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Constructive Feedback Upon the Three Healing Classes, from a Mercenary's Perspective

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Constructive Feedback Upon the Three Healing Classes, from a Mercenary's Perspective

PerinnAybara's Avatar


PerinnAybara
01.07.2013 , 06:23 AM | #11
Just so you know, I'm not talking about stun immunity. I'm talking about the cover operatives get, as opposed to snipers. Mainly I'm trying to state that

Mercs, when they utilize cover, are immune to the Force Leap/Force Charge, Pulls, but still vulnerable to knockbacks, stuns, interrupts, and the 10 meter leap obliterate. Cover is off the gcd, so when stationary there's no reason for a healer operative to not be in cover. We should be able to be lept to if moving at all, but not be able to be lept too if say we take the high ground in hutt ball. As a Mercenary/Commando, I am always forced to drop down to a less advantage position because I otherwise act as a leap post. It shouldn't be that way. It would mean my positioning matters more, and ranged classes interrupts would actually be more important in fights. (right now melee get so many interrupts/cc, that a melee will catch every interrupt.)

As for the Run and Gun idea, I honestly don't think it's a bad thing, but from what I read it was a channeled on the move ability? I assume knockbacks, interrupts and stuns will still stop it, but I mean, it seems a bit too much of a change in the meta for Bioware to actually commit to something like that.

They could do things like give healing scan immunity to interrupts, or make it so that when we have the Critical efficiency buff, our next rapid scan is immune to interrupt or lowers the cast time by half or .5 seconds. That would make it in line with other 3 points skills of that tier and effectively be a large buff to supercharge gas cylinder.

I definitely agree on the increase back to kolto residue. I also think supercharge gas cylinder should be returned to 10% increased healing so it's more pivotal other then a way to refresh healing scan when interrupted. The heat reduction of -16 would be nice again though.

So many ways the Developers could quickly help mercenary and commandos. I look forward to seeing how they surprise us in the coming patches.
Character: Mathrim Cauthon, 50 Mercenary on Prophecy of the Five

PerinnAybara's Avatar


PerinnAybara
01.07.2013 , 06:50 AM | #12
I know I'm double posting, but I felt like I had to repost something I wrote long long time ago in this thread.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=565610

I as a Valor ranked 100 Mercenary Healer, who has played many many games, quite a few of them ranked shall share my input

Mercenary healing took a nerf in patch 1.2. At the time, people didn't know what an interrupt was hence, mercenary healing was at it's peak.

The nerf was targeting mainly our resource management. Because of it, we have a 3 point 4th tier talent called critical efficiency, which is worse at reducing heat then the comparative energy management of the 4th tier arsenal talent. They effectively doubled our rapid scan cost after we use a healing scan. Additionally they added 16 heat cost to our formerly free talent, Kolto shell, and reduce the amount of heat vented from supercharge gas cylinder. Put all together they managed to completely cripple our resource management.

As time went on they proceeded to nerf the things that made our single target heals so attractive. They nerfed our crit chance, from 2, 4, 6, a tier 1 talent, to 1, 2, 3. Then they proceeded to reduce the healing received from a second tier talent in arsenal that gave us an additional 6% healing received to 2% because we were difficult to kill. Despite the fact that we didn't do as good of a job of keeping everyone else up.

Then we got a nerf on our ranged stun, which allowed us to keep warriors at range, or kite a bit better. It really hurts us because our other 30 meter stun is a 2 second cast spell, concussion missile. Which is actually really useful in conjunction with powersurge. But in all honesty I'd trade it in a heart beat for an operative grenade. They also made our kolto bomb slow people for 3 seconds by 50%. Which is actually pretty nice, except there is no way to get out of range of people's gap closers without a piller.

