Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer

Flat Expertise Across The Board? More Nerfs To Sorc/Sages?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Flat Expertise Across The Board? More Nerfs To Sorc/Sages?

Sleprock's Avatar

12.10.2012 , 08:05 PM | #101
Quote: Originally Posted by WhiteStriker View Post
PvE is NOT PvP... So why, other than "it's needed in PvE" do you feel that gear progression is important in PvP? Having something to work toward should involve earning a higher position on a leader-board through pure skill, not by having your attacks/heals/defensed buffed by better gear. That is a real objective to work toward. If you want gear items, they could cool cosmetic things, like empty moddable gear and unique color crystals and maybe unique unlocks that don't affect game-play other than in a visual way.
go play guild wars whiner

WhiteStriker's Avatar

12.10.2012 , 08:09 PM | #102
Quote: Originally Posted by Sleprock View Post
go play guild wars whiner
So let me see if I understand your logic correctly; I'm a whiner because I disagreed with you? You still have yet to answer my original question.

Blaskar's Avatar

12.10.2012 , 08:18 PM | #103
Quote: Originally Posted by WhiteStriker View Post
So let me see if I understand your logic correctly; I'm a whiner because I disagreed with you? You still have yet to answer my original question.
The guy needs his expertise to make him a better player. You should be more understanding.

cub-lover's Avatar

12.10.2012 , 08:29 PM | #104
Quote: Originally Posted by Vitellius View Post
I think making the expertise more even is a good move. It promotes skill over gear. It really needs to be this way because at 50, everyone is just thrown in a big pot left to fend for themselves. Sure, the game tries to match evenly matched players, but that doesn't always work, and certainly won't help you at the den. When my agent hit 50, I had to claw my way through death after death up against people wearing better gear.

As for nerfing sorcs/sages....nerf arguments are as old as MMO's. Nobody who has a class that is being nerfed likes it, and they ALWAYS say they are underpowered....always. Whether the nerf is right or wrong is a matter of opinion and can be discussed in its own thread.
Sir i a gree with you completly, having a whole end game stat liek experteise is what murdered 50pvp for imps on my server, i mean in order to get the weekly done on my server imp side you gotta go through 20-40 matches to get it half way done other wise its jsut beign trolsmashed or face steamed by better geared players and the whole gear dependancy is more dumb than ralph in simpsons

Asvarduil's Avatar

12.10.2012 , 08:56 PM | #105
Quote: Originally Posted by Galbatorrix View Post
YES to basically getting rid of expertise. It would bring skill back into the game and make it to where the PVP game has a ton more players to compete with. Also, your gear would still matter due to the other stats. This will only make PVP better, IMO. It would enable everyone to participate instead of just the hard core PVPer's who don't midn the long gear grind.
First: love TOR PvP. That's why I have to take this part right here and totally run with it.

However, hate Expertise. I am a mid-game PvPer, because so many players do not use Expertise gear. I expressed throughout prerelease that there should be no PvP stat; it removes skill from the equation and creates a condition of 'Those Who Play versus Those Who Play Way More'. Forget the fact that I might be a fair PvPer who plays to objectives. Forget that I might pursue 'normal' gear builds in pursuit of a given goal; the PvP stat eats depth. There is typically one, and only one, correct way to PvP.

Flattening the Expertise system won't solve the problem (Expertise-geared players versus non-Expertise geared players), but it will be a great start to ensure that stat-for-stat the matches are more equal. PvP is about skill, teamwork, and objectives, with killing being necessary for that third one, and those first two thwarting the killing. I've always said that the better team, not the better-geared individual, should win, such that the RPG Promise is fulfilled for both sides. As Expertise currently is, this just isn't the case.

I won't stop PvPing - as I said, I love using my eclectic builds to mess with people's heads - but let's face it, over-reliance on Expertise isn't helping the game the same way that the broken Resolve system isn't helping. These are decisions that from a player perspective, we the community see opportunity for vast improvement.
Most epic PvP forum thread ever. | Tales of the Healer - Latest Episode! [08/30/2013]

Captain Kruhnch (Lv.39 Sawbones) - Shadowlands
Cuddlemuffin (Lv.16 Mercenary) - Shadowlands

Piam's Avatar

12.10.2012 , 09:08 PM | #106
Quote: Originally Posted by Knockerz View Post
That's cause they made it really easy. Try large pve raids like in vanilla wow or even bc where one person screwing up will cause a wipe. Now multiply that by 40 players and see how far you get after couple weeks if not months.
Different game...

Yes, end-game PvE in WoW is actually good if you like that sort of thing (and aren't sick of it after all these years).

Brimmer's Avatar

12.10.2012 , 10:26 PM | #107
Quote: Originally Posted by Narthil View Post
This would be a very simple reason not to invest time and money into this game anymore and go F2P.
Maybe for you. For me I like having many alts, and keeping up with the best gear is annoying. I hate how some toons have strong gear and some don't to the point I rarely use my weaker geared toons in pvp. By doing the logical thing and making the gear a cosmetic and not a stat boost, then everybody can play without being bombarded by the most idiotic system I've ever seen.

Seriously there are so many bad well gear players that can only do well because of their gear. Bring in fair gameplay and you get the "fun" element, somebody end-game pvp in swtor completely lacks, and can only typically be found in low level pvp; where it's nearer to "fair gameplay".

Simple fact, if you want the current system to stay, you're most likely horrible at pvp. Both casuals and hardcore pvp fans love fair gameplay.
Check out the spoilers for a good way to earn credits!

Digimanbyte_ID's Avatar

12.11.2012 , 02:49 AM | #108
Quote: Originally Posted by GeckoOBac View Post
I was here since beta.

I vote no on your proposal.

Have to agree, even though I am sorcerer giving customers the even those since beta the power to control the way development in PvP mechanics work is just stupid.

Yeah I hear they are nerfing stun bubble, well it isn't even a nerf. Just the backlash only being applicable to the casters bubble and not his party. I don't mind that, even though it would take our group functioning down a huge notch in DPS role. Hopefully they will just overhaul the entire DPS tree.

They should never have made that ability available at such a low tier. But then again the noticed a huge lack of DPS sorcerers in PvP and hoped this would give them some use for their past scuttle.

Goretzu's Avatar

12.11.2012 , 04:05 AM | #109
Quote: Originally Posted by wowmiscott View Post
I would like to see pvp matches across server... and make it expertise scale based. Meaning you only get grouped in with and against others with expertise of 900 - 1050, 1051 - 1200... etc this would help lvl out the playing field and bring some of the skill back and still make it rewarding to get gear.
The problem is these systems always increase queue lenght.
Real Star Wars space combat please, not Star Wars Fox! Maybe some PvP and flight too?
Goretzu's Law: As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving "Entitled" approaches 1

GrandMike's Avatar

12.11.2012 , 04:18 AM | #110
Quote: Originally Posted by Sleprock View Post
You need gear progression in pvp or there is nothing to work for. I don't understand all of these people saying it should be the same blah blah seriously....

Would you play end game PVE if the only gear you got was one set of armor and that's it..nothing, done.. nodda. NOPE. dumb ppl.
Theres goes another PvEer because of whom PvP was fudged since day 1.