Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

Kaggath Series: Grievous vs Malgus

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > STAR WARS Discussion
Kaggath Series: Grievous vs Malgus

ReiKai's Avatar


ReiKai
11.22.2012 , 10:14 AM | #41
Actually if you read TFU2, they didn't stop cloning after the end of the Clone Wars. Palpatine kept up production. The bulk of his army was made of clones. The majority of all ST's that you see are clones. At least until someone busts the factories, like the Rebels did on Kamino with Starkiller's help.
CE Owner: ...what? I wanted the music. I like music.
Statement: SGRA's - I support them. Do you have a problem with that, Meatbag?

Warren-Stride's Avatar


Warren-Stride
11.22.2012 , 10:28 AM | #42
Quote: Originally Posted by MasterMe View Post
"I find your lack of faith in Imperials...disturbing." lol just kidding.

But do you think that Imperials are incapable of guirella warfare? Maglus isn't an idiot. He'd have plenty of that stuff up his sleeve. Remember, he's the guy in TOR that sends all Imperial strike teams out to do stuff. He knows all about that kind of stuff.

You don't seem to realize how bad regular droids are. What about Padme? She kicked droid butt! How much training did she have? She had HANDMAIDEN training! 99% of Imperials are gonna be better equiped and better trained then she was, and yet she also makes the droids look pathetic. Tell me; how many droids did she killed in her time? I'm pretty sure she killed over 15 of them.

Also (I'm not certain about this) but I think Malgus would have more Sith at his disposal then the Republic had Jedi in TCW.
Good point about the strike teams, but I'm not sure it would win a war against an army as large as the CIS.... unless they found the magic Off-Switch.

Oh, that's not fair! I have a soft spot for Padme. Good thing I'm defending her. I would like to point out that she is not and never was a handmaiden. She was a queen. She only posed as a handmaiden to protect her true identity. She DID have training in self-defense and blaster use, at the suggestion of her guard captain, Panaka. She was not just randomly pointing and shooting a blaster, she knows how to handle herself, as we have seen time and time again. Examples of how certain people (main characters even) killed lots of droids doesn't really do anything for this debate because we can only assume that they are the exceptions, not the norm.

Not sure about how many Sith Malgus had..... but the Jedi Order during the Clone Wars had thousands of Jedi.... at least, I assume they did. Does anyone have a number of Jedi at the start of the Clone Wars?

Warren-Stride's Avatar


Warren-Stride
11.22.2012 , 10:32 AM | #43
Quote: Originally Posted by ReiKai View Post
Actually if you read TFU2, they didn't stop cloning after the end of the Clone Wars. Palpatine kept up production. The bulk of his army was made of clones. The majority of all ST's that you see are clones. At least until someone busts the factories, like the Rebels did on Kamino with Starkiller's help.
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Clone_stormtrooper
Quote:
"After the Kamino uprising, the Emperor decided that an army of genetically identical soldiers was too susceptible to corruption. Future troopers would be cloned from a variety of templates. Though the 501st itself remained pure, gradually, the rest of the Imperial Army became more and more diverse. We never really got used to the new guys." ―Retired clone trooper

Clone stormtroopers were the original elite soldiers of the Galactic Empire. After the fall of the Galactic Republic and the formation of Emperor Palpatine's New Order, the Republic Grand Army's clone troopers were re-designated as stormtroopers. Throughout the early years of Palpatine's reign, the Empire continued to utilize the Jango Fett template, but later commissioned the creation of new troopers from different genetic sources. Cloning remained essential to the Imperial Military, although the introduction of birth-born recruits into the ranks of the Stormtrooper Corps gradually reduced clone soldiers to a minority status.
Did a little more research and found that production of clones did happen, but to a much lesser extent. Clones were in no way the majority of stormtroopers.

Please also note that you're talking about events before episode IV. His army might have been mostly clones at the time of TFU2, but by a New Hope (where the stupid aim comes in) those clones have outlived their usefulness.

MasterMe's Avatar


MasterMe
11.22.2012 , 10:40 AM | #44
Quote: Originally Posted by Warren-Stride View Post
Good point about the strike teams, but I'm not sure it would win a war against an army as large as the CIS.... unless they found the magic Off-Switch.

Oh, that's not fair! I have a soft spot for Padme. Good thing I'm defending her. I would like to point out that she is not and never was a handmaiden. She was a queen. She only posed as a handmaiden to protect her true identity. She DID have training in self-defense and blaster use, at the suggestion of her guard captain, Panaka. She was not just randomly pointing and shooting a blaster, she knows how to handle herself, as we have seen time and time again. Examples of how certain people (main characters even) killed lots of droids doesn't really do anything for this debate because we can only assume that they are the exceptions, not the norm.

Not sure about how many Sith Malgus had..... but the Jedi Order during the Clone Wars had thousands of Jedi.... at least, I assume they did. Does anyone have a number of Jedi at the start of the Clone Wars?
The thing is, nearly all of the Imperials are gonna have more/better training then Padme.