For that nerf, they did several things, they changed our 5 point 5th tier talent, which basically gave our heals an additional 15% surge into a 3 point talent with the same effect, thus freeing up two points to put into something else. To address our self heal, they made it so kolto shell will tick every time we autoattack the enemy. It's a pointless talent, because you're not going to be shooting an enemy, you'll be shooting your ally with your rapid shots. Not to mention ticking faster on Koltoshell doesn't help us out too much since it costs 16 heat in the first place.

We do have one advantage though. With our Energy Shield, we can not be interrupted, which means 15 seconds where we are like a sniper. We still can be stunned and mezzed so you have to be careful when you use it. It's best used in conjunction with a medpack, overload, and a expertise adrenal. By doing so you literally cannot die for the duration of the shield. Afterwards, hard cast your spells, draw out their stuns. With a talented 4th tier talent, you get an additional 20% healing received with the shield up. So even if they focus you, cross heals will keep you up until you can start healing yourself. It's basically a second life with this combo.

Now here's the drawback. Once your shield is down, you're very easy to lock down. It has a two minute cooldown, and unlike an operative who can stealth out, sap someone, heal back up to full, and start healing somewhere else, they know where we are. Not to mention even though we are uninterrupted, we still have to pace ourselves or else we'll overheat. Seriously, our burst heals really take a toll on heat management. When you get to 80 heat and don't have vent heat, you're healing output is cut dramatically. In rateds, this is the time my team ignores the mercenary healer. Sorcerers can constantly re position themselves, cure force debuffs, and right now add insane utility with their bubbles. Those bubbles are awesome, specially when a smash jug jumps to you, while still in lag, pops off their bubble, and then smashes everyone for 7k while they're forced to watch in horror.

I remember one time my friend's republic smash guardian decided to sit on me the entire match. In the civil war, he dealt 400k damage to me alone, and killed me 8 times. I'm really one of the hardest mercenaries to kill in the game so that's saying something.

Random story aside, we have to compete with the tech heal. Operative output is higher then us even when they are blind, focused and ecetera. Their rolling dots allow them to constantly heal four people, and they have in my opinion, almost as good single target heals as we do. Especially since they have a better resource management, which properly managed will not ever let them stop their healing.

Anyway, basically because Operatives and Sorcerers have higher healing output and more utility. Very very few rated groups will bring a mercenary along, especially in the top ranks.

Sincerely,
Elite Warlord Mathrim Cauthon
Character: Mathrim Cauthon, 50 Mercenary on Prophecy of the Five

nOITACINROFILAC's Avatar


nOITACINROFILAC
01.09.2013 , 05:52 AM | #13
I don't think bioware reads the forums.

Tough luck.

Boyana's Avatar


Boyana
01.09.2013 , 07:26 AM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by PerinnAybara View Post

As for Sorcerer/Sages, with even their hybrid talented bubble Sorcerer/Sages, with their superb utility still output more healing then Mercenary/Commandos. Sorcererís recently acquired a stronger version of Mercenary/Commandoís 31 point talent 21 second cool down emergency scan, on a 30 second cool down for a self-heal. Combined with recklessness a sorcererís burst healing potential is quite potent. Add to that, a Sorcererís bubble is proactive (can be casted before the ally/self has taken damage) and itís a stronger version of our emergency scan as well on a 21 second individual lockout timer. The ability to consume health for more resources is something a Mercenary/Commando dreams of when heís out of resources. Add the ability to relocate allows a sorcerer to hard cast more heals when required.
I love your post. This is what I think:
In my honest opinion Emergency Scan is just way better than Sorcerer's instant heal because it can be used on other players.
Yes, Sorcerers have bubble that can be talented into annoying "bubble pop". Thing is, they are not really healers and should be seen as some sort of annoying support. It is not a healing build. I cannot and will never give my HP in a hand of a hybrid healer . Also, it will soon be fixed and since we are talking about the future, we can delete the bubble pop right now.
One more thing: I would gladly trade my Consumption for Vent Heat. There is no place for it in PvP against organized team. If there is, then the opposing team just does not have the damage or mine has a lot of healers.

