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Noob PVE DPS question (taking aggro from healer)

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Roles > Healing
Noob PVE DPS question (taking aggro from healer)

Rassuro's Avatar


Rassuro
11.21.2012 , 01:29 AM | #1
If we are up against a group of a few mobs, and one of those mobs starts attacking the healer, is it better if I just let the mob attack the healer and wait for the tank to maybe eventually notice it and take aggro, or should I take aggro and let the mob attack me instead of the healer?

Basically, I'm mostly only PVPing, but lately I've been running some Flashpoints with my Mercenary (Colicoid War Games because I want one of the Bounty Hunter chestpieces which drops from the final boss), and I'd like to learn how to best fill my role. I'm noticing that sometimes the tank misses one of the mobs and it starts attacking the healer. When this happens, it's normally been in the very beginning on the fight.

I've been unsure about what is the best thing to do in these situations.

The reason why I think that I should peel mobs off the healer would be because it's important that the healer can focus on keeping everyone alive, and and they can heal better if mobs are not attacking them (partly because of pushback on casted and channeled abilities), so it would be better if the mobs attacked me instead of the healer.
The mobs in CWG are all gold star mobs or higher so they take a while longer to defeat than silver star or less. That is why what I would do in this case is to attack the mob enough to take aggro, then switch back to attacking the mob which the group has decided to defeat first.

The reason why I think that I should not peel mobs off the healer is because maybe it's not that much more difficult to heal, and it's instead better for DPS to just wait for the tank to notice the mob and I should instead focus on as quickly as possibly defeating the mob which the group is focusing on.

Opinions?
Toor, 50 Operative healer | Odaen, 50 Assassin tank | Tiyr, 50 Vanguard tank | Zerofour, 50 Mercenary DPS | The Red Eclipse

BlznSmri's Avatar


BlznSmri
11.21.2012 , 03:12 AM | #2
Get the aggro off the healer.
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TheronFett's Avatar


TheronFett
11.21.2012 , 04:16 AM | #3
Attack the MOB and take aggro away from the healer.

The tank's job is to hold threat against the hard stuff: the elites and bosses. Most of the time, they can scoop up an entire pull. But honestly, a good tank won't worry about the stragglers (aka trash MOBs) and put too much stress on the healer by tanking everything on the screen at once.

As DPS, you should be focusing down the small stuff first. The tank's main concern is the strongest MOB in the pull, so it doesn't run rampant and wreck everyone else. A lot of derp DPS simply follow the tank, and that can create threat problems, not to mention allow unattended MOBs to start attacking the healer.

Don't be a derp DPS.

Rassuro's Avatar


Rassuro
11.21.2012 , 06:57 AM | #4
Ok, that's what I thought, thanks.
Toor, 50 Operative healer | Odaen, 50 Assassin tank | Tiyr, 50 Vanguard tank | Zerofour, 50 Mercenary DPS | The Red Eclipse

NoFishing's Avatar


NoFishing
11.21.2012 , 10:43 AM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Rassuro View Post
If we are up against a group of a few mobs, and one of those mobs starts attacking the healer, is it better if I just let the mob attack the healer and wait for the tank to maybe eventually notice it and take aggro, or should I take aggro and let the mob attack me instead of the healer?
If it's a weak mob, KILL it (you actually should have already been focusing on the weaks anyway). If it is a strong/elite/champion...well, the tank should grab it. But if he doesn't, I would base this on the healer's health. If it is below 30% and dropping, grab it. If you die, you are just a DPS short. If the healer dies, you will probably wipe. Just be prepared to use your defensive CDs, stuns, knockbacks, etc to control the mob long enough to kill it. And it won't hurt to kite it toward the tank either in hopes of getting a taunt.

It also somewhat depends on the healer. As a sage, one mob on me isn't usually a problem. But a bunch can really mess me up because of the pushback on all of my casted/channeled abilities. While commandos rely more on hammer shot and instant/short cast heals, so pushback isn't as big of an issue there.

Quote: Originally Posted by Rassuro View Post
That is why what I would do in this case is to attack the mob enough to take aggro, then switch back to attacking the mob which the group has decided to defeat first.
That might work...but generally I say don't tank what you can't kill. If you do decide to grab that mob, stay on it until you or it dies. On the plus side, my healer would notice you grabbed it off of me, and would do everything possible to keep you alive!

Darth_Dreselus's Avatar


Darth_Dreselus
11.21.2012 , 12:40 PM | #6
Yes, if you attack it it is much better for the healer. DPs should always kill targets in the following order of importance:

Standard/Weak -> Strong -> Elite -> Champion -> CC'd target (wait for tank to break it).
Also attack any adds that spawn and unless anyone can re CC pick up those that broke too soon.

The pushback is really annoying on heals and both the healer and the tank will like you as a DPS if you deal with mobs properly.

