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Debunking false ideas about Mara/Sents in PVP

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Debunking false ideas about Mara/Sents in PVP

Helig's Avatar


Helig
11.14.2012 , 07:37 AM | #151
Quote: Originally Posted by Loladarulz View Post
Someone should make a guide how to kill Mara : ) but I don't wanna do it - wouldn't help me. I feel i can probably kill 90% of Maras 1on1 on my server and I'm not even full War Hero yet with mine.
Not to play the devil's advocate, but 90% Marauders are, to put it gently, not very good at what they do.
"I'm not *giving* him cake, I'm *assaulting* him with cake!" - Pinkamena Diane Pie

WaywardOne's Avatar


WaywardOne
11.14.2012 , 07:53 AM | #152
Quote: Originally Posted by Smashbrother View Post
Your argument is so dumb I'm not sure I should respond to it, but I will. A stun doesn't prevent a person from getting FFed, which is what kills people in pvp. GBTF on the other hand prevents you from getting FFed. People hate GBTF because it is a guaranteed 4 more seconds of life when being FFed. 4 more seconds is a long time in pvp because that means 4 seconds u can hold an objective longer, kill someone else, or be healed.

You do have a stun, its called force stasis. Yes it is a self stun and channeled, but it does pretty good damage. Other classes stuns may be instant, but theirs don't do much damage at all. That is the trade off.
Here's the part where your argument is dumb: if it's more than a 1v1 then cc the sent (or ignore him) and ff the healer(s) first. If you are ff the wrong target you need to work on your team targeting (l2p)?

Force stasis vs regular stun:
3 v 4 secs
Can be broken by any stray cc in the game
Very weak damage
Syncing issues can leave my sent out of melee range while using

My sent will take a stun over GBTF any day of the week. It's a better defense in skirmishes and duels and it's the best offense vs healers.

Loladarulz's Avatar


Loladarulz
11.14.2012 , 08:04 AM | #153
Quote: Originally Posted by Helig View Post
Not to play the devil's advocate, but 90% Marauders are, to put it gently, not very good at what they do.
True. But it helps to know how to fight them a lot. Most other players are similarly bad. Whats to expect when Sorc is standing still in the place and fight 1on1 with Mara - and then whine when she dies... What do people expect? To fight vs melee class, stand in place and win.. Not gonna happen.
Helpful advice to some players: when you start fighting next time 1v1 vs Mara (and other good solo classes), rethink, run to your friend. Continue fight.

TridusSWTOR's Avatar


TridusSWTOR
11.14.2012 , 08:57 AM | #154
Quote: Originally Posted by Loladarulz View Post
How about you trying to play mara/sent first and then come back talk about ir.

Tipically I activate stealth when I want to avoid death. In these cases most of the time I am slowed and focused to death so I must go stealth. In these precious 4 seconds Mara can barrely (or CANT at all) get time to hide behind a wall. And Mara CANNOT HEAL - where did you get this ??. Every class can use medpack, when you decide to use is your will. Mara can be killed while invisible also..

Stealth is best used to switch focus from self.. Jump smash - everyone focuses you - go invis - attack somone else in 3-4 sec. Most noob players can't focus you again.
Any marauder worth his salt knows how to invis, wait until they are OOC and heal up to full again to rejoin a battle. Don't act like 4 secs is not a long time either, in every map I have plenty of time to go and hide after my camo use. I honestly don't know why I have to explain this to you, if you already know about your class.

Jadescythe's Avatar


Jadescythe
11.14.2012 , 09:40 AM | #155
Quote: Originally Posted by TridusSWTOR View Post
@jadescythe- I like how you consider me getting off topic and not adding much to the discussion, but a post like this is perfectly fine. Also there are many others that just say "L2P", I guess those posters aren't getting off topic as well.

I guess biased people will be biased.

On that note, marauders still have the best defensives and the highest damage output of any class. Mean while they got stealth and a gap closer. Also they have the strongest speed boost in the game, dang sounds kinda OP to me!
To be honest, I wasn't posting while asleep or while playing (my one post last night was when I logged out and went to bed), but you are right. Most of the arguments come down to L2P in these threads or one liners about how OMG this is OP or not OP (done equally by both sides). In my defense, while I was on yesterday, your spat with Arash went like 4 pages with nothing constructive (all deleted).

This is continuing on with other people here that should follow your lead and post something constructive that can be debated. If a post consists merely of a complaint about what an ability can do, then it is not constructive. If the post simply says UR is OP because it lets you live for 4 seconds, then that is sort of a no brainer (copy and paste from any SWTOR website). It is the description of what the ability does, not a reason for why it is OP. Some people make the next step and say that coupled with other abilities, it gives mara/sent more survivability than they should have (some with correct info and supporting facts, others not so much). Another point that can be debated based on the contents of the post, but this is where a majority of people stop.

