Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

[PvP Guide] Wakaworld: Your resource for advanced Sith Assassin/Jedi Shadow strategy!

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Shadow / Assassin
[PvP Guide] Wakaworld: Your resource for advanced Sith Assassin/Jedi Shadow strategy!

RankorSSGS's Avatar


RankorSSGS
11.11.2012 , 05:18 AM | #91
Quote: Originally Posted by Xethis View Post
There is absolutely no way I could have done this with Mad Maul, Deception or 23-1-17. Wakajinn is the only way to go for pvp.
This is pretty much the conclusion I reached as well. Mad Maul does indeed have impressive numbers, but there are so many things that Wakajinn can do that are just not possible in any other spec. Absolutely love this spec.

Elyna_'s Avatar


Elyna_
11.11.2012 , 01:09 PM | #92
Quote: Originally Posted by Xethis View Post
Wakajinn is legit people! Last night I had my first legit 2v1 and I want to tell you guys how bad *** it was. The spec I use is just a tiny bit different than they Wakalords, I run http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200ZfGbRzfbRbZf0cRb.2 I basically trade the reduced force cost of DF for some added defense with Insulation and I like to have full crit potential from my Thrashes. I know 50 force for DF is quite a bit, but I found I use this ability pretty sparingly. On a 1v1 when Im taking a node from a single defender I usually open up with this and Im in my Dark Embrace buff, and the only other times is when I see some people grouped up, or stopping caps. I have yet to not have sufficient force when I need to use DF. Anyways, back to my 2v1.

So I am guarding a door all by myself in a Void Star when I see 19k health Mara and a 20k health Assassin trotting my way. I have been successful against multiple opponents before but they where bads in recruit gear. When I see these two coming at me in WH gear my only goal is to survive long enough for help to arrive. Instead of just playing the sap game till others come I decide to go balls out to see what this spec can really do. I open first on the Mara with Reck/Shock/Dishcarge, I get an EW proc and stun him to get behind him and Maul. Just as I land Maul the second VS hits me from the Sin, I Force Shroud to avoid Sins big hits and keep working on the Mara. I Thrash once and then Assassinate. Just as Shroud buff ends the Mara is at about 5% health and finish him with DF, and it hits the Sin too for my first attack on him. The Mara is dead and the other Sin and I are both at about 85%, I am in great position to battle the Sin. I Force Cloak and Spike him. I only have one stack of Induction but I reset my Dark Embrace buff so I don't need two stacks. I Shock him when he is down and I am pretty sure he is still looking to hit me with a big Shock crit to the face so I hit Force Slow and do my best to stay on his six. My Force Slow procs EW so I hit Low Slash. He still has not been able to get me with his Shock/Dishcarge and he has only landed to VS's on me lol. When I get behind him I Maul him and activate Black Out. Since I am in Dark Embrace again I do not bother with Induction stacks. We both Shock each other but I have over 50% damage mitigation at this time. He is now below 30% and I am well above 50%. I Assassinate and then finish him with a huge 4.5k Discharge and he is trying to build VS stacks on me lol.

I utterly destroyed these two guys. Granted I did catch the Mara with out his defensive cooldowns so I got lucky with that, and the Sin did fail to stun or cc me in any way. But they both underestimated me and how much damage I could do. I do believe that this spec gave me some huge advantages that no other Sin spec could offer. First, all my burst was front loaded with absolutely no need for any set up. I was able to kill that Mara so fast that he probably thought there was a BH pew pew'n him around the corner. Second, I really did not need Induction stacks for cheaper Shocks, while the Sin I was fighting was desperately trying to get his VS stacks on me, I was not forced to set up my burst so I had a huge advantage over him. Lastly I was unpredictable, Wakalord has claimed this is one of the strongest traits of this spec and he is dead on with that assessment.

There is absolutely no way I could have done this with Mad Maul, Deception or 23-1-17. Wakajinn is the only way to go for pvp.
It could have just as easily been done with full Deception so I'm not sure why you would make that statement. What I find even funnier throughout this thread is how people say you can see deception setup coming... Its called redirection< Learn it. Not sapping 1 was silly to begin with but even so if you started voltaic x2 on the sin and popped recklessness/overcharge saber you unload it on the Mara when the sin is popping defensives thinking he is the target. Pretty simple concept. You stated the Mara never used defensives and the Sin never used cc's so it sounded like noobs to begin with...

iesnbold's Avatar


iesnbold
11.11.2012 , 05:23 PM | #93
EDIT : nevermind I'm an idiot that can't read.

