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BW, do you ever plan on addressing DPS Mercs/Commandos PvP-wise?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
BW, do you ever plan on addressing DPS Mercs/Commandos PvP-wise?
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T-Assassin's Avatar


T-Assassin
01.30.2013 , 12:23 PM | #941
Quote: Originally Posted by cashogy_reborn View Post


i think the problem with Merc is that we lose so much more damage while moving, being attacked, etc.
compared to PT, where i *never* have to stop outputting damage as long as there are targets in range.

think about what a Merc has to use when we are on the move. Rapid Shots, Rail Shot, Explosive Dart, and either Heatseeker Missiles/Thermal Det. 3 of those are 15s cooldowns, and 2 of them are heavily dependent on being buffed by other abilities that are casted.

you stand still in PvP, you die. Merc is the anti-thesis of that statement
that's what i'm sayin.

DPS is not fine, unless you are playing a bunch of n00bs, or have a dominant team where you can sit and cast.

but, that's not REAL PvP!! as most of the skilled players and PvP'rs know, that stuff don't fly in rateds.

in order to be a successful, top tier player, and highly competative you can't sit around.

and, that is the issue w/ mercs and their DPS.

i can do everything while moving on VG. and 30m range doesn't mean anything, when you got jumpers everywhere.

again, we both know that...it's BW that doesn't get it
"Ib'tuur jatne tuur ash'ad kyr'amur."
"Today is a good day for someone else to die." -

Nevullis's Avatar


Nevullis
01.30.2013 , 02:05 PM | #942
Quote: Originally Posted by T-Assassin View Post
that's what i'm sayin.

DPS is not fine, unless you are playing a bunch of n00bs, or have a dominant team where you can sit and cast.

but, that's not REAL PvP!! as most of the skilled players and PvP'rs know, that stuff don't fly in rateds.

in order to be a successful, top tier player, and highly competative you can't sit around.

and, that is the issue w/ mercs and their DPS.

i can do everything while moving on VG. and 30m range doesn't mean anything, when you got jumpers everywhere.

again, we both know that...it's BW that doesn't get it
Same goes for Bodyguard Merc
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Lalainnia's Avatar


Lalainnia
01.30.2013 , 02:34 PM | #943
Quote: Originally Posted by Nevullis View Post
Same goes for Bodyguard Merc
this^
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ArchangelLBC's Avatar


ArchangelLBC
01.30.2013 , 03:20 PM | #944
Quote: Originally Posted by Pefny View Post
Yep we were going through this few times here. Giving cover mechanics is not at option - it's pointless to copy other class, it's sniper/GS's reward from having medium armor etc...

For a 2nd tweak - old mercs and commandos sure remember - we already had it in the past. It was called electro dart/cryo grenade - 30 m, instant, 4 s hard stun. To this day in secret, underground lab, special group of brightest minds on Earth is trying to investigate what was in head of a guy who thought that RDPS need 10 m stun instead of 30.
Some sort of tactical leap/interrupt immunity is sorely needed for the class. That or just let CB be cast on the move in assault spec, same with full auto (or make CB instant cast in Assault Spec). I think that makes us OP perhaps, but seriously the class needs SOMETHING, and it needs a big something which is why I used capital letters.
In update 2.9 the game will simply uninstall itself for you.

-Wnd

Pefny's Avatar


Pefny
01.30.2013 , 04:23 PM | #945
Yep, its not hard to notice after almost 100 pages of this thread . All I have to say it that BW will never give us cover. Besides I highly doubt that BW gonna giva us something brilliant. I threw towel too - my Commando and Mercenary are on indefinite vacation. Got full WH + 2 EWH on PT and thats it. After some obervation on our server (TOFN) population of PvP'ing mercs/mandos is getting low, which is nice, maybe devs will learn something from that.
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Azrienov's Avatar


Azrienov
01.30.2013 , 05:50 PM | #946
Go for the dreaded thousand post limit!

Merc design is what holds it back. It's a static caster designed for PvE games. To be honest, it's pvp potential was, and always has been subpar. The 1.2 nerf slapped on devastates pyro mercs that are below 30 pvping, as Muzzle Fluting IS REQUIRED for Power Shot to be useful. This change needs to be peeled out of the tree, and converted to a damage bonus.

