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Sage weaksauce in PVP


RTCBrad's Avatar


RTCBrad
12.17.2012 , 02:54 PM | #1
So I'm totally confused. I'm a sage, I have 957 expertise, I still get hit for over 6k smash in a few instances even as high as 7k I really have no clue what I can do about that. It seems I can't actually outheal anyones damage i.e. if they are shooting me 1o1 they dps faster than I heal. Bearing in my mind my biggest heal is a 2.2 sec cast and nigh on useless if I'm fighting anyone with a brain. That leaves me with 3 skills to heal myself one is a long CD self heal, the other two are slow dots, neither is enough to fend off anyone really.

Damage wise it seems every class totally outdoes a sage. My FiB crits from between 1.7k - 3.5k depending on peoples gear. my TK ticks are really low unless I crit, the dots are really low even with crits.

I'm just confused how exactly sages are supposed to do anything in PvP I've never seen a sage do well, I've seen some do better than me, but none do well. It seems the only thing I can do and be effective in anyway is try my best not be seen and spam heals, and run like the wind if I'm spotted.

I play 21/4/16, since full heal seemed even worse, I had the attacking power of a wet paper bag and pretty much no way of defending myself since as I said earlier I can't actually outheal anyones damage. So yeah I'm just a little stumped as to how a sage can actually be of any use, there must be a way. I think we are seriously gimped compared to other classes though, it shouldn't be this much of a pain to figure out. Considering how easy most classes have it with extremely simple derp specs that an untrained chimp could play.

SoonerJBD's Avatar


SoonerJBD
12.17.2012 , 04:35 PM | #2
Get better gear and learn to kite. With less than 1,000 expertise, you are going to get dominated no matter what class you play. Sage healers in full war hero are an absolute pain to try to kill. Use line of sight to your advantage by ducking around corners to cast a quick heal. You should also be getting a guard from any tanks in the group, which will lower the damage you take by half if you stick close to a tank. Don't be shy about asking for one at the start. You might also want to look at some of the videos successful sages have posted on the forums. It will give you a good idea of how to move, where to stand, etc.

I use full balance, and I get at least 300k damage in every warzone, 500k or more if I'm getting protection or heals. I've seen Sage healers put out 600k or more heals in pug warzones. We need some buffs to make anything other than a stun bubble build viable in ranked, but we do fine in regular warzones.

NoFishing's Avatar


NoFishing
12.18.2012 , 03:16 PM | #3
For healing, I go with a 22/17/2 build here. The stunning bubble applied to ourselves and knockback with root give us breathers where we can either escape or heal up. In full war hero, I can at least survive 1v1 long enough for backup to arrive or to escape. And we can grief the entire enemy team by applying stunning bubbles to our team mates...but the practice is frowned upon and will be nerfed in the future.

That said, AoE burst damage in PvP from leaping smash monkeys is completely out of control. Had a match last night where my team was a couple of sentinels, a guardian, a vanguard, a couple of sages and commandos. The enemy team was 1 operative, 1 powertech, and 6 juggs/maras. Coming out of the Voidstar spawn they lept and smashed us simultaneously, killing half the team in 2 seconds. We never had a chance to spread out, and never mind making it anywhere close to the doors when attacking. Trying to defend was a joke, but at least a short one.

chrisronline's Avatar


chrisronline
12.18.2012 , 04:27 PM | #4
My sage has around 1350 expertise and I still get rocked for 6-7k smashes and that's just the state of that class right now - they are going to hit and hit hard. I'm full balance and I don't find it difficult to perform well in PuG warzones (99% of how I play). The key is understanding your role and filling the role effectively - for example, without help, 2+ people focusing me means I will die and there is nothing I can really do about it. I can only hope to disrupt some objective before I die. The way to survive is movement and positioning - experience will teach you where to stand and not stand (which is pretty obvious to most, but takes practice to constantly do well).