Xethis's Avatar


Xethis
11.12.2012 , 03:27 AM | #94
Quote: Originally Posted by Elyna_ View Post
It could have just as easily been done with full Deception so I'm not sure why you would make that statement. What I find even funnier throughout this thread is how people say you can see deception setup coming... Its called redirection< Learn it. Not sapping 1 was silly to begin with but even so if you started voltaic x2 on the sin and popped recklessness/overcharge saber you unload it on the Mara when the sin is popping defensives thinking he is the target. Pretty simple concept. You stated the Mara never used defensives and the Sin never used cc's so it sounded like noobs to begin with...
I really don't see how this could have been done by full Deception. If I would have opened with two VS's or Thrashes, that would have given the Mara time to start is rotation on me. I opened on him with Shock/Discharge which was about 9k damage before he or the sin activated even one of their abilities. Before the Mara could get anything going I had him in a stun and Maul'd and Thrashed, that was another 7.5k damage. Just as the stun ended I popped him with DF and got him for another 3k. Almost 20k damage in 6 globals (one of those was a stun). If I did this as full Deception I would have taken a considerable amount of damage before I got the stun off, Instead of stunning on my 3rd global it would have been on my 5th, but its not just two globals from him that would hurt the most, its 2 globals from both of them. As full Deception there is no way I would have had enough health to deal with the Assassin after I finally finished the Mara.

Your redirection is cute, I bet it makes you feel good when you do it. Truth is we have all been doing it since game released you are not special. Again, hitting the Assassin with two VS's would have given both of them time to hit me with several of there abilities. VS takes the surprise out of everything because you are basically saying "In 3 seconds I will be able to hit you real hard"

I really got a laugh when you pointed out that sapping one of them would have been better. No ****! This is not my first rodeo bud, or my first MMO. Sapping one and opening on another is MMO basics. We have all done it while leveling, Flash Points, Operations, PVP. Every aspect of this game has a need for a stealth mez. The reason one of them did not get sapped was because the Sin was stealthed. I saw them drop down but he stealthed long before he got close to the door. I could have sapped the Mara and looked for the Sin, but I wanted them to think door was ungaurded. If I sapped the Mara he would have known I was there and already prepared his strategy for when he un sapped or when I opened. By not sapping him I gained a 2 global head start on him.

They definitely could have been noobs. But it definitely seemed more so that they just underestimated me. I know for me when I am with a team mate, (specially a Mara) and we are focusing down a target (who is not targeting me) I just tee off with everything I got. I don't bother with stuns or being cute or smart, I just dish out everything I got. 99% of the time if you let a Sin tee off on ya, the Sin will rip you apart regardless of their spec. I believe the Assassin had the same thinking that I usually do. If the Mara doesn't have his defensive cool downs available, then well he cant use them. Does not make him a noob. It just means I got lucky.

Xethis's Avatar


Xethis
11.12.2012 , 03:40 AM | #95
Not to take anything away from Xinika, but I think the Wakalord guide is a far better guide and needs to be stickied.

Squidkidz's Avatar


Squidkidz
11.12.2012 , 10:45 AM | #96
Quote: Originally Posted by Xethis View Post
Not to take anything away from Xinika, but I think the Wakalord guide is a far better guide and needs to be stickied.
It's just up to date, Xinika left a while ago if I'm not mistaken.
Majinn | Blāck
<Hey im mvp> Sexual Harassment Specialist
IInfinite Empire > The Bastion

MandraMoody's Avatar


MandraMoody
11.12.2012 , 12:55 PM | #97
Quote: Originally Posted by Xethis View Post
Not to take anything away from Xinika, but I think the Wakalord guide is a far better guide and needs to be stickied.
I agree here. This was a very clear and interesting read.
WHAT??? NO FAMBAAS????

Elyna_'s Avatar


Elyna_
11.12.2012 , 07:48 PM | #98
Quote: Originally Posted by Xethis View Post
I really don't see how this could have been done by full Deception. If I would have opened with two VS's or Thrashes, that would have given the Mara time to start is rotation on me. I opened on him with Shock/Discharge which was about 9k damage before he or the sin activated even one of their abilities. Before the Mara could get anything going I had him in a stun and Maul'd and Thrashed, that was another 7.5k damage. Just as the stun ended I popped him with DF and got him for another 3k. Almost 20k damage in 6 globals (one of those was a stun). If I did this as full Deception I would have taken a considerable amount of damage before I got the stun off, Instead of stunning on my 3rd global it would have been on my 5th, but its not just two globals from him that would hurt the most, its 2 globals from both of them. As full Deception there is no way I would have had enough health to deal with the Assassin after I finally finished the Mara.