Unload is a shadow of an ability compared to other classes when looking at a channel caster class. The arsenal changes made the ability something to recognize and be afraid of, but it's potential for pyro is pathetic relative to it's cast time. The unload benefits should be broken up high and low in Arsenal with Arsenal gaining a clear edge on pyro with this ability.

The mechanic does nothing really well to refund itself in Pyro spec, and Arsenal penalizes the player with long cast times that cannot and do not intimidate leap classes that have multiple interrupt abilities. The rapid nature of heating in this spec has to be cooled through constant applications of railshot. That works wonders on instant cast abilities like flameburst and rocket punch. Not so much on the low potential of power shot and unload. Power shot, when hitting targets suffering from CGC should have a double or 90% chance of recharging the RS on the same 6 second cooldown to increase the reliability of the spec. Thermal Detonator should benefit from the same armor penetration as Unload and Railshot.

The merc has no strong cards to play inside of 10 m to successfully deter or escape an attacker. The knockback is simply pathetic, and once again, the root on rocket punch was a failed design mechanism with it's tendency to break on damage after 2 seconds. . . and it's deep in the arsenal tree anyway. Where is the ability to get out of dodge? It seems like one might be on the way, but its too early to tell.

The heavy armor argument is so old as to be pointless. PvP contains far too many penetration or circumvention mechanics for armor to count for anything more than ornamentation against most assailants. Passive defenses in this game are meaningless compared to active defenses. Activation abilities are truly where a character will survive an onslaught. This cannot and will not change because of the underlying mechanic design of classes. Healers are already too difficult to counter as it is. Adding a mortal strike effect to something the merc has gives this class a stronger utility and allows coordination of kills based on the target. Making it tech means cleansing is more important in the game.

The last time a development response was warranted was 10/31. That's 3 months ago. This portends that the development team has made up its mind, and has started to implement a solution that I doubt will do anything for the merc classes long list of woes.

Hexdoll's Avatar


Hexdoll
01.30.2013 , 06:18 PM | #947
they need to lower the CD on their bubble to 30 sec and add a %100 interruption immunity to it as a passive skill then they could be useful.

yoomazir's Avatar


yoomazir
01.30.2013 , 06:40 PM | #948
Quote: Originally Posted by Azrienov View Post
...

The last time a development response was warranted was 10/31. That's 3 months ago. This portends that the development team has made up its mind, and has started to implement a solution that I doubt will do anything for the merc classes long list of woes.
That's the thing that really scares me, we have zero, ZERO, information about what the pvp team is doing, is there even a dedicated pvp team for this game, do they exist?

If yes, what are they doing in their office months after months, because I sure don't see what takes them soooooooooooo long to rework a skill, a skill tree or even an advanced class, and don't tell me it's because they're looking at , how do you call it, "stats graphs"(?) when we, the players, have been screaming like no tomorrow about this.

But, hey, there's a reason why this game dropped from 2 millions subscribers to 500k : a lack of real understanding from the SWTOR team.

Now let's patiently wait about 1.7...

cashogy_reborn's Avatar


cashogy_reborn
01.30.2013 , 07:49 PM | #949
Quote: Originally Posted by yoomazir View Post
That's the thing that really scares me, we have zero, ZERO, information about what the pvp team is doing, is there even a dedicated pvp team for this game, do they exist?

If yes, what are they doing in their office months after months, because I sure don't see what takes them soooooooooooo long to rework a skill, a skill tree or even an advanced class, and don't tell me it's because they're looking at , how do you call it, "stats graphs"(?) when we, the players, have been screaming like no tomorrow about this.

But, hey, there's a reason why this game dropped from 2 millions subscribers to 500k : a lack of real understanding from the SWTOR team.

Now let's patiently wait about 1.7...
SURPRISE! we made Heatseeker Missile a 1.5s cast, but increased its damage 10%


inb4 that is what happens and our brains implode
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Jherad's Avatar


Jherad
01.30.2013 , 07:53 PM | #950
Quote: Originally Posted by cashogy_reborn View Post
SURPRISE! we made Heatseeker Missile a 1.5s cast, but increased its damage 10%


inb4 that is what happens and our brains implode
That would just be such a non-surprise.

Honestly, the biggest W.T.F. moment at this point would be if we got some kind of net improvement. A major buff would probably blow my mind.
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