune to damage for a few seconds, so if it is between hitting the tank or hitting the highest output dps, I will hit the highest output dps, because at least with the shadow that wrote the article Kabolt quoted, he will easily survive until after I hit dps with a big heal.

Quote: Originally Posted by Rahizm View Post
Then how come I was able to survive the first 3 times I came around there?
First three groups may have all been good, over geared players that knew the instance and their class. My healer is well enough geared now that I could heal anyone through that fight pretty much no matter what they do. That does not mean a healer that can't is bad, it just means they are limited by gear. Same could be said for any role. It is just other than people getting knocked off the platform during Sav-Rak I consider any death during HM LI my fault no matter who the other players are.

Unless you know their class and their limitations, I would be careful blaming others, I would be more worried about making myself the best that I could be until I was able to carry people through. I have learned more from bad groups than I have good groups. You get in there with 4 really good players and you breeze through, but when do it with not great players, it teaches you to get better to get through the instances. Dying isn't bad in this game, if you learn something that will help you get through it more efficiently next time.

Rahizm's Avatar


Rahizm
02.04.2013 , 04:42 AM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by ckoneful View Post
Click on the guide in my signature for class specific information. You should NEVER augment for Shield, only Absorb/Defense.

For the first boss I've generally only died if the DPS don't kill the adds and they nuke me at the same time as the boss. I try to kill them myself immediately when I'm not in guild groups now.
Doesn't shield rating also increase the amount absorbed? Well still valuable advice. I went with shield before reading anything because I happened to pick it up on a random mob in a FP. But I guess I'll go for absorb/defence augments instead.

I saw a healing relic flash by a few days ago which to my knowledge didn't seem useful. As I looked around it apparently is useful (according to your tutorial and others on this forum). So I guess I'll also go for that. Sorry if this threat becomes a more Shadow-class related topic thing lol.

@ Kabolt. That guide/link seems useful, I'll use that information. Thanks!
Also, now that you've mentioned Force Cloak, I don't use this ability at all because the boss might insta-kill a party member or so. Well, at least that was my initial thought. I assumed a Shadow Tank should just take/absorb damage and make sure he keeps aggro and only let another tank grab threat in Ops (with exception of bosses who cannot be taunted ofcourse). Maybe I should use it in oh-**** situations like that.

@ Vankris. It might've been the dps moving only a bit late on the yellow circles. I'm pretty aware of the environment I"m tanking in. On the droid, and it happened only ONCE, incinerate got interrupted but the droid managed to kill me because I didn't receive any heals. Next run (pug, different group) went almost perfect so yeah.

@schnopsnosn. Was that in a PUG or guild run? It's exactly what I meant.

@Eternalnight. Can it be buggy at times? I did notice that at occassions the ground like, erupts, but no yellow circle appears. I assumed nothing happens and I keep standing there, watching till a yellow circle actually appears. Anyway I'll take your advice on the keep moving thing, thanks!

@mikebevo. I'm actually (willing to) try(ing) out every class in-game (but I do have a life!!!). I did the same in WoW during the Wotlk days, just so I know what every class and tree is capable of. I have a combat medic commando already. However, I seem to be teamed up with sages more. The last idk how many runs were with sages as healers. Runs with smugglers as healers and commandos went more smoothly or just smooth than with Sages.

I'll take everyone's advice in mind and I'll go over the tuts and the Shadow tanking primes a couple more times. I did get recruited into a guild during a LI run but I don't want to sound arrogant as to how I got in there :P. Thanks everyone for the helpful advice!

schnopsnosn's Avatar


schnopsnosn
02.04.2013 , 05:21 AM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by Rahizm View Post
@schnopsnosn. Was that in a PUG or guild run? It's exactly what I meant.
Guild run.
I refuse to PUG LI.

Hovergame's Avatar


Hovergame
02.04.2013 , 05:28 AM | #14
Quote:
Try starting your fight with - Slow time > mind control > force breach > project, along with as you see fit, Saber strike and double strike, with kinetic throw every three stacks - whirling blow does not use any force so use it when low on force.
Hmmmm ...... lol ? Using a taunt as 2nd spell = noob. yes, noob.

Kinetic Ward just before engaging
Engaging with Force Pull during Force speed to reach the boss
Project
Slow Time
Force Breach
Double attack
Project
Force Potency
Telekinetic Throw

And now, if you want to be SURE to keep the boss, Mind Control, but you probably don't need it, unless your DPS are overgeared and without guard.