There has to be some type of change that you are suggesting. You made suggestions Tridus, which I appreciate and responded to. By opening this dialogue, you can get the perspective of those who play the class and who have a unique knowledge of how that class would perform given the change. I would guess a majority of people have never played a mara/sent and don't know how much they rely on those DCDs to survive or they wouldn't be calling for nerfs in the manner that they are.

As to the post that I made, you're correct that it was off topic and not, strictly speaking, constructive. But when someone has nothing constructive posted, it is hard to make a logical argument. Besides, if I have to be completely constructive in EVERY post, I'll lose track of the fact that this is a game.

TL;DR L2P is never a solution and a large majority of posts are worthless. Teach someone how to play and keep troll posts to 1-2 replies instead.
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Dacer's Avatar


Dacer
11.14.2012 , 10:24 AM | #156

Sith Warrior

Marauder

Undying Rage now no longer consumes 50% of the players current health when activated and its duration is now 5 seconds. The effect no longer reduces damage by 99% but now increases resistance to force and tech attacks by 100% and melee defense by 50%. Undying Rage now also removes all movement impairing effects when activated.

BoDiE's Avatar


BoDiE
11.14.2012 , 10:54 AM | #157
Quote: Originally Posted by Jadescythe View Post
I would like to respond, but I'm not exactly sure what you are claiming with all of this. I assume you are complaining about Rage with the 6.6k derps, which is more of a warrior issue than just maras. I assume cloak is their force camo, which lasts all of 4 seconds (6 if talented in carnage) and they continue being damaged, so if they have a DoT they still die. If you take 15k damage from them during UR, then you are going to die long before they have to use it. Maybe you should consider what you could do differently to avoid 15k damage in 5 seconds (3 globals). Is speed buff in reference to predation? This is not available on demand (unless other CDs are up) and stops them from using some other abilities that may be more helpful to their spec (Berserk for shockwave in Rage, heals in Anni, or lower GCD and rage cost of abilities in carnage).

Based on your comments, perhaps you should look more into the class and learn how to counter the abilities that are giving you the most trouble and plan accordingly. There is plenty of material out on these forums as well as third party sites to assist you if you continually have problems with marauders.
A lot of bluster from another mara. You cannot interrupt leap, when they're on you , all the cc in the works isn't going to stop one face rolling. I don't care who you are unless you can stealth if course.
epicfail
Nothing ever good comes from gaming forums.

BoDiE's Avatar


BoDiE
11.14.2012 , 10:58 AM | #158
Quote: Originally Posted by Vacarius View Post
I'd agree with this, but it makes the point that marauders are not the sole good class (I certainly agree they're not a viable blueprint, way too easy to do well in). The viable classes are all excellent when played well and relatively balanced between each other. In my view, the non-viable classes need to be buffed up to this level, rather than 1 of the viables getting brought down.



15k in 4 seconds requires 7.5k per hit (GCD= 1.5 secs, UD lasts 4 seconds so only 2 abilities can be used) which is almost impossible for a marauder. Would be possible with rage, but 1 spec shouldn't determine class balance and most agree rage needs a bit of tuning anyway.

I would certainly take marauders in world pvp, UD would become even more crucial with the masses of damage flying about (predation would be even more powerful too). Cloak isn't a problem as it only lasts a few seconds, just keep an eye out for where they pop up. Note that they aren't immune to ccs either, requires the use of cooldowns (and then only limited) that would have been useful if not 'wasted'.
You take a mara in to true open world against stealth squads and you're gonna cry foul. Warzones are full of derp smash mara nabs with pocket healers. It's a joke, you know it's a joke and its only a matter of time before your nerfed.
epicfail
Nothing ever good comes from gaming forums.

Dacer's Avatar


Dacer
11.14.2012 , 11:01 AM | #159
Quote: Originally Posted by BoDiE View Post
A lot of bluster from another mara. You cannot interrupt leap, when they're on you , all the cc in the works isn't going to stop one face rolling. I don't care who you are unless you can stealth if course.
You clearly have a very hard time fighting against marauders. YOu can Counter them and CC is very effective against a marauder.

You are right you can't interrupt a force charge- its instant. But you would probably benefit by dueling a mara guild mate and having them give you some tips and Practice.

WaywardOne's Avatar


WaywardOne
11.14.2012 , 11:03 AM | #160
Quote: Originally Posted by Dacer View Post

Sith Warrior

Marauder

Undying Rage now no longer consumes 50% of the players current health when activated and its duration is now 5 seconds. The effect no longer reduces damage by 99% but now increases resistance to force and tech attacks by 100% and melee defense by 50%. Undying Rage now also removes all movement impairing effects when activated.

I would somehow manage to live with this nerf.