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Sorcerer in PVP, Weak

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes
Sorcerer in PVP, Weak
 

-IceHawk-'s Avatar


-IceHawk-
11.24.2012 , 11:48 PM | #21
I find it difficult to believe that the posters in this thread declaring the overall viability of DPS-Sorcs in either PVE or PVP actually play the class in either Endgame PVE or PVP.

First, we have an individual who seems to think sustained and diffuse damage (achieved with Aff and FS spam) that allows large total damage numbers at the end of warzones actually amounts to anything productive.

Furthermore, that same person (verfallen) seems to think Sorcs can “unleash powerful AoEs” and therefore its other deficiencies make sense insofar as balance is concerned.

This of course fails to notice that our two principle AoE abilities (DF and FS) are nowhere near the most effective or powerful of such abilities in the game and actually result in a net-decrease in overall DPS if spammed in the manner in which he described.

Sorry, verfallen you demonstrate a poor understanding of the basic mechanics of the class in either a PVP or PVE situation which leads me to question if you have actually played a Sorc in Endgame.

Next, we have a Sentinel player who dabbled with Sorcs and Mercs and seems to think we are perfectly balanced. The degree of inaccuracy and backhanded defense of his own class is so abundantly obvious as to be borderline-baiting.

And those of us who actually play this AC as a DPS class in Endgame see glaring problems.

DPS-Sorcs have been in limbo for some time.
The 1.2 Patch destroyed our PVP bonafides as a DPS class and we have always lacked in burst or mobile DPS in PVE Operations.

BW wants us to be pure Healers, that much is clear at this point.

Their mistake was in giving us an expectation to play as a DPS class.

Sindorin's Avatar


Sindorin
11.25.2012 , 01:29 AM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by lokdron View Post
DPS sorc's in pvp are not all that great either bioware simply hates the sorc and operative class if they need to find a solution to a class problem they either nerf merc, operative or sorc.
This is hilarious. I remember between 1.0-1.2, people were crying about Sages being underpowered and Sorc's overpowered, especially Operatives as well. Snipers, well snipers just stink in pvp as it is.
< White Rose >
For The Republic!
Oya, Surtr! Ni su'cuyi, gar kyr'adyc, ni partayli, gar darasuum!

verfallen's Avatar


verfallen
11.25.2012 , 01:57 PM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by -IceHawk- View Post
I find it difficult to believe that the posters in this thread declaring the overall viability of DPS-Sorcs in either PVE or PVP actually play the class in either Endgame PVE or PVP.

First, we have an individual who seems to think sustained and diffuse damage (achieved with Aff and FS spam) that allows large total damage numbers at the end of warzones actually amounts to anything productive.

Furthermore, that same person (verfallen) seems to think Sorcs can “unleash powerful AoEs” and therefore its other deficiencies make sense insofar as balance is concerned.

This of course fails to notice that our two principle AoE abilities (DF and FS) are nowhere near the most effective or powerful of such abilities in the game and actually result in a net-decrease in overall DPS if spammed in the manner in which he described.

Sorry, verfallen you demonstrate a poor understanding of the basic mechanics of the class in either a PVP or PVE situation which leads me to question if you have actually played a Sorc in Endgame.

Next, we have a Sentinel player who dabbled with Sorcs and Mercs and seems to think we are perfectly balanced. The degree of inaccuracy and backhanded defense of his own class is so abundantly obvious as to be borderline-baiting.

And those of us who actually play this AC as a DPS class in Endgame see glaring problems.

DPS-Sorcs have been in limbo for some time.
The 1.2 Patch destroyed our PVP bonafides as a DPS class and we have always lacked in burst or mobile DPS in PVE Operations.

BW wants us to be pure Healers, that much is clear at this point.

Their mistake was in giving us an expectation to play as a DPS class.
You misunderstand my meaning.

In current PvP games, AoE sustained is not as important as burst, but the class' ability at it needs to still be considered. You can't give eveyone the same burst and have a class also being able to pull it AoE wise. Thats currently one of the issue with smasher warriors and knights.

DF still hits rather hard for instant AoE, and so does CL, altough it needs a proc to go off.

My suggestion of linking burst to it is mainly to fix the "inefficiency" damage wise of being stuck 6 seconds channeling FS.

I do play sorc endgame, and I do see the same issues as you do. But I also know wrath powered CL are just going to make things imba on the other side. Raising the burst too high with the same sustained might also make the class too powerful versus other rdps in a raid. I got most other class, and the harsher CD or ressource cost makes their AoE potential inferior to sorcs. Again, its currently not compensating, but must be considered in the needed future changes.

Monterone's Avatar


Monterone
11.25.2012 , 03:22 PM | #24
There are many ways to make madness sorc more viable... they could create procs that increase the damage on Shock via stacks for example; have these go off of periodic damage crits - so each time Affliction or Creeping Terror crit, you get +5 or +10% Shock damage per stack, up to 5 stacks; to affect both the main Shock and the secondary Shock if it procs.