Also DW about this being a noob question. Those DPS that do not ask such questions and just attack the 1 that is being tanked are the real noobs.
The Last Centurions Derpyn - Sage / Toughen - Vanguard / Bluffin - Scoundrel / Roughen - Sentinel
Filthy-rich - Juggernaut / Timberwulf - Sniper / Ironwill - Mercenary / Ahuizotl - Assassin

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Rassuro's Avatar


Rassuro
11.22.2012 , 01:36 AM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by NoFishing View Post
And it won't hurt to kite it toward the tank either in hopes of getting a taunt.
Oh yeah, kiting towards the tank might be a good idea, I didn't think about that.

Part of my confusion also comes from not fully understanding aggro. If I take the mob, kite it towards the tank, then use my aggro dump ability and start attacking some other mob, would it then be pretty easy to automatically get aggro back to the tank if he happens to be doing some AOEs or something like that?

The reason why I felt like I should perhaps only get aggro and then stop attacking the mob is because all of the the mobs in this particular FP which I've been running are all either elites or champions, so it would take me a while if I killed them by myself.
I felt like if I were to instead attack the mob which the group is focusing on to get that mob down as quickly as possible, I would then also get that other mob off of me and back to the tank as quickly as possible. Also so far, at least most of the time the tank has still gotten the mob back before I would have been able to kill it by myself.

I'm aware BTW that I'm probably making this seem more difficult than what it actually is.
Toor, 50 Operative healer | Odaen, 50 Assassin tank | Tiyr, 50 Vanguard tank | Zerofour, 50 Mercenary DPS | The Red Eclipse

Cleet_Xia's Avatar


Cleet_Xia
11.22.2012 , 12:17 PM | #8
As a healer Everytime I play with a DPS who

1. kills in a good firing order weak> healing mobs> strong> elite> champ (tanked mob if all mobs are equal)
2. respects CC & waits for the tank to break it
3. always waits for the tank to make the pull
4. peels mobs who aggro on me

.... They automatically go on my friends list.

Too few DPS play this game in a way that allows the tank & healer to enjoy their roll.
~Master Telagtun Telag of Lord Calypho~

Darth_Dreselus's Avatar


Darth_Dreselus
11.23.2012 , 03:55 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by Rassuro View Post
Part of my confusion also comes from not fully understanding aggro. If I take the mob, kite it towards the tank, then use my aggro dump ability and start attacking some other mob, would it then be pretty easy to automatically get aggro back to the tank if he happens to be doing some AOEs or something like that?
Well, yes. Threat for you is exactly the same as the damage you are doing unless you are guarded, then it is 75% of your damage (1000 hit = 750 threat). For the tank it is twice that of his damage unless it is a high threat move. Your aggro dump decreases your threat by a certain percentage (don't know exactly would have to check mmo-mechanics or something.) An aggro overtake happens at 130% when over 2m from target and at 110% when under 2m. So yes kiting the mob towards the tank and the dumping helps him to get aggro, but he has to actively attack the mob. Do not forget that if he does not and you move to attack some other mob, the first one will still follow you. Usually relying on taunts is better (or the tank can just outright attck the enemy to get aggro), but if you kite the enemy into the tanks AoE range, threat dump and wait for the tank to overtake threat oyu would have helped him out. Problem there is if the tank keeps ignoring the mob you have kited to him you will be wasting DPS by just standing there.

Quote: Originally Posted by Rassuro View Post
I felt like if I were to instead attack the mob which the group is focusing on to get that mob down as quickly as possible, I would then also get that other mob off of me and back to the tank as quickly as possible. Also so far, at least most of the time the tank has still gotten the mob back before I would have been able to kill it by myself.
Let the tank tank and the healer heal. They will manage while you mop up the adds and then attack the tanked mob.

Do not forget that, as far as possible, a pull should look like this:

CC the strongest mobs
Tank attacks the meduim mobs and any adds he can deal with
DPS quickly kill the weak mobs, then the tanked mobs and then the CCd mobs (but wait for tank to break)
The Last Centurions Derpyn - Sage / Toughen - Vanguard / Bluffin - Scoundrel / Roughen - Sentinel
Filthy-rich - Juggernaut / Timberwulf - Sniper / Ironwill - Mercenary / Ahuizotl - Assassin

BiS Relics for Healers PvE/PvP

LadyTributary's Avatar


LadyTributary
11.26.2012 , 12:44 PM | #10
Once you take the mob, assuming it's not a weak that will be dead in a GCD or two, run TOWARDS the tank. This does two things: (1) it puts the mob easily in range of the tank's taunts, and (2) it makes it much less likely that you will run out of your healer's range (as healers tend to position to remain in range with the tank).

Healers should do this as well. Sometimes mobs are very spread out, and thus it is likely that a taunt might miss one or two. Your tanks will thank you.