So, I do think Instant heal and Vent Heat are better than Sorc's heal and Consumption, but...there is one thing I would like Mercs to have: Jet boost. It would be just like Force Speed.

To make Merc healers better they could add:
1. Jet Boost (Force Speed)
2. Vent Heat cooldown reduced

With that implemented you would also have (I will point what is in my opinion better or same):
1. Amazing shield that gives you immunity (Sorcerer has no immunity, but has bubble. I do not count Force Speed as some immunity -.-)
2. Instant Heal that you can cast on other people (Sorcerer cannot. They have Perp. heal but I usually compare it with Rapid Shots.)
3. Small aoe shield combined with aoe heal and slow for up to 5 enemies (Sorc's aoe heal is better only if people are standing in it for its duration. Has longer cooldown. Has no reduced damage but still has bubble)
4. One not-that-good Kolto Shell but still a shield that can heal you a little bit (Sorc's have bubble)
5. Ability to make your next spell instant (Sorcerer does not have it)
6. (Instant) 8 sec cc (Sorcerer has to be specced into it to make Whirlwind instant)
7. Abilitty to make your next heal cost no heat (Sorcer does not have that but does have Instant Heal that costs no Force. On the other hand, Mercs have Rapid Shots that do not heal much but have only gc and cost no heat)
8. Vent heat (In current game, if both healers are out of resources, Vent heat is better)
10. Heavy Armour (Sorc's have light armor, but we can say they have bubble)



With all that combined I think adding Jet Boost (Force Speed) would be fine. Having Vent Heat on lower cooldown would just make Merc's complete healers to go against DPS race that happens in WZs. They do need some sort of escape.

Conclusion: For me, in my hands, for my play style in current state of the game: Merc > Sorc. It is not all in numbers at the end of the WarZone. The only time when I think Sorc > Merc is in Huttball. In every other game I would go with my Merc.

Long Story short: Give to Mercs Jet Boost (Force Speed) and reduced CD on Vent Heat.

That is my opinion. If I made some mistakes, sorry. I am sleepy.

Spoletta's Avatar


Spoletta
01.09.2013 , 07:45 AM | #15
Any changes that affects pve will never happen.
Now, i'm just throwing a random suggestion here, but what if interrupts and CC gave you supercharge stacks? And maybe reduce the CD on the shield?
Wouldn't this fix the class without any change to pve capabilities?

Boyana's Avatar


Boyana
01.09.2013 , 08:03 AM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Spoletta View Post
Any changes that affects pve will never happen.
Now, i'm just throwing a random suggestion here, but what if interrupts and CC gave you supercharge stacks? And maybe reduce the CD on the shield?
Wouldn't this fix the class without any change to pve capabilities?
Well, not much can affect PvE. The only thing that could is if we ask them to increase healing done by XXXX.

It would be nice for people to waste their interrupt when your Energy Shield is up.

venomlash's Avatar


venomlash
01.09.2013 , 09:51 AM | #17
My main is a Gunnery commando at heart, but I'm experienced with all three trees in PvE. (In PvP I've only done Gunnery.) I would greatly support allowing us to put Trauma Probe on multiple people at once. Of the three healers, we definitely have the weakest heals-over-time.
Quote: Originally Posted by MichelleArcher View Post
Hey there, all! This thread has passed the dreaded 1,000 post limit, and is now in fire. Thanks for the fun, but we feel this discussion as run its course. We will not be restarting this thread.
Jarrant Gartin, Gunnery Commando, Spark of Hope, Begeren Colony

PerinnAybara's Avatar


PerinnAybara
01.09.2013 , 09:51 AM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Spoletta View Post
Any changes that affects pve will never happen.
Now, i'm just throwing a random suggestion here, but what if interrupts and CC gave you supercharge stacks? And maybe reduce the CD on the shield?
Wouldn't this fix the class without any change to pve capabilities?
Depends on how many stacks, and it would help.

