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Premades are ruining non-ranked warzones

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Premades are ruining non-ranked warzones

TridusSWTOR's Avatar


TridusSWTOR
11.20.2012 , 12:28 PM | #1011
Quote: Originally Posted by Wainamoinen View Post
Pretty obvious. Playing with friends, it's a social activity. As opposed to briefly being in the same warzone with people you've never met, won't speak to, and will likely not see again.

Solo-pugging isn't "meeting new people", if you're honest. It's playing alone (the clue is in the "solo" part). And the most common communication you'll see in a pug group is some variant of "*** are you all idiot NOOBZ!!??111", which neither encourages continuing friendly relationships nor winning warzones.

Not that I'm really down on pugging, most of the time I solo PUG. Often because there isn't anyone I want to group with on, but usually because I don't want to deal with other people.

That doesn't make other arguments about PUGs and whether they should have a separate queue, or improved matchmaking, invalid. But claiming they're more social (like claiming PUGs are more skilled), is obviously bogus. Your other arguments would be more convincing if, in your rush to refute every last thing your opponent says, you avoided the temptation to claim PUGs are superior in ways that anyone not actively self-deluding can see they are not.

Oooo look. Over a thousand posts now. A tribute to grim determination.
Then you must of met some horrible solo queuer's with bad attitudes...oh wait I grouped people like that as well. So your entire argument is based on a individuals personality and not actually the game.

So what you are saying is, grouping with the same 4 people and doing pvp is a group activity. But when a solo queue guy joins a group for pvp and potenially meets new people and perhaps make a friend or two...that isn't a group activity. That is what you are saying....which makes no sense, it was even hard for me to type.

How do guild recruit people? Is it the same 4 people and every guild stays at only 4 people? I don't think so.
So that must mean they group with new people...solo queue people and get to know them and add them to their group. Kinda like how a solo queuer can meet another random solo queuer and form a friendship.

So you got the premade that runs with the same 4 people all the time.
Or
You got a solo queuer making new friendships with other new players...possibly forming a new group.

Which one is gonna build the community faster?

Exactly.

According to this guy, if you met anyone outside of your inner circle of friends then well, you aren't actually meeting or making new friends.

TridusSWTOR's Avatar


TridusSWTOR
11.20.2012 , 12:32 PM | #1012
Quote: Originally Posted by cycao View Post
I saw someone make a post yesterday and I will paraphrase it because it was fairly spot on.

I hear a big reason for solo players not wanting to find groups to do normal warzones or guilds for that matter is they have limited playing time. Well this is true for a lot of players. I may only get a few hours or no time to do PvP in general. Now if I have 3 other guildies/friends online great lets get a group going. I am not going to spend an hour or so waiting to get any group together for rateds of the most basic group comp (2 tanks 2 healers 4 dps of ANY class) let alone get an optimized group together because I could be waiting quite some time for that let alone hoping another team is queuing up. I have spent an hour waiting for a rated queue to pop and thats not fun.
So don't expect a random pugger to suck it up and look for people if they got a short play time as well. Nobody is forcing you to pick the best possible ranked team setup, that's your choice.

Pvtcarnage's Avatar


Pvtcarnage
11.20.2012 , 12:34 PM | #1013
Quote: Originally Posted by Striders View Post
The goal of this game is not to allow "care bears" to run around winning warzones to make them feel better about themselves. The game provides warzones to fight other players and that is their only job here... the job is not to make sure that everyone is able to win and everyone gets their "trophies" and feels like they are special.

If you want to get better at warzones I would encourage you to do a couple of things:

Work On Your Gear
The better the gear the better chance you have. A lot of those overpowered players in their "pre-mades" have put in a lot of time and effort to get their gear, why should it be any different for anyone else? We have all done it... and yes, I have endured PUGing warzones for an entire day losing most matches but in the end my reward was another piece of gear that puts me closer to my goal(s).

Join a Guild
Yes, that's right. Maybe if you socialize a little you can find like-minded people to queue with... I understand that some people want to be anti-social and guess what? The price you pay for not wanting to join guilds or be social is that you get to PUG warzones by yourself all the time. There is a very simple solution to it but if you refuse than there really isn't anything I can do about it but I'd love to stop hearing you complain.

Realize You Don't Win Them All
I understand that a lot of you grew up in the "participation trophy" / "no dodgeball since it hurts feelings" era of education and because of this you expect everything in life to be a level playing field but that is sadly not reality. There are always winners and always losers and you just need to keep working at getting better. Sadly a lot of the PUGs I have played with (and probably some people on this thread) won't be any better even with good gear. These people won't even realize it's them... they will blame the game, the warzone or the teammates and never realize they are just NOT GOOD.