For the OP : probably the healer's fault. I saw many Sages doing some DPS on that boss, just because the tank's hp are over 70%. 2 hits later, he dies.

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haliy
02.04.2013 , 05:28 AM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Kabolt View Post
The reason I say this is, if you wipe with one group, fare enough, but if you wipe with every group then you must look to yourself.
This is exactly what I was thinking.
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Kitru
02.04.2013 , 07:38 AM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Rahizm View Post
Doesn't shield rating also increase the amount absorbed?
No. Shield rating only increases your Shield chance. Absorption rating is required to increase your shield amount.
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ckoneful
02.04.2013 , 10:26 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by Hovergame View Post
Hmmmm ...... lol ? Using a taunt as 2nd spell = noob. yes, noob.

Kinetic Ward just before engaging
Engaging with Force Pull during Force speed to reach the boss
Project
Slow Time
Force Breach
Double attack
Project
Force Potency
Telekinetic Throw

And now, if you want to be SURE to keep the boss, Mind Control, but you probably don't need it, unless your DPS are overgeared and without guard.

For the OP : probably the healer's fault. I saw many Sages doing some DPS on that boss, just because the tank's hp are over 70%. 2 hits later, he dies.
This guy is right. Was going to comment on the Taunt being the 2nd used attack last night but decided to go pass out instead >_>
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mikebevo's Avatar


mikebevo
02.04.2013 , 10:47 AM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Rahizm View Post
@mikebevo. I'm actually (willing to) try(ing) out every class in-game (but I do have a life!!!). I did the same in WoW during the Wotlk days, just so I know what every class and tree is capable of. I have a combat medic commando already. However, I seem to be teamed up with sages more. The last idk how many runs were with sages as healers. Runs with smugglers as healers and commandos went more smoothly or just smooth than with Sages. !
Sage explains a lot. Great healing class, just not great a burst healing, use Resilience in those oh crap moments and give them a chance to get their heals off. With a Sage they will have you back at 100% fast, you just need to buy them a few seconds.

But you're correct sawbones are the best class in the game, healing or anything else. Joking, they are all well balanced, but all have the strenghts and limitations, so it is up to you to know them and help them out the best you can.
Quote: Originally Posted by ckoneful View Post
This guy is right. Was going to comment on the Taunt being the 2nd used attack last night but decided to go pass out instead >_>
Right about that, not right about blaming the healer. That is like saying well your rotation is wrong, but no problem blame that healer. It may very well be the healers fault, but I don't know that, more likely it is the group is largely inexperienced with their class, role and/or instances and still need to some work.

Hovergame's Avatar


Hovergame
02.04.2013 , 11:44 AM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by mikebevo View Post
Right about that, not right about blaming the healer. That is like saying well your rotation is wrong, but no problem blame that healer. It may very well be the healers fault, but I don't know that, more likely it is the group is largely inexperienced with their class, role and/or instances and still need to some work.
Well, that wasn't his rotation
And i said "PROBABLY" about the healer But his stats seem right and that boss doesn't ask anything special about tanking, just keep him and stay out of the circles. As a shadow, he cannot do anything more than "keep the debuffs and auto-heal when he has 3 charges" and "Deflexion if he's low".

CharlieBrown's Avatar


CharlieBrown
02.04.2013 , 03:35 PM | #20
Speaking from experience, if I've done my job and not stood in the grates while the lava comes through, interrupted incinerate as soon as I can and shroud / resilience the one stack I missed, and use overcharge saber / whatever the shadow equivalent is as often as I can to get the 10% HP heal then it's time to look at the rest of the group. Most of the time it's due to placement and people ignoring the wrong mechanics.

This is particularly true if they're not familiar with the fight or managed to LoS you to avoid the low HP adds that spawn because your DPS isn't taking care of them. There are a few mechanics to the LR-5 droid that, if ignored, cause a cascade failure as the timing on the other mechanics makes things fall apart.

Example: Moving out of LoS of the healer to pick up adds (the DPS should do this), only to walk through the lava and pick up a fire dot (should not happen, or use shroud / resilience), getting a DPS drop a bubble on you at the same time you run way (should be dropping bubbles in designated areas) so that you have to run away from it but miss the incinerate (should always be in range to interrupt) and it destroys your group.

That's a very poor scenario, but I've seem parts of that happen almost every single time I've pugged this fight. I'll ask if it's anyone's first time, get no response, and see some random player die to a bubble when he drops the first one.

My favorite is when they're taking damage from the bubble and instead of moving, they take the time to type out how the healer sucks. Yeah, sure thing pal.
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