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Random number generator for reverse engineering flaky

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Crew Skills
Random number generator for reverse engineering flaky

snacktray's Avatar


snacktray
10.13.2012 , 05:04 PM | #11
Why do people always confused random number generator with a perfectly distributed number generator.

Braeka's Avatar


Braeka
10.14.2012 , 03:19 AM | #12
In the past getting a blue schematic quite often happened within the 1st 5 attempts, with most happening within 10 attempts. Then there would be the occasional painful one.

However over the last couple of days they've mostly been painful. Either I've had a major bad run, or someone in BW has changed something.

Malkavier's Avatar


Malkavier
10.14.2012 , 06:16 AM | #13
I've several items that I've attempted to RE now for 184 tries and counting.

This is statistically nil, and should be impossible if the number generator at all worked like it should.

I'm more inclined to believe they lowered the chances of a successful RE across the board way back when they did the crafting changes, and did a lazy copypasta of 10% and 20% to the appropriate schematics (which would totally fit right in with the same copypasta tactics they've used for everything else).
L50 Annhi Marauder L50 Madness Sorc L17 Gunslinger L23 Pyro Tech L35 Medic OP L17 Marks Sniper L50 Lethality Sniper

"Your fear angers me. My anger feeds my hate. My hate gives me strength."

Sabredance's Avatar


Sabredance
10.14.2012 , 09:39 AM | #14
Human perception of probability is severly flawed and there is always an abundance of posts about it in games where RNG is involved.

The X-Com Enemy Unknown forum is full of it atm.

Always the hottest topic in Blood Bowl.

Or the Crew skill section of SWtOR.
At the beginning it was the Battlemaster tokens.

Quite entertaining for someone who studied maths and experienced the process
from flawed intuitive perception of probability till the theoretical understanding.

My own mind fooled me on many occassions on the way.

Chaffery's Avatar


Chaffery
10.15.2012 , 09:40 AM | #15
Here is a little feed for theory.
Yesterday before logging I left T7 craft lv45 armorings, logged on, had 3 armorings in inventory, all RE attempts failed. Crafted another 3, T7 critted 1, blue proc from 4'th RE attempt.
Then I made 3 lv45 barrels, blue proc on 2'nd RE attempt.
3 aim modifications for lv45, blue proc on 1'st RE attempt.
2 different types lv43 enchants for commando and M1-4X, enchant for commando blue proc on 2'nd RE attempt, enchant for droid blue proc on 3'rd RE.

All that today, while I was leveling treasure hunting on 1 toon and did try RE with hour or more breaks.

Tell me something more about RNG, let's stay on topic, RE in game is flaky.
Or switching toons messes up RNG, or something else but as I mentioned in previous post, from 5 crafts after break blue proc is mostly like 100% guaranteed. At least that is how it works for me.

Telanis's Avatar


Telanis
10.15.2012 , 11:19 AM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Chaffery View Post
Here is a little feed for theory.
Yesterday before logging I left T7 craft lv45 armorings, logged on, had 3 armorings in inventory, all RE attempts failed. Crafted another 3, T7 critted 1, blue proc from 4'th RE attempt.
Then I made 3 lv45 barrels, blue proc on 2'nd RE attempt.
3 aim modifications for lv45, blue proc on 1'st RE attempt.
2 different types lv43 enchants for commando and M1-4X, enchant for commando blue proc on 2'nd RE attempt, enchant for droid blue proc on 3'rd RE.

All that today, while I was leveling treasure hunting on 1 toon and did try RE with hour or more breaks.

Tell me something more about RNG, let's stay on topic, RE in game is flaky.
Or switching toons messes up RNG, or something else but as I mentioned in previous post, from 5 crafts after break blue proc is mostly like 100% guaranteed. At least that is how it works for me.
Nothing you can do is statistically meaningful. We'd need thousands of players with dozens of items each confirming this. Like I've said above, BW is the only one with those kinds of stats and they are checking them.

My streak of 50 was broken when I logged out and back in and the first RE attempt worked. But I didn't have to wait like you say, and it only happened once. If I were to believe that was a surefire method it would be nothing but confirmation bias.

I still agree that this is a dumb system, but yeah.