Beniboybling's Avatar


Beniboybling
11.22.2012 , 11:55 AM | #45
Just want to clarify here, maybe I didn't make this clear enough. But I said at the beginning
Quote:
Malgus has command over his splinter Sith Empire
(quoting myself )
So where talking about the splinter Empire you faced in Battle of Ilum and False Emperor.

But anyway, ReiKai summed it up perfectly. Quality vs Quantity. Malgus has quality troops, ships etc - while Grievous has tonnes of just about everything (even arms, lol) However, Malgus has quality but lacks quantity. While Grievous has quantity, but also quality to a certain extent. After all, you can bash battle droids as much as you like but the fact is they are extremely adaptable and did manage to hold their own against the Republic for 3 years. As did the CIS Navy. So I think while Malgus trumps Grievous on quality, he doesn't trump him as much as Grievous trumps Malgus on quantity - if you get my meaning.

Oh and just a reminder, all they have to do to win is kill their opponent, not necessarily destroy their power bases. Just a heads up seeing as this is a complicated debate.

MasterMe's Avatar


MasterMe
11.22.2012 , 11:59 AM | #46
Quote: Originally Posted by Beniboybling View Post
Just want to clarify here, maybe I didn't make this clear enough. But I said at the beginning (quoting myself )
So where talking about the splinter Empire you faced in Battle of Ilum and False Emperor.

But anyway, ReiKai summed it up perfectly. Quality vs Quantity. Malgus has quality troops, ships etc - while Grievous has tonnes of just about everything (even arms, lol) However, Malgus has quality but lacks quantity. While Grievous has quantity, but also quality to a certain extent. After all, you can bash battle droids as much as you like but the fact is they are extremely adaptable and did manage to hold their own against the Republic for 3 years. As did the CIS Navy. So I think while Malgus trumps Grievous on quality, he doesn't trump him as much as Grievous trumps Malgus on quantity - if you get my meaning.

Oh and just a reminder, all they have to do to win is kill their opponent, not necessarily destroy their power bases. Just a heads up seeing as this is a complicated debate.
It has been an interesting debate. Good thread.

It's nice to argue about something BESIDES Revan. lol

Beniboybling's Avatar


Beniboybling
11.22.2012 , 12:01 PM | #47
Quote: Originally Posted by MasterMe View Post
It's nice to argue about something BESIDES Revan. lol
*evil cackle* Guess what the next thread is... Traya vs Revan! Heads will roll! Mwaha, mwaha, mwahahahahaha!

P.S. Don't feel you have to end the debate guys, you can keep debating till the cows come home

Aurbere's Avatar


Aurbere
11.22.2012 , 12:07 PM | #48
If we're including power bases here, does that mean Grievous gets Admiral Trench? Since Grievous is the Supreme Commander, I would assume so.
Added Chapter 29 to The Shadows Fall
"My ultimate goal is the secret of life-that life that gives us consciousness, for without consciousness each of us is nothing. Through science, i will create new life and sustain my own. There is no reason Darth Plagueis could not live forever."

Beniboybling's Avatar


Beniboybling
11.22.2012 , 12:14 PM | #49
Quote: Originally Posted by Aurbere View Post
If we're including power bases here, does that mean Grievous gets Admiral Trench? Since Grievous is the Supreme Commander, I would assume so.
Oh Aurbere, must you ask difficult questions!

In a sense this contradicts one of the ground rules:
Quote:
No outside help of any kind, the combatants cannot call upon assets that are not their own. In this case, this all excludes other prominent powers/allies of the era, e.g. Darth Serevin, Asajj Ventress.
But it depends if you consider Admiral Trench to be prominent. Seeing as he was a highly skilled commander with his own mini-power base, I'd say yes. This is a fight between Grievous and Malgus. Trench is a figure in his own right - request denied

Aurbere's Avatar


Aurbere
11.22.2012 , 12:20 PM | #50
Quote: Originally Posted by Beniboybling View Post
Oh Aurbere, must you ask difficult questions!

In a sense this contradicts one of the ground rules:

But it depends if you consider Admiral Trench to be prominent. Seeing as he was a highly skilled commander with his own mini-power base, I'd say yes. This is a fight between Grievous and Malgus. Trench is a figure in his own right - request denied
The reason I asked is because Admiral Trench would be helpful in finding Malgus' cloaked ships. But since he is unavailable, I would have to say that Malgus would win the space battle then. But only just, as the CIS has the swarms of droid fighters to rapidly respond to an attack.

As for land. I gotta go with Grievous' forces. In a straight up fight, the numbers are just too overwhelming. Now if Malgus played his cards right, he could pull it out.

The duel? Malgus has the advantage of the Force, but Grievous has killed powerful Jedi. Which Grievous are we talking about though? 2D, TCW, or both?
Added Chapter 29 to The Shadows Fall
"My ultimate goal is the secret of life-that life that gives us consciousness, for without consciousness each of us is nothing. Through science, i will create new life and sustain my own. There is no reason Darth Plagueis could not live forever."