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PvE Guide to the Lethality Sniper by B'oard

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Gunslinger / Sniper
PvE Guide to the Lethality Sniper by B'oard

paowee's Avatar


paowee
01.15.2013 , 01:29 PM | #41
Updated:


VI. OPS TRAINING DUMMY PARSES

What is good about the Lethality / Engineering spec is that it covers ALL the basics rules and rotations you need to follow if you had went Full Lethality. Learn the Hybrid spec first and you learn Full Lethality at the same time. Two birds with one stone! It covers the basic CG - CD - Cull rotation and makes you a master of your energy bar. Learn Hybrid and then try out Full Lethality once again and I promise you it will be so much more easier to play!

Once you are ready, Combat Log, Mox and all, begin the fight by casting:

OS - AMBUSH. then put the following debuffs
CG - CD - SS. Immediately pop your Adrenal, Relic and TA then use
Cull - EP. After using Cull and Explosive Probe hit ADRENALINE PROBE followed by
IP - SoS. Hit your Laze Target buff and then do a
LS - Cull.

That will be your ~opener rotation for both Hybrid and ~Full Lethality. At my current gear it usually puts out at the very least 3000 DPS. The point of this opener, which is also called the MAX DPS Lethality / Engineering Rotation with Orbital Strike and Adrenaline Probe is to do as much upfront damage as possible in the shortest amount of time in the beginning of the fight in order to push the dummy parses and thus, raise your AVERAGE DPS. After this opener go ahead and do a 5 minute parse of your Sustainable Lethality / Engineering Rotation with Orbital Strike. With Orbital Strike. If you don't use your OS everytime it's up you will lower your DPS.

To break it down:

1. Begin with Max DPS Lethality / Engineering Rotation with Orbital Strike and Adrenaline Probe
2. Continue for 5 minutes, with Sustainable Lethality / Engineering Rotation with Orbital Strike
3. When AP becomes available repeat a Max DPS Lethality / Engineering Rotation with Orbital Strike and Adrenaline Probe
Note: You can go past 5 minutes if you want to end your parse with a MAX DPS Rotation. Ending the fight, for example with the last tick of Orbital Strike will raise and bump up your average DPS.

Some things that will lower your average DPS include using Rifle Shot ~3 times in a row (happens when you mess up your regen and spend too much time in the sub 60 bracket, having your DoTs wear off (happens once in a while... , having your DoTs wear off while channeling Cull, and not using ORBITAL STRIKE everytime it becomes available. You need to use it even if you don't have AP / TA available. With these tips I have helped 2 friends who are new to the Sniper raise their DPS by ~150-200! Let me know if it works for you!


Updated the Intro:

Both the Lethality and Engineering Tree in the current game are primarily DoT skill trees. Playing the Lethality and Hybrid Specs involve putting down DoTs on your target (at the very least 2 DoTs as Lethality, and at the very most, 6 DoTs as Hybrid) and then staying in cover and chaneling abilities for ~9 seconds and then re-dotting again. If you are looking to push charts, the DoT spec sniper can do just the trick. Note that Lethality and Lethality / Engineering both revolve around CG - CD - Cull. As such this guide can also help Lethality Snipers with rotations and hopefully learn something new as well. The intent of this guide is to help Snipers become more familiar with some PVE rotations required to play the DoT specs of their class: Full Lethality and the Lethality / Engineering Hybrid.

Added:

ToFN DPS Leaderboards to show how much Hybrid can put out single target.
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=534251

=======================================
COMING SOON:
Advanced Lethality / Engineering rotation
Videos of the rotations in Operations
=======================================
Republic < Intrepid > The Harbinger slinger sage vanguard dps
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dhowl's Avatar


dhowl
01.15.2013 , 04:07 PM | #42
First time we did a 16man Asa Hm today. I was using the hybrid build shown in this guide on the first 2 bosses.. If youre interested, i posted the result below. Top50 dmg for all 4 bosses pn Torparse, though the dreadguards probably wont be counted, cause i died right before the boss .
http://www.torparse.com/a/100297
This is my current build:
http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/characte...d-f497eb72ec74