As for changes that affects pve.

Most of my suggestions wouldn't really interfere with pve.

Rapid scan being uninterruptable after a healing scan (with the critical efficiency talent) wouldn't do anything for PVE. So would a cover like mechanic which merely prevented force charge, (again not talking about an entrench.) Things like increasing back the amount of healing received also doesn't affect pve really. I would love to have energy rebounder be a lower talent. Would be very very useful for mercenary healers.


Pretty sure mercs are good tank healers in pve, but they still definitely don't have the highest healing output when it comes to raid wide healing. Or burst healing. We do decently well for sustain, as long as we properly manage heat, but when we burst heal we don't really have a good mechanic of recovering.

So things like increasing healing recieved by 5% with kolto residue, increase back the damage reduced by the shield brought on by a super charged kolto bomb, and increasing healing done by 10% when utilizing supercharged gas all wouldn't really break the balance of healers. Operatives and sorcs already outheal mercenaries anyway with a much easier resource mechanic. I remember when 1.2 hit, people talked about how the changes were too harsh and a whole bunch of mercenaries quit. Well they were right.

As for sorcerer's being worse then mercenaries, it depends truely. In rated play? No way is that the case, but for regular warzones, perhaps. ALso bubble sorcerers are real healers. My friends Joeydeluxe, Hairyzac, Jadedcupcake, Oseva, and Ownedjoo all can heal a ton in bubble spec. Their healing output is less then puddle spec, but still greater than a mercenaries heals easily.

As for a vent heat, your self heal in a way is towards that. You can consume consume, pop recklessness, then use the strong self heal. Force back with no hp loss. Not to mention, a sorcerer in full heal spec can heal forever. A mercenary almost always will run into heat problems in warzones.

I would welcome a change to vent heat to be a minute, or 40 seconds, and make our next heal or damage attack heal for 50% more or something! Kinda like a Smash Juggernauts rage gain ability. But that definitely would effect pve quite a bit.

Referring to SpaniardInfinity post upon kolto shell, I agree wholeheartedly with you. Although I kind've like the bugginess sometimes since it heals for more (too bad so much overhealing) Honestly, I would be pretty happy if they changed kolto shell into a rolling dot heal like a more powerful version of an operative dot heal.

As for tech override, I would love for them to lower the cooldown upon it in some shape or form. I'm severely jealous of a powertech's explosive fuel. (25% increase to crit chance for 15 seconds) It would be nice if tech override/powersurge was a 30 or even 20 second cooldown. That would return much of the usefullness of concussion missile, and grant us back some of our maneuverability. Would be a cooldown almost as awesome as explosive fuel!

I'm suprised people haven't gone, Wall of text, over 9000!
Character: Mathrim Cauthon, 50 Mercenary on Prophecy of the Five

Spoletta's Avatar


Spoletta
01.09.2013 , 10:27 AM | #19
Properly written text walls aren't that bad, especially when they make sense.

cashogy's Avatar


cashogy
01.09.2013 , 10:34 AM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by venomlash View Post
My main is a Gunnery commando at heart, but I'm experienced with all three trees in PvE. (In PvP I've only done Gunnery.) I would greatly support allowing us to put Trauma Probe on multiple people at once. Of the three healers, we definitely have the weakest heals-over-time.
that is because Merc has the highest single target healing.

Trauma Probe/Kolto Probe really should be able to be put on everyone in your group. Operative HoTs can be, and so can Sorc bubbles.

i think that there should be some kind of active cooldown reduction on Emergency Scan/Bacta Infusion. im thinking either "being interrupted reduces the active cooldown by Xs" or "critical heals reduce the active cooldown by Xs". having interrupts reduce the active cooldown would probably be better for complementing the overall spec imo

oh, and Kolto Bomb/Kolto Missile should really heal for more. an AOE that barely crits for 2.5k is very underwhelming.