For anyone complaining on this thread (or the 15 other threads on the same topic) I would suggest you direct all of your negative, whiny energy towards improving your play-style, gearing your toon up and joining a guild. A month from now if you have done that you will probably have forgotten all your ************ and will be one of the people that everyone here is complaining about. People just need to take responsibility for getting better... it won't be handed to you regardless of what your parents tell you.
Very well said
"Equality is a perversion of the natural order!…It binds the strong to the weak. They [the weak] become anchors that drag the exceptional down to mediocrity. Individuals destined and deserving of greatness have it denied them.
-Darth Bane

TridusSWTOR's Avatar


TridusSWTOR
11.20.2012 , 12:44 PM | #1014
Quote: Originally Posted by Striders View Post
The goal of this game is not to allow "care bears" to run around winning warzones to make them feel better about themselves. The game provides warzones to fight other players and that is their only job here... the job is not to make sure that everyone is able to win and everyone gets their "trophies" and feels like they are special.

If you want to get better at warzones I would encourage you to do a couple of things:

Work On Your Gear
The better the gear the better chance you have. A lot of those overpowered players in their "pre-mades" have put in a lot of time and effort to get their gear, why should it be any different for anyone else? We have all done it... and yes, I have endured PUGing warzones for an entire day losing most matches but in the end my reward was another piece of gear that puts me closer to my goal(s).

Join a Guild
Yes, that's right. Maybe if you socialize a little you can find like-minded people to queue with... I understand that some people want to be anti-social and guess what? The price you pay for not wanting to join guilds or be social is that you get to PUG warzones by yourself all the time. There is a very simple solution to it but if you refuse than there really isn't anything I can do about it but I'd love to stop hearing you complain.

Realize You Don't Win Them All
I understand that a lot of you grew up in the "participation trophy" / "no dodgeball since it hurts feelings" era of education and because of this you expect everything in life to be a level playing field but that is sadly not reality. There are always winners and always losers and you just need to keep working at getting better. Sadly a lot of the PUGs I have played with (and probably some people on this thread) won't be any better even with good gear. These people won't even realize it's them... they will blame the game, the warzone or the teammates and never realize they are just NOT GOOD.

For anyone complaining on this thread (or the 15 other threads on the same topic) I would suggest you direct all of your negative, whiny energy towards improving your play-style, gearing your toon up and joining a guild. A month from now if you have done that you will probably have forgotten all your ************ and will be one of the people that everyone here is complaining about. People just need to take responsibility for getting better... it won't be handed to you regardless of what your parents tell you.
So you want someone to join a guild. Alright to all you solo queuers out there, apply to the best or one of the best PVP guilds on your server.

Wait...they won't take you? Why?
1. You aren't the right AC
2. You don't have the Gear
3. We already got our people.
4. You are a commando.

Yup you offered some valid suggestions, it's a shame they don't actually work. I'm glad you admit that Gear> Skill as far as pvp goes though.

TonyDragonflame's Avatar


TonyDragonflame
11.20.2012 , 01:09 PM | #1015
Quote: Originally Posted by Striders View Post
The goal of this game is not to allow "care bears" to run around winning warzones to make them feel better about themselves. The game provides warzones to fight other players and that is their only job here... the job is not to make sure that everyone is able to win and everyone gets their "trophies" and feels like they are special.

If you want to get better at warzones I would encourage you to do a couple of things:

Work On Your Gear
The better the gear the better chance you have. A lot of those overpowered players in their "pre-mades" have put in a lot of time and effort to get their gear, why should it be any different for anyone else? We have all done it... and yes, I have endured PUGing warzones for an entire day losing most matches but in the end my reward was another piece of gear that puts me closer to my goal(s).

Join a Guild
Yes, that's right. Maybe if you socialize a little you can find like-minded people to queue with... I understand that some people want to be anti-social and guess what? The price you pay for not wanting to join guilds or be social is that you get to PUG warzones by yourself all the time. There is a very simple solution to it but if you refuse than there really isn't anything I can do about it but I'd love to stop hearing you complain.

Realize You Don't Win Them All
I understand that a lot of you grew up in the "participation trophy" / "no dodgeball since it hurts feelings" era of education and because of this you expect everything in life to be a level playing field but that is sadly not reality. There are always winners and always losers and you just need to keep working at getting better. Sadly a lot of the PUGs I have played with (and probably some people on this thread) won't be any better even with good gear. These people won't even realize it's them... they will blame the game, the warzone or the teammates and never realize they are just NOT GOOD.

For anyone complaining on this thread (or the 15 other threads on the same topic) I would suggest you direct all of your negative, whiny energy towards improving your play-style, gearing your toon up and joining a guild. A month from now if you have done that you will probably have forgotten all your ************ and will be one of the people that everyone here is complaining about. People just need to take responsibility for getting better... it won't be handed to you regardless of what your parents tell you.
Dude, easy quit playing because its not fun, than doing all what you write in this wall of text

CharterMonkKent's Avatar


CharterMonkKent
11.20.2012 , 01:14 PM | #1016
Quote: Originally Posted by TridusSWTOR View Post
So you want someone to join a guild. Alright to all you solo queuers out there, apply to the best or one of the best PVP guilds on your server.