Your redirection is cute, I bet it makes you feel good when you do it. Truth is we have all been doing it since game released you are not special. Again, hitting the Assassin with two VS's would have given both of them time to hit me with several of there abilities. VS takes the surprise out of everything because you are basically saying "In 3 seconds I will be able to hit you real hard"

I really got a laugh when you pointed out that sapping one of them would have been better. No ****! This is not my first rodeo bud, or my first MMO. Sapping one and opening on another is MMO basics. We have all done it while leveling, Flash Points, Operations, PVP. Every aspect of this game has a need for a stealth mez. The reason one of them did not get sapped was because the Sin was stealthed. I saw them drop down but he stealthed long before he got close to the door. I could have sapped the Mara and looked for the Sin, but I wanted them to think door was ungaurded. If I sapped the Mara he would have known I was there and already prepared his strategy for when he un sapped or when I opened. By not sapping him I gained a 2 global head start on him.

They definitely could have been noobs. But it definitely seemed more so that they just underestimated me. I know for me when I am with a team mate, (specially a Mara) and we are focusing down a target (who is not targeting me) I just tee off with everything I got. I don't bother with stuns or being cute or smart, I just dish out everything I got. 99% of the time if you let a Sin tee off on ya, the Sin will rip you apart regardless of their spec. I believe the Assassin had the same thinking that I usually do. If the Mara doesn't have his defensive cool downs available, then well he cant use them. Does not make him a noob. It just means I got lucky.
You still say you don't know how it can be done as full deception yet you are using the same exact moves and as your spec you have 10 less force + death field. If you opened the same exact way as full deception the damage does not change and while he was in a full stun with your ew proc you could have just double mauled into an assassinate to finish him. What your saying is that because you finished him with a 50 force death field which clipped the tank sin as well was the determining factor in you winning the 2vs1??? I doubt that very much so and not to mention how death field probably tickled the tank sin. Your come back is laughable at best but if you want to be a clown so be it.

RankorSSGS's Avatar


RankorSSGS
11.12.2012 , 11:08 PM | #99
Quote: Originally Posted by Elyna_ View Post
You still say you don't know how it can be done as full deception yet you are using the same exact moves and as your spec you have 10 less force + death field. If you opened the same exact way as full deception the damage does not change and while he was in a full stun with your ew proc you could have just double mauled into an assassinate to finish him. What your saying is that because you finished him with a 50 force death field which clipped the tank sin as well was the determining factor in you winning the 2vs1??? I doubt that very much so and not to mention how death field probably tickled the tank sin. Your come back is laughable at best but if you want to be a clown so be it.
Please, your'e just making yourself look like an idiot. You apparently didn't even read what he said. It's ok to be a Deception fanboy, it really is, the spec got enough 1.4 love to be passable, and it is fun to see how big a shock you can get. But it does not compare to Wakajinn. Period.

Xethis's Avatar


Xethis
11.13.2012 , 03:45 AM | #100
Quote: Originally Posted by Elyna_ View Post
You still say you don't know how it can be done as full deception yet you are using the same exact moves and as your spec you have 10 less force + death field. If you opened the same exact way as full deception the damage does not change and while he was in a full stun with your ew proc you could have just double mauled into an assassinate to finish him. What your saying is that because you finished him with a 50 force death field which clipped the tank sin as well was the determining factor in you winning the 2vs1??? I doubt that very much so and not to mention how death field probably tickled the tank sin. Your come back is laughable at best but if you want to be a clown so be it.
I guess you are correct, everything in my 2v1 except DF could be used by a full Deception Assassin. But come on, what Deception Assassin in there right mind would Shock with out 2xVS?! You mentioned I should have double Mauled into an Assassinate while I had the Mara stunned which would have been possible, I do utilize Maul even with out EW proc while Im in my DE buff quite often, but in this case I really was not expecting to get as many crits as I did and was trying to start setting myself up for a cheap Shock. On these two points your argument does have some validity, however I do not agree 100%.

What I do disagree with is your attitude towards the force cost of abilities. I guess you will say anything to try and twist my words against me. Most full Deception Assassins find the 10 extra force a complete wast of a talent point. Sure on paper when you do the math it allows you about a 33% chance to actually gain a global before you have to Saber Strike because you don't have enough force for an ability. But I have never heard of any Assassins of any spec worried about force anymore. The new Darkswell and Duplicity talents are so powerful now that force management is a joke. Hence the reason that leaving the force cost of DF at 50 isn't necessarily a bad choice, its just a choice of preference. Most pvpers also find that the amount of cc and snares being thrown at them isn't always a bad thing, we nuke then get cc'd just long enough for force to regen and abilities to come off of CD and then just nuke again.

Look bro, I am just as much a fan boi of the Mad Maul spec as you are the Deception spec. I can do amazing things in pvp with Mad Maul (many things Deception and Wakajinn spec cannot do) but when it comes down to it what Wakajinn brings to the table is just better for pvp. The thing that Deception will never bring to the table is an instant cast 30m aoe that can stop caps even from people that are LOS, that **** is priceless.