Or they could flat out increase the damage on a few abilities. Honestly, I'd increase the damage on both DoTs by as much as 50%. People cleanse pyro dots don't they? Why is no one concerned with cleansing sorc dots? Because they are not that scary. Increase the damage by 35-50% and you'll bring them closer to the dots other classes have.

And along with dots, increase the damage on DF by 25%. Why? Why not? So it will hit for 6-6.5k and create some burst for what should be the burstiest class in the game, being also the squishiest. There is no way to bring down the cd from 15 seconds and it only hits 3 targets. And even if you increased the damage by 25% it would still hit for less than Smash, on 2 less targets. I don't see why this could not be done and the sorcs given some burst.
Sominette . Saminette
Pot5 > Harbinger

antwillgreen's Avatar


antwillgreen
11.25.2012 , 03:37 PM | #25
All I can say is, you guys outside of Harbinger, are terrible Sorc's if your haveing these kinds of problems....
Ya you can guess what finger i'll be having up at your idea of what the "Real Star Wars" is.

Jarcoby's Avatar


Jarcoby
11.27.2012 , 04:18 AM | #26
In truth I notice a lot of downfall to the Sorceror. That said it is still my main class and I love it. Problem is, it has practically no ability to stand on it's own. Even with my highest damaging companion (Ashara) with her highest available equipment at my level, I have more than once even had to request aid just to complete a story mission that is really meant to be soloed in the first place. That proves that they are weak even in PVE. I've even been blasted down to half health on some missions that were grey, ie far bellow my level. I have played many MMO's and this is one of the first that I've had this problem It's also one of the first where the caster has to stand there while the attack is happening unable to do anything. In others you'd have to stand rooted while casting, but once it was cast, you could move on, even if it was an extended AOE like FL. You sit for the casting time, cast it, and it's constantly running for it's duration while you go on to cast another spell or hit it with something else, which would often hit while the previous AOE was still going. This was to allow you to take out the lesser enemies a bit easier while still concentrating a decen amount of damage to the main threat, or boss. The balance to the high DPS for these characters has always been that they are squishy and often immoble between hits. That's the balance trade off. Further, the bounty hunter's AOE, that you get at a much lower level (as in before you even get off the starting world) packs a far harder punch than the sorceror's as it would often nearly kill entire groups before it was half finished with it's time, sometimes with the first strike of the damage, and they have heavy freaking armor and high *** defence to boot.
I find your lack of cookies disturbing.

Ycoga's Avatar


Ycoga
11.27.2012 , 04:23 AM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by AngusFTW View Post
sorcs sustained dps is fine it just lacks burst IMO. .
Edit: nvm.
'Pre-2.0 PvP... The gear gap was too big and some players became non-contributors quickly because of the gear gap. It wasn’t fun for the majority of players' - Alex Modny

Aetideus's Avatar


Aetideus
11.27.2012 , 11:57 AM | #28
Most of the comments are right because as someone said before, is not understood that DPS Sorcerer needs a Hybrid setting. And moreover, is a class that depends on a team to excel. I have relatively high DPS in most matches and the contribution to the team thanks to special abilities as Force speed (hutball), bubble and special stuns (instant wirlepool), is good

wwkingms's Avatar


wwkingms
11.27.2012 , 12:44 PM | #29
i dont see the logic in having the squishiest class have the lowest burst... plain and simple

i look at the biggest hits at the end of every match of the dmg leaders..


assasins usualy around 4-5k
pts usualy around 4-7k
juggs around 5-7k
and maras around 4-5k

sorcs.. usualy around 3-4k



we need something.. i mean back int he day i remember hitting 4-5k chain lightnings and and deathfields

now i barely see them hit 3k if ever... (mix of BM and wh gear)

i realize my gear needs small improvements but not to account for that loss of dmg

possibly even bring sorcs SHOCK up to assasin level dmg wise

somethin...
NIHIL

THE BASTION

islander's Avatar


islander
11.27.2012 , 12:47 PM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by AngusFTW View Post
sorcs sustained dps is fine it just lacks burst IMO. When teamed with a good burst dps there dps is very effective if you're the sole dps on the team things can get a bit hairy especially against multiple healers.. Good dps sorc shouldn't be eating hits when played correctly ofc they can b e taken down really fast but thats just the nature of the class.
Pretty much this. When I played DPS spec, I had to string out fights to win. DPS Sorc does deceptive damage, versus the melee DPS and operative/sniper/smuggler which is just in your face with massive crits.

As a heal hybrid my dps is garbage but my escapability is quite good now. Basically, 1 on 1 fights I have to run from - and generally succeed in doing so.
Gìllies Erimosi, Imperial Deadeye
<Hex> Prophecy of the Five