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A message to the PUG community.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
A message to the PUG community.

Monoth's Avatar


Monoth
01.31.2013 , 10:48 PM | #61
Quote: Originally Posted by UGLYMRJ View Post
This only applies to those who complain about pre-mades ruining war zones for them. You fail to look at it from any other perspective other than your own. Here's the breakdown of the double edged sword.... Let's look at who gets shafted more, yet complain less.

Scenario #1: Pre-mades ruin war zones for PUG's on the opposite team by better communication, coordination and often skill. PUG's get wrecked and aren't happy, immediately log onto forums and click "new thread".

Scenario #2: PUG's are so poorly organized that they literally lose the game for the 4 man pre-made. Pre-made loses what should have been an easy win.

Scenario #3: 4 man pre-made and PUG on same team.... pre-made carries PUG team to victory. (They don't mention this in the list of complaints)

Scenario #4: PUG's carry pre-made to victory.... just kidding... that almost never happens...

-The other tidbit of information that often gets left out is that there are pre-mades in nearly every war zone, on both sides. The only difference is most of them are bad and it goes unnoticed. They don't mention that either.

-The PUG's who go idle in war zones to farm coms... don't get mentioned either in these lists of complaints.

-The PUG's who shoot down from the edge of their end zone at the warriors in the pit on huttball... also don't get mentioned.

-The PUG's that go on Rambo missions and do nothing but hurt the team... well... they don't get mentioned either.

-The PUG's that put up 50K in stats during a 15 minute voidstar.... no one mentions him in those threads.... but that's probably because HE IS the guy starting the damn thread.

So before you complain... think about who's really getting the worst of this situation.

My point in this is... the pre-mades (good ones) get screwed more often than you PUG's and WE'RE the ones doing the heavy lifting. It's amazing that so many of you can sit here and complain about pre-mades wrecking your face when 2 games later that same pre-made is getting you an easy win.

Want to solve the problem? Use the tools available... form a guild, form a pre-made and get better.

Disclaimer: I know there are good PUG's out there that understand the game and this post does not apply to you. However, you are the minority. The majority of guilds are awful and the PUG's are even worse on average.

In the end... I only hope that one PUG gets this to sink in and the next time they want to complain about pre-mades, they stop, and think... and realize that it's the ones who are putting forth the extra effort by learning to play the game properly, forming groups and organizing tactics and strategies that are far more affected by PUG's vs pre-mades than you PUG's who hop on twice a week for an hour before bed and spam force lightning while face tanking a marauder.

This public service announcement has been brought to you by UGLYMRJ.

The more you know... (Insert rainbow here)
Yet when us Puggers ask for a PUG only option you premades QQ a river over it because then you would have to play against other premades... Hmmm
F2P is like driving on a long stretch of highway with toll booths every 1/2 mile

Joesixxpack's Avatar


Joesixxpack
01.31.2013 , 10:56 PM | #62
Quote: Originally Posted by UGLYMRJ View Post
Yeah... still lowbie... only kept my attention for a few days. Hard to find enough time lately with real life shenanigans. Getting married next friday.
Congratulations! I've got 3 more months to fart around and be a slob before the shock collar goes on.

On topic: I'd have more sympathy for the plight of PUGgers vs. premades if I didn't do mostly solo PUG these days; and didn't have a lot of time premading until my guild died. Voip's a nice tool but PUGs still have the ability to coordinate adequately and play as a well-oiled machine. Yet many don't. When I see PUGs playing to their potential and getting rolled maybe I'll listen to the gripes about premades.
SifuStoli Sage | Joesixxpack VG | BBQ'Ribs GS | Hawt'Sauce Guard | Bluce'Ree Sent | Dark'nStormy Scrap
ilotSufiS Mara | BBQRibs Sin | BBQSammich PT | BBQSawce MM | Dark'n'Stormy Op
DEAD SERVER REFUGEE

WickedImage's Avatar


WickedImage
01.31.2013 , 11:18 PM | #63
Indeed, refraining from queing with pug teams would solve the OP's list of complaints. So....that is to say he may be agreement to not queing pugs with premades?
Afterall, it was clearly established that both pugs and premades ruin each others pvp experience, the same complaint from both sides.
It is only logical, if not completely obvious, to separate the two groups and thereby provide the best possible pvp experience for both demographics is it not?