Please, please, please understand that you're a support class, especially as a hybrid healer. You excel at controlling the enemy - force lift, force slow, stun, etc. If you're interested, I can post some videos of how I play (I don't pretend to be the best, but I'm not bad).
Nopie Legacy
Bastion, POT5, TOFN

RTCBrad's Avatar


RTCBrad
12.19.2012 , 09:48 AM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by chrisronline View Post
My sage has around 1350 expertise and I still get rocked for 6-7k smashes and that's just the state of that class right now - they are going to hit and hit hard. I'm full balance and I don't find it difficult to perform well in PuG warzones (99% of how I play). The key is understanding your role and filling the role effectively - for example, without help, 2+ people focusing me means I will die and there is nothing I can really do about it. I can only hope to disrupt some objective before I die. The way to survive is movement and positioning - experience will teach you where to stand and not stand (which is pretty obvious to most, but takes practice to constantly do well).

Please, please, please understand that you're a support class, especially as a hybrid healer. You excel at controlling the enemy - force lift, force slow, stun, etc. If you're interested, I can post some videos of how I play (I don't pretend to be the best, but I'm not bad).
Kind of annoying they can run around wacking us for 6-7k tbh. I think sage overall needs quite an overhaul, we were a really competitive class at launch now we are sub par are at pretty much everything. And it takes substantially more effort and is a lot harder and more complex than other classes (glaring at smash derp).

Thanks for the advice though, I do try and manage LOS sometimes it's more difficult especially when you get a bad team and they let all the dps guys beat on me while I'm trying to heal lol. It has made it quite a lot better using the exploding bubbles though to be honest, running away and staying alive those few seconds longer to get an extra heal really helps.

I also have more expertise now 1.1k, which is helping but I'm losing quite a lot of HP and power Vs. my PVE gear, I guess I need some willpower\endurance augments, I'm also trying to stack power now since I've hit 30% crit rate and 75% surge.

NoFishing's Avatar


NoFishing
12.19.2012 , 10:14 AM | #6
General consensus says that expertise between 1200-1300 is optimal. I personally run ~1250, with my PvE belt and bracers. Fully augmented gear is crucial to being competitive now, so you should augment your WH as a minimum.

RTCBrad's Avatar


RTCBrad
12.20.2012 , 03:21 PM | #7
So I'm looking to buy my first ewh relic atm i have a rakata healing relic and battlemaster relic of boundless ages. I generally play exploding bubble heals, occasionally balance/heal hyb and less often full balance. So am I better off with the ewh alacrity relic or the one that heals 477 over time every 10 secs. Thanks .

ClarkNineCD's Avatar


ClarkNineCD
12.20.2012 , 06:29 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by RTCBrad View Post
So I'm looking to buy my first ewh relic atm i have a rakata healing relic and battlemaster relic of boundless ages. I generally play exploding bubble heals, occasionally balance/heal hyb and less often full balance. So am I better off with the ewh alacrity relic or the one that heals 477 over time every 10 secs. Thanks .
The +Power relic.

RTCBrad's Avatar


RTCBrad
12.21.2012 , 01:54 AM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by ClarkNineCD View Post
The +Power relic.
But I already have the bm power relic I can't equip a wh one and bm one can I?

And it will only give me a small bonus over the bm one like 16 resi and I think 17 power whereas another PvP relic will give me +60 resi plus any other stats it has because I'm using a rakata pve relic.

MidichIorian's Avatar


MidichIorian
12.21.2012 , 02:10 AM | #10
My last game, I wanted to heal for a couple of games but since the dps I was matched with in previous games sucked I decided to dps instead. That's usually what it looks like in normal warzones as long as I'm not playing against the best premades on the server. I tend to always heal for more than I dps though. And yes, we lost because some idiot doesnt know what stealth classes are.

Point being, as long as you stick to normal warzones it's you and not the class. That said, I would have had 800K in this game if I had been able to spec for dps instead of survivability so we really need some tweaks. Or if it atleast had been possible to maintain force while zerging in the balance tree.

And yes, even in 1396 expertise I'm still taking hits on 6996. ...so get used to that.