paowee's Avatar


paowee
01.15.2013 , 06:21 PM | #43
[delete]
Republic < Intrepid > The Harbinger slinger sage vanguard dps
swtorboard.org dps blog.class guides.end-game stuff
16 man | 8 man DPS leaderboards | Galactic Starfighter Records

paowee's Avatar


paowee
01.15.2013 , 06:38 PM | #44
Quote: Originally Posted by dhowl View Post
First time we did a 16man Asa Hm today. I was using the hybrid build shown in this guide on the first 2 bosses.. If youre interested, i posted the result below. Top50 dmg for all 4 bosses pn Torparse, though the dreadguards probably wont be counted, cause i died right before the boss .
http://www.torparse.com/a/100297
This is my current build:
http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/characte...d-f497eb72ec74
This is your Council Fight as Hybrid http://www.torparse.com/a/100297. It looks like you started with IP - CG - CD then Cull. >__<! You should always try to begin with the MAX DPS Rotation as shown in the video below. This applies to both Lethality and Lethality / Engineering specs. Also you used Explosive Probe every cooldown so that's good. But you did not use Orbital Strike at all? That's one of our best DPS abilities and should be used every time it's up.


Quote:
Start the fight with:
MAX DPS Rotation with Orbital Strike and Adrenaline Probe

Continue with your sustainable rotation and use OS every cooldown:
Sustained Rotation with Orbital Strike
Republic < Intrepid > The Harbinger slinger sage vanguard dps
swtorboard.org dps blog.class guides.end-game stuff
16 man | 8 man DPS leaderboards | Galactic Starfighter Records

MuratReis's Avatar


MuratReis
01.15.2013 , 06:49 PM | #45
Quote: Originally Posted by MuratReis View Post
Thanks for the info. I'll keep practicing with the spec and will try it on some of the 1-target operation bosses after I get it down. Here are my stats; I'm open to comments:

Unbuffed with no stims.

Dmg: 1084-1185
Bonus dmg: 629.9
Acc 99.89
Crit::36.49 (Crit Rating: 384)
Crit Mult: 75.82
The crit rating jumped up after I switched out the crystals in my rifle and knife. Perhaps I'll swap out one item modification piece. I believe there is a +surge, +power mod. That seems to be the best mod I could put in the mix now. As for what gear I'm using, I'm gradually upgrading everything to DG levels.
''Ralph McQuarrie is the gentle giant of the Star Wars Universe.'' George Lucas

dhowl's Avatar


dhowl
01.15.2013 , 07:08 PM | #46
Quote: Originally Posted by paowee View Post
stuff
I partially i agree with you. You should only use the max dps rotation only when there is there no risk the tank losing aggro. For example when we were doing TfB the tank wasnt able to hold aggro on the tentacles when i was trying to do max dps.
As for why i didnt use OS. Try to read the buffs from the ciphas and kelsara. If you do dmg to them, while heirad is still alive, they do more dmg. Our tanks attack heirad, after they got aggro on their bosses. And besides, we were no where near hitting enrage timers on the bosses, so there was really no point in trying to do the absolut best dmg i possible.

paowee's Avatar


paowee
01.15.2013 , 07:13 PM | #47
Quote: Originally Posted by dhowl View Post
I partially i agree with you. You should only use the max dps rotation only when there is there no risk the tank losing aggro. For example when we were doing TfB the tank wasnt able to hold aggro on the tentacles when i was trying to do max dps.
As for why i didnt use OS. Try to read the buffs from the ciphas and kelsara. If you do dmg to them, while heirad is still alive, they do more dmg. Our tanks attack heirad, after they got aggro on their bosses. And besides, we were no where near hitting enrage timers on the bosses, so there was really no point in trying to do the absolut best dmg i possible.
I understand. The way we do this fight is that the other bosses are pulled away from Heirad far enough so that the operative and the sniper can use their Orbital at the start. Me and the op casts our Orbital then the Ciphas and Keisara are pulled over to the sides.

Did you prefer Hybrid over Lethality for this fight?
Republic < Intrepid > The Harbinger slinger sage vanguard dps
swtorboard.org dps blog.class guides.end-game stuff
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dhowl's Avatar


dhowl
01.15.2013 , 07:40 PM | #48
In 16man hybrid is pretty viable. I was always on the boss and didnt have to switch to the adds during the 3rd phase because we had enough dd for that.
This goes for twh as well. I pretty much only attacked the boss and the small adds, didnt have to attack the jelouse male, thanks to the high amount of dds. If i had to switch targets often i probably would get into energy trouble.
Hybrid should also work really well on kephess, unlesss you are on orb duty, wich i wasnt today. Unfortunately i forgot to respec after 3rd boss.