Sounds to me like the exact same argument from both sides and can be resolved by separating the two groups.
I like it....a better pvp experience.....ahhhhh. Ugly, I'm sold and I agree with what you said. Separating the groups is the best way to handle this. Lets all work together and make this happen!!!

EDIT: Grats on getting hitched Ugly. Soak up the day AND the night, it goes by fast.
All the happiness to you and the Mrs.
Killer: 87% Achiever: 67% Explorer: 27% Socializer: 20%

Sathid's Avatar


Sathid
02.01.2013 , 12:01 AM | #64
Quote: Originally Posted by UGLYMRJ View Post
I would actually prefer competition on a reglar basis and not only expect to get it when we have good enough team composition to form a rated team and fight the same 3 guilds on my server.

And the only expectation I have is the same one pushed on us by our parents and any role model... strive to be better. If people can't take that kind of logic into a video game I'd hate to see how well they perform in the real world.
Lol but it IS a video game,really get over yourself i have went against your smash premades many times,your not all that.

Sleprock's Avatar


Sleprock
02.01.2013 , 12:06 AM | #65
Best post here in a long time. I agree 100% with everything.

UGLYMRJ's Avatar


UGLYMRJ
02.01.2013 , 01:50 AM | #66
Quote: Originally Posted by Sathid View Post
Lol but it IS a video game,really get over yourself i have went against your smash premades many times,your not all that.
Obviously not good enough for you to rage about me in every post you see me in for over a week... must be terrible.

UGLYMRJ's Avatar


UGLYMRJ
02.01.2013 , 01:51 AM | #67
Quote: Originally Posted by WickedImage View Post
EDIT: Grats on getting hitched Ugly. Soak up the day AND the night, it goes by fast.
All the happiness to you and the Mrs.
Thank you sir!

symke's Avatar


symke
02.01.2013 , 02:02 AM | #68
Quote: Originally Posted by UGLYMRJ View Post

...

So before you complain... think about who's really getting the worst of this situation.

My point in this is... the pre-mades (good ones) get screwed more often than you PUG's and WE'RE the ones doing the heavy lifting. It's amazing that so many of you can sit here and complain about pre-mades wrecking your face when 2 games later that same pre-made is getting you an easy win.

...

In the end... I only hope that one PUG gets this to sink in and the next time they want to complain about pre-mades, they stop, and think... and realize that it's the ones who are putting forth the extra effort by learning to play the game properly, forming groups and organizing tactics and strategies that are far more affected by PUG's vs pre-mades than you PUG's who hop on twice a week for an hour before bed and spam force lightning while face tanking a marauder.

This public service announcement has been brought to you by UGLYMRJ.

The more you know... (Insert rainbow here)

Many of your points are reasonable and to a degree accurate. But you fail to see the whole picture. And we could swap such lists entire day and not get anywhere.

Nobody wants an easy win!!!
Being with a premade as a PUG is almost as bad as being in a PUG against a premade. Only that added feeling of win is what makes it better. And to many, that's not the most important thing, surprised, surprise. To explain that to someone who plays in a premade and thinks that's the only way to do it: we want better fights, not easy wins.

Why are you playing in a premade that enters an ordinary queue if you know you will almost certainly be matched against a PUG? Want an easy win?
If the answer is no, why is your premade in a normal queue? You have a separate queue for you and you are almost guaranteed a better fight there. Not enough premades? Make a thread that entices people to join premades, not a thread that criticises PUGs. Without PUGs you would get less WZs and let's not forget ... less easy wins. So be thankfull for PUGs.

Playing the game in a premade does not mean playing the game properly. It's an MMO. Any kind of group is "playing the game properly". Which means you don't have to play with your closest friends or your favourite group to satisfy this game's mission. Try it sometimes, you will find an entire world of unknown people out there.

Now, to explain to you why playing in a PUG is better than playing in a premade (which is the reason so many of us are doing it).
Because it's much more fun. You know, opposite of work or "must do this". Playing in a premade (I've done it) feels like obligation. You have to be there, do that, don't do this and many times play differently that you like or are used to. That by itself is not so bad, it adds a feeling of belonging somewhere and doing something meaningful. Which, on the other side, can be the biggest problem of premades. It takes away all the drama and spontaneity of the play. It doesn't have that unknown factor that is so sorely missed from MMO games, where most of the things repeat themselves constantly.