Wait...they won't take you? Why?
1. You aren't the right AC
2. You don't have the Gear
3. We already got our people.
4. You are a commando.

Yup you offered some valid suggestions, it's a shame they don't actually work. I'm glad you admit that Gear> Skill as far as pvp goes though.
I don't know how you jumped all the way to asking to join the best guild on the server. That was quite a leap from what the poster said.

My interpretation of what he said is a tough love, help yourself mentality. Get skilled, get gear, make friends, join/create a guild. Hard to argue against that in an MMO. Especially if someone didn't bring a guild from another game. I joined this game with no guild, not knowing one player, haven't played an MMO for nearly a decade. I'm now in a very active guild that plays all aspects of the game, I'm a main raid healer, I lead our pvp groups, I get asked to join other guilds rated teams. Why? Because I talk to people from time to time and probably because I don't say fake worlds like lolsmash.

Overall I think he is railing against those who want everything to come easy. As he put it "Care Bear".
Wnk & Zlk & Knk & Xlk & Znk & Ynk & Tnk & Qnk & Chart
<Nothing Personal>
+ =

cycao's Avatar


cycao
11.20.2012 , 01:14 PM | #1017
Quote: Originally Posted by TridusSWTOR View Post
So don't expect a random pugger to suck it up and look for people if they got a short play time as well. Nobody is forcing you to pick the best possible ranked team setup, that's your choice.
Man people don't read these days. I said I look for anything that resembles the most basic of team compositions. If I have one or two PvPers that are online in my guild we are grouping since our ultimate goal is getting a ranked team. I don't log in and say well hey they're a few of us online and even though we joined a guild to socialize and do group for anything really...lets just solo queue and see what happens.

HuaRya's Avatar


HuaRya
11.20.2012 , 01:21 PM | #1018
Quote: Originally Posted by TridusSWTOR View Post
So you want someone to join a guild. Alright to all you solo queuers out there, apply to the best or one of the best PVP guilds on your server.

Wait...they won't take you? Why?
1. You aren't the right AC
2. You don't have the Gear
3. We already got our people.
4. You are a commando.

Yup you offered some valid suggestions, it's a shame they don't actually work. I'm glad you admit that Gear> Skill as far as pvp goes though.
Well Said...

And most of the established guilds want to keep the largest pool of new pvp'ers from which to medal farm from.

QUESTION TO PREMADE/GUILD TEAMS: If all you are doing is spending 90% of your time going against pugs then why the need to have your premade team? Just queue solo and rely on your own skills instead of being carried by your team match after match after match after (oh look another WH piece) after match after match .........

Doomsdaycomes's Avatar


Doomsdaycomes
11.20.2012 , 01:22 PM | #1019
Quote: Originally Posted by TridusSWTOR View Post
So don't expect a random pugger to suck it up and look for people if they got a short play time as well. Nobody is forcing you to pick the best possible ranked team setup, that's your choice.
*smacks self on the forehead, also know as *facepalm.*

Ya still don't get it.

Some solo players complain that the reason they can't be bothered to make 1-3 friends and play with them when available is a lack of "time."

Then their response is that Premade players should find 4 more people and do ranked, rather than play in non-ranked warzones. The same argument can be said for a Premade player, that they do not form exactly 8 people and do ranked because of time constraints.

The difference is that is the Solo player doesn't form into a group because of lack of time, they can still PLAY. If group oriented players can not form 7 other people (7 is greater than 1-3) for ranked (where ya'll say they should be) do to lack of time, that player CAN'T PLAY at all.

-.- in the age of equality, I think they forgot to tell people what inequality means.

Doomsdaycomes's Avatar


Doomsdaycomes
11.20.2012 , 01:31 PM | #1020
Quote: Originally Posted by HuaRya View Post
QUESTION TO PREMADE/GUILD TEAMS: If all you are doing is spending 90% of your time going against pugs then why the need to have your premade team? Just queue solo and rely on your own skills instead of being carried by your team match after match after match after (oh look another WH piece) after match after match .........
First, I spend about 60% of my matches vs. PuG's, though neither one of us has -accurate- data on what % we go against what. Why? Because you literally can't tell a premade unless they all have the same guild tag. Fyi, when my guildies aren't on or are busy, I form a group from my friends list.

Secondly, Teamwork is a skill. Until you let go of the idea that somehow the lone PuG'er with the uber l33t 1 vs 1 dueling skillz is the epitome of Skill, you will be a Scrub. Before you get all upset that the big bad Doomsy called you a Scrub, go read Playing to Winl by Sirlin and understand what that means.

Premades -do not- make good players. Good Players make Premades (atleast the Good Premades =P).