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How do you guys approach the issue of skill level in determining who goes on ops?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Flashpoints, Operations, and Heroic Missions
How do you guys approach the issue of skill level in determining who goes on ops?

wadecounty's Avatar


wadecounty
01.13.2013 , 04:14 PM | #1
Now, I know gear is one thing, but gear can only get you so far. I'm sure we all have had that 1 guildie who everybody likes, who's very nice to everyone, but they can't for the life of them learn to play their class properly, or react quickly to things in operations.

That said, sometim that same player is also insistent on getting to go, because they meet the "gear requirements"... unfortunately, they don't meet the skill requirements.

Anyways, just curious how others handle this issue. Do you hit it with them straight up? Do you try to sugarcoat it? Or do you go out of your way to carry them by placing them in overgeared and extremely skilled groups?

ckoneful's Avatar


ckoneful
01.13.2013 , 04:17 PM | #2
Approach them about it, in a nice way, and tell them they need to improve. If they don't, then you don't really have a choice. It's 7 peoples time vs that 1 persons time.

EDIT: There are resources on these forums and on mmo-mechanics.com that can be seriously helpful when trying to learn a classes ins and outs.
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IAmViiOLENT's Avatar


IAmViiOLENT
01.13.2013 , 04:20 PM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by wadecounty View Post
Now, I know gear is one thing, but gear can only get you so far. I'm sure we all have had that 1 guildie who everybody likes, who's very nice to everyone, but they can't for the life of them learn to play their class properly, or react quickly to things in operations.

That said, sometim that same player is also insistent on getting to go, because they meet the "gear requirements"... unfortunately, they don't meet the skill requirements.

Anyways, just curious how others handle this issue. Do you hit it with them straight up? Do you try to sugarcoat it? Or do you go out of your way to carry them by placing them in overgeared and extremely skilled groups?
Usually, if this is the case; the best course of action is to try and mentor them after being straight up and telling them you can't put them in due to their skill. Offer tutoring chances, ways to improve themselves; etc. With a good raider/person, they will accept this and try very hard to make an improvement. If they do, great; if not, then you need to be honest with them and suggest that maybe the guild they're in now isn't the right place. If they flat out refuse the help, then honestly they're not someone you're going to want in raid from my own experience. You should ask them kindly to leave the guild, and find a new one.

Skill is a really tough thing to deal with in a raiding guild, you have to step around it carefully in situations like that :/

AshlaBoga's Avatar


AshlaBoga
01.13.2013 , 06:19 PM | #4
If after numerous mentor sessions (training dummy, HM FPs, WZs) they can't get the hang of it, we sadly inform them that they will not be doing Ops where we cannot simply carry an 8th person - we'll bring them to EV, KP SM EC but just so they can have some fun. After they get bored of that then we generally don't raid with them.

Tell them that it's only a game and that not being a good raider doesn't mean anything because it's just a video game.

DO NOT CALL THEM A "NOOB." DO NOT CALL THEM SLOW, OR STUPID.
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NotRonin's Avatar


NotRonin
01.13.2013 , 07:56 PM | #5
Having fun is the most important part of playing MMORPG. Unless you're a hardcore progression guild, it's better to keep everyone happy rather than focusing on 'the best'.

The hardest 'mechanics' in the game right now is TFB Hm Operator IX, and it consist of people remembering what their colour is. It's not rocket science or abstract mathematics, I'm pretty sure everyone can move in and out of colour circles.

Unless you're doing NiM EC or 16 man content, the DPS requirement for all of the fights are very lenient. Healing, on the other hand, requires more skill. If the said person is the healer, then you should ask them to respec to DPS.

Dragonbgone's Avatar


Dragonbgone
01.13.2013 , 11:05 PM | #6
Hi, I'm Dack from Messores Republicae and this is what we do for our raiders. We are a highly selective 16 man progression raiding guild.