You guys have an entire separate queue for you. We don't.

cashogy_reborn's Avatar


cashogy_reborn
02.01.2013 , 02:17 AM | #69
Quote: Originally Posted by LadyKohastFel View Post
Most people get absolutely demolished by 24/7 players and hackers and give up before they have a chance to learn and gear up. And the recruit gear is not much help since it is so distinctive looking that they may as well have a 50 foot tall neon sign hanging above their head saying "focus fire on me for an easy kill".

And the end result is that in the end the 24/7 players are shooting themselves in both their feet by driving the new players away and they have to put up with 2 or 3 hours of waiting for a warzone to pop.

And having elitist pigs of 24/7ers who only say "L2P nub" rather than giving constructive advice for a beginner to get better will not help this situation.
us elitist pigs give constructive advice constantly.

1. it is not listened to
2. bad players are the least receptive to constructive advice; if they werent then they would eventually stop being bad
3. people like you call us undeserved names, making us a) less inclined to offer advice to begin with and b) more inclined to tell you L2P.



i mean seriously, W T F do you guys want from us? you claim that you want more competitive games by removing premades. in reality that actually does nothing but hurt queue times.

you claim that the "elitist pigs" would rather beat the snot out of crappy PUGs than have real, brain-engaging competition. i PvP b/c there is nothing more fun than matching wits with another person and defeating them; im a massively competitive, confident, motivated person. those are the kind of people that make of the "elitist pig" community. you really think that i enjoy beating the crap out of someone who is barely more skilled than the AI? really? REALLY?

you claim that you want the gear disparity solved. that was actually addressed beautifully by bioware, /golfclap. now, if you actually participate in PvP you will be geared in no time (literally 5 days tops)

you claim that there is an abundance of hackers, which i am disinclined to believe. the only documented hacking i know of is in the lowbie bracket; who cares about the lowbie bracket? it is meaningless. ive never seen hacking in the 50 bracket, and ive been playing since before there was a 50 bracket.

what is left? its just excuse after excuse after excuse with this community. if you folks took even a tenth of the time you do whining about how bioware needs to handicap all the good people down to/below your skill level, devoted it to actually LEARNING the mechanics of the game, your class, warzone specifics, basic strategies, etc, you would actually become GOOD. and you wouldnt need to whine anymore.

im probably going to get some kind of infraction for this. <3 u mods
Dany - Attomm - Dan'y - Fogel
The Original Stormborn Commando Representative
The King of Bads

Ganjavus's Avatar


Ganjavus
02.01.2013 , 02:28 AM | #70
The ugly guy is right. I always pvp with friends (guilded and nonguilded) and we are on TS.

Hardly a premade, since every class and every gearset is welcome. But ok. Let's call us 'premaders'.

Just a heads up, to all you complaining people, who rather cry on the forums than take some time and patience to learn mechanics on this game:
It's always us capping in Novare when you are fighting away from the bunker, it's us that guard doors in VS and sidenotes in alderaan. We're the ones staying behind when the entire team dashes off to the "inc 1 snow"-call. We're the ones that going for help, when no-one in the team reacts to the "inc 1 snow"-call. And yes, we're pretty good in huttball as well. Well, we've been playing that for over a year now. You see?

Are we 'good'? Are we 'steamrolling'?

Nope, we're having fun, goofing on TS and saying 'ok, I need help on east'. (little sidetrack here: I don't call out in /ops anymore. Because the chance is nodes are left unguarded).

Yes, we have a lot of experience (long time players) and no, we don't like to lose when there's no reason to.

So. No, we don't have a problem carrying your chuck norris-wannabe, zerg mid-mentality, solo-medalfarming butts to a chance on victory.

Extra information:
1: we don't have enough players to play ranked all the time. We'd rather play ranked all the time, since our community agreed on 'no bubblepop' and only one smasher per team in ranked matches.

2: We hardly steamroll games. It's impossible with a premade of three or four. If the other four know how the game works, fine. Otherwise we're mostly fixing what others screwed up.

3: And frankly, we're not that good. We just know what to do. If you would too, you'd be complaining less about premades.

So in conclusion: if you're with a premade group, you can bet there's a lot going on behind te scenes, while you are mesmerised by your strive for damage numbers.

We all had to learn mechanics, and we sucked at warzones as well. It's ok. But please stop crying here and learn how warzones work.

Have fun, gg.
The Spurius Senex Legacy
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