Chaffery's Avatar


Chaffery
10.15.2012 , 02:09 PM | #17
What I have noticed, if you craft and try RE without logging attempt mostly fails. I have been using this method with all crew skills, it works same way with any crew skill.
One day I was lazy to log out, as I had enough mats, I was just curious how long it takes. I ended up with 21 augentation slot components, technically I wasted stack of Diatium and Resinite. What a waste.

And if we talking about collecting information, many peoples don't know it yet. Hopefully now peoples could experiment and give some feedback, unless BW nerf it.

psandak's Avatar


psandak
10.15.2012 , 02:29 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Chaffery View Post
What I have noticed, if you craft and try RE without logging attempt mostly fails. I have been using this method with all crew skills, it works same way with any crew skill.
One day I was lazy to log out, as I had enough mats, I was just curious how long it takes. I ended up with 21 augentation slot components, technically I wasted stack of Diatium and Resinite. What a waste.

And if we talking about collecting information, many peoples don't know it yet. Hopefully now peoples could experiment and give some feedback, unless BW nerf it.
OTOH - I typically RE as the stuff comes into my inventory because I usually kick off 10-20 craftings and if I get what I want I cancel the rest. I have sometimes gotten a schematic on the first attempt. Sometimes on the 20th. Sometimes not at all. Typically though I get one within somewhere in the 5th to 10th range. And that is statistically average (on 20% chance the chance of success tips in your favor after the eight attempt).

I have also kicked off 20, logged off and then back on - after all the crafting is done (usually overnight) - start REing, saving the items that happened to get an augment slot, and I go through 18 with nothing then I take a chance and RE those with the augment slot and BAM two in a row OR I get nothing.

My point is You do your thing, I'll do mine, and there are plenty of players out there who do things they THINK influences the outcome. But in reality, everything you or I or anyone else does to try to influence the numbers is all superstitious nonsense .

That being said, like the Bud Light says, "it's only weird if it doesn't work."

Chaffery's Avatar


Chaffery
10.15.2012 , 03:11 PM | #19
If you read my previous post, over night did not work for me. Perhaps it would if I had 5 items for RE, my goal was test proc from 3 crafted items. Only 1 failed, as I got RE proc on 4'th attempt. Any way, I'm not insisting using my method but saying anything against with out testing and talking about "random" is is nonsense.
This game is so badly manipulated, it is full of negative modifiers. So what some peoples call to random is actually fixed card deck.

Examples? OK, no problems.
First go to 10 levels lower 4 man HC and see what drops. Then level up 5 levels and see drops, amount of dropped credits is significantly less. Plus try grind out some items, not a chance in hell, best what you could get is some green junk. Random? Sure, I call it to anti grind measure.
Then hottest topic, slicing, do T1 missions. First only with 1 companion, let's call it to random, then let second companion start doing T1 missions. Oh noes, cases are far slimmer than with 1 companion. Stop second comp and you notice that boxes get fat again. And last thing, send out 3 companions do T1 slicing missions, you barely come up with par. Same way entire "random" works with any mission based crew skill, best result comes with only 1 companion.

Why? Look at legacy vendor prices, you will get the idea. It is first, anti grind measure and second, pre programmed down time via grind. Because BW selling playing time, obviously than more you have down time, than better for them.
You may remember from past my ranting here on forums, looks like finally I figured out all mechanics.
Last hint, create trial account and run missions on trial account, out come is significantly boosted. Why? Take it as advertisement.

This game "random" is full of nanny policy "can't do this and can't do that" BS.
So BW, can we have truly random system please? Current "random" system looks to me like scam.

criminalheretic's Avatar


criminalheretic
10.15.2012 , 03:33 PM | #20
As many others have explained in more complicated terms, I feel it is perception. The times we have to RE an item 32 times stand out in our memory far more than the times we got it on the 1st or 2nd try.

All that to say, in the hope of improving perception, I would gladly do away with the latter, to avoid the former. Just get rid of RNG completely and make it a finite number. Green -> Blue = you have to craft/RE 5, every time. Blue -> Purple = you have to craft 10, every time. And you always get your schem on the 5th or 10th try respectively. I could live with that.
What we don't understand, we can make mean anything.
Hyperspace Cannon -> Drooga's -> The Harbinger