Ardarell_Solo's Avatar


Ardarell_Solo
01.16.2013 , 04:41 AM | #49
Quote: Originally Posted by Synavix View Post
IP won't affect Cull, so most people will use it first to maximize the amount of time that CG and CD are up together, allowing them more room for energy management and Rifle Shots. There is some debate as to whether the Gunslinger version is acting the same, or whether it's acting as an extra DoT (*only* when Vital Shot or Shrap Bomb wear off, it never works as a third DoT), but it's really a non-issue since Cull/Wounding should only be used with CG and CD up anyway.
I'm pretty sure for Gunslingers Shock Charge (= IP) does count as a Dot for Wounding Shots (Cull) and it does also add to the other two dots, since all my parses show three bleeding effects: Shock Charge (= IP), Vital Shot (= CD) and Shrap Bomb (= CG). They have about the same percentage of overall damage (which seems logical as I always apply them together and "use" them up with two Wounding Shots (Cull) in every rotation.

I'm now in the office so I can't upload a log, but in German Forums there has been a lot of discussion about this and the majority tends to think this is actually not intended i.e. a bug, since the tooltip does not describe Shock Charge (IP) as a bleeding effect (opposed to Vital Shot (CD) and Shrap Bomb(CG)), but parses always show otherwise. You can also actually see the effect on your opponent's health bar, when you use Wounding Shots (Cull) with just Vital Shot (CD) and Shrap Bomb (CG) on the target and then do the same with Shock Charge (IP) on the target additionally: You can clearly see the increase in health bar melting speed during the Wounding Shots (Cull) channeling :-)

I'm curious, why you say Shock Charge (IP) never works as an additional Dot for slingers, when the other two are already active, because if that were true, the bleeding damage from Shock Charge should be significantly lower in my parses than that of the other two Dots, but as I said, the three are roughly equal. Can you maybe share a link, from where you got that information?

This difference simplifys the rotation for Slingers btw, since you just always apply the three dots first, then use sabotage charge (EP) to regain energy with Wounding Shots (Cull), then do Speedshot (SoS) and then depending on wether Cool Head (AP) is ready you either go for XS-Freighter (OS) plus Cool Head (AP) or 1-2 Flurrys (RS) and then finish by the second Wounding Shots (Cull).
By then the three dots will have expired and you start over.

The main target is to keep all three dots active until the second Wounding Shots (Cull) ist finished, so there's not that much room for variation, especially since energy management is even more difficult here. You basically insert Flurry (RS), whenever you're under 70, except when Sabotage Charge (EP) is ready, because if you use it before Wounding Shots (Cull) and Speedhot (SoS) you can go to 60 energy and still activate Wounding Shots (Cull), you'll be alright by the time Speedhot (Sos) is finished.

Since Sabotage Charge (EP) won't be ready for every wounding shots (Cull) you replace it with Flurry (RS), when it's not. Rule is, use Sabotage Charge (EP) before Wounding Shots (Cull) for Max Energy Regen, even if Wounding Shots (Cull= comes off CD some split seconds earlier (which tends to happen a lot when you go through this rotation severall times over).

As in the rotation described in this thread you replace Speedhot - Flurry - (Flurry) (SoS - RS - (RS)) by XS-FReighter (OS) - Flurry (RS), whenever Freighter (OS) comes off Cooldown but Cool Head (AP) is not ready yet.

If I have enough energy I also replace the two Flurrys (RSs) before the second Wounding Shots (Cull) by either Aimed Shot (Ambush) oder Lucky Charged Burst (Lazed Snipe).