When we bring people in we tell them that they'll get their chances to show us how good they are and what they can do as far as mechanics go. DPS really isn't a concern when seeing how well people can do because we have people who have a high expertise at their class and are more than willing to help out anyone that needs some coaching.

So on to the important stuff, mechanics! When we're trying out a new member we take he/she into an operation of their gear level and asses how well they can do what they need to do. DPS not being hit by red circles, using threat drops at the right time, you know, the things people need to know and be able to execute in order to be competitive. If they can't get it down in a reasonable amount of time then they're rotated out of the operation for someone else to come in so that the other 15 people aren't having their time (which we're all paying for, mind you) wasted. As soon as we run the raid again and get to that mechanic though we'd pull he/she back in to run it again.

So, let's say we're in your situation and we've got this awesome guy that's come along and been a part of our guild for a long time; it just so happens that he just flat out SUCKS at mechanics. Well, we'll run him and run him and run him week after week on the mechanics he can't get down until he either learns them or gives up. If that person really wants to be here and improve so that they can be part of the team and pull their weight then they'll keep trying and trying until they learn what to do and develop raiding skills. Practice makes perfect, and even though some of us learn faster than others none of us were born with the ability to run raid mechanics. I remember back when Colonel Daksh used to one shot the tank if he were hit by the boss's laser eyes. Our tank just couldn't get it down so my other guildmates and I would sit on our speeders and just watch him do the dance for hours each day until he became proficient at knowing when to move and how to move his character effectively.

Gist of it:
1) Have them find out where they're deficient
2) If it's mechanics have them run the mechanic they suck at over and over again but rotate them out of the operation after a good number of tries so that the other raiders don't feel like they're having their time wasted/getting uber bored
3) Have people help train this person with a spec/rotation/stat priorities

If you're person is serious about being with you guys and pulling his/her weight then they'll log in and work on improving themselves. Remember, you're not doing this to be a dick, but to push people to be the best they can be as well as making it fun for everyone!
Just what we do, if any of this helps you decide what you should do then that's awesome, if not, then that's cool too
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TyrKartelos's Avatar


TyrKartelos
01.13.2013 , 11:09 PM | #7
If they are in your guild then dont be a dick about it. Give him guides or have someone of the same class teach him better ways to use his abilities. Also it helps to explain bosses etc. before getting into battle. It might take some time to explain mechanics to him if he is as slow as you make him seem but that is the price you need to pay I suppose. Finally if you just cant get through you may want to consider just kicking him from the guild since he is "dead weight".

DataBeaver's Avatar


DataBeaver
01.14.2013 , 05:14 AM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by NotRonin View Post
The hardest 'mechanics' in the game right now is TFB Hm Operator IX, and it consist of people remembering what their colour is. It's not rocket science or abstract mathematics, I'm pretty sure everyone can move in and out of colour circles.
Descending the platforms at Soa seems to be surprisingly hard. My last two attempts at it through group finder have failed because half the people died when descending. I'm not quite sure if it was the healers that didn't heal enough, or the other people who didn't stay where the healers could heal them.

haliy's Avatar


haliy
01.14.2013 , 05:53 AM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by DataBeaver View Post
Descending the platforms at Soa seems to be surprisingly hard. My last two attempts at it through group finder have failed because half the people died when descending. I'm not quite sure if it was the healers that didn't heal enough, or the other people who didn't stay where the healers could heal them.
How... just how??? It's 2 mechanics. Jump down to the next level when the platforms are there and kill off the devices... I could only hope they would know how to pay attention to their own hp to see if they need healed or not.
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_Darkstar's Avatar


_Darkstar
01.14.2013 , 06:18 AM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by AshlaBoga View Post
Tell them that it's only a game and that not being a good raider doesn't mean anything because it's just a video game.
So it is only a game but you don't think it is worth enjoying it with your friend because success is too important to you?

If I was ever in this situation I would re-assess my own priorities and if raid success meant more to me than actually playing with someone I like then I would probably quit the game because it was doing me more harm than good.
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