Thoughts?
El'ethon (Sentinel) | Rickmyron (Gunslinger) | Alreegan (Sage)
Dacs (Commando) | Vayus (Guardian) | Craeg (Scoundrel)
<Taking the Jawas to Alderaan>
T3-M4

Synavix's Avatar


Synavix
01.16.2013 , 11:12 AM | #50
Quote: Originally Posted by Ardarell_Solo View Post
I'm pretty sure for Gunslingers Shock Charge (= IP) does count as a Dot for Wounding Shots (Cull) and it does also add to the other two dots, since all my parses show three bleeding effects: Shock Charge (= IP), Vital Shot (= CD) and Shrap Bomb (= CG). They have about the same percentage of overall damage (which seems logical as I always apply them together and "use" them up with two Wounding Shots (Cull) in every rotation.

I'm now in the office so I can't upload a log, but in German Forums there has been a lot of discussion about this and the majority tends to think this is actually not intended i.e. a bug, since the tooltip does not describe Shock Charge (IP) as a bleeding effect (opposed to Vital Shot (CD) and Shrap Bomb(CG)), but parses always show otherwise. You can also actually see the effect on your opponent's health bar, when you use Wounding Shots (Cull) with just Vital Shot (CD) and Shrap Bomb (CG) on the target and then do the same with Shock Charge (IP) on the target additionally: You can clearly see the increase in health bar melting speed during the Wounding Shots (Cull) channeling :-)

I'm curious, why you say Shock Charge (IP) never works as an additional Dot for slingers, when the other two are already active, because if that were true, the bleeding damage from Shock Charge should be significantly lower in my parses than that of the other two Dots, but as I said, the three are roughly equal. Can you maybe share a link, from where you got that information?
Just to clarify one thing from the start to make sure we're on the same page, but when I say that Shock Charge works or doesn't work as an additional DoT, I only mean in terms of Wounding Shots. As a standalone DoT it works fine every time at full damage.

Anyway, most of the information I could find on the English forums is somewhat outdated, so I just went ahead and did a very brief/simple parse upload testing it myself.

Sniper: http://www.tortools.com/?player=%40A...ll&encounter=0
Gunslinger: http://www.tortools.com/?player=%40S...ll&encounter=0

(Meant to use another parse upload site that's cleaner, but forgot most have a rule against too short of parses)

Each "encounter" is simply DoTs + 2 Culls or Wounding Shots, repeated 3 times each. Encounters should be in this order (in reverse, actually, because of how this site lists them. Last encounter is listed on "top"), although I may have messed up the order/number on my gunslinger:

- Corrosive Dart / Vital Shot only
- Corrosive Grenade / Shrap Bomb only
- Int Probe / Shock Charge only
- Corrosive Dart /Vital Shot + Int Probe / Shock Charge
- Corrosive Grenade / Shrap Bomb + Int Probe / Shock Charge
- Corrosive Dart / Vital Shot + Corrosive Grenade / Shrap Bomb ("normal" lethality dots)
- CD/VS + CG/SB + IP/SC (all three)

I removed my proc relic from my sniper to give a cleaner parse, but the damage is a little skewed based off of crits anyway. What you really want to look at is the number of times Cull or Wounding Shots tick.

In the sniper parses:
CD and CG only each parsed to 12 Culls (3 baseline, 3 from *one* DoT, times 2 culls).
Interrogation Probe only parsed to 6 Culls (3 baseline, none from DoT, times 2 culls).
CD with IP and CG with IP each parsed to 12 Culls, same as when only one DoT was used.
CD and CG together (as well as CD + CG + IP) parsed to 18 Culls (3 baseline, 6 from *two* DoTs, times 2 culls).

At no point did I parse 24 Culls, as would be expected if IP worked as a dot (3 baseline + 3 CG + 3 CD + 3 IP, times 2 culls).


In the gunslinger parses:
VS, SB, and SC all parsed to 18 Culls (3 baseline, 3 offhand, 3 from *one* DoT, times 2 wounding shots).
All variations of 2 DoTs (both including and excluding SC) parsed to 24 Culls (3 baseline, 3 offhand, 6 from *two* DoTs, times 2 wounding shots).

However, with all 3 DoTs up, although you would expect 30 Culls, you still only see 24, meaning that WS caps out at 2 DoTs regardless.


So final verdict, IP *never* counts as a DoT for Cull, and SC only counts as a DoT for wounding shots when you have 2 or less DoTs present. A fairly distinct advantage for PvP when there are cleanses and rotations are sloppy, but in ideal PvE rotations it's less of an issue, although might lead to some interesting low-energy strategies.