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Merc is TERRIBLE


Lionflash's Avatar


Lionflash
10.10.2012 , 12:33 PM | #211
Quote: Originally Posted by DkSharktooth View Post
The distance covered in this time will not make any difference whatsoever. You are almost always slowed, if not, the distance gap created by 30% movement speed for 4 seconds against any player with a brain, will cause that player to use a ranged ability such as a stun, root, leap, throw or ranged ability. This 30% would look nice on paper but wouldn't solve anything.
okay... 40%?

Okay so I'm not PVP balance expert but mobility is what the merc needs, besides being a turret is no fun. Maybe all Merc should have a 15% movements increase permenantly as well.

SpaniardInfinity's Avatar


SpaniardInfinity
10.10.2012 , 01:09 PM | #212
Quote: Originally Posted by Technohic View Post
lol Some utility would make the class more enjoyable at least. So what about if they left the root on punch and added a knockback to tracer missile or railshot. A jet pack jump away from trouble would be nice if you could go up a level in Hutt Ball or just jump away on flat areas a few meters. Of course for the commando mirror, they would do it by pointing that big gun at the ground. Hey! Maybe that would be the extra KB? lol

OH. or just add to TM that if you are running toward the Merc, it stops you for just a split second when it hits. Sort of like a stutter step.

Just tossing out ideas.
Give a Commando and Mercenary an enrage timer, either have the third time they are interrupted or if they are still alive after 30 seconds. They can then be immune to interrupts for 10 seconds. Also, instead of having Full Auto snare people, either make it root or have knockback built into the attack. It cannot be interrupted (all kidding aside though, someone explain to me why Ravage/Master Strike is immune to interrupts while Full Auto/Unload -- specifically on a Gunnery/Arsenal -- can be interrupted).
Aux "Spaniard" Wargarde (Rank 2400+ Combat Medic) | Reighner the Relentless (Conqueror Bodyguard)
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Xertasian's Avatar


Xertasian
10.10.2012 , 01:34 PM | #213
usually i stay out of these threads..but the whining on mercs/commandos by people who dont understand the class..since im started this gonna explain the reason why mercs/commandos are not terrible in dps..

1st off this is important..truly no class is terrible or underpowered actually it is the person playing the toon that make it terrible..you can have the best gear around but if you dont understand your class and know how to play to it full capabilities you gonna suck...that is not the fault of the toon but the person playing it..

for starters i see to many commandos and mercs backpedaling while attacking in pvp..thats just wrong if you have to backpedal and keyturn you gonna have problems when a skilled person that mouse turn and uses keybinds get on you..again thats is not the toon fault but the player..

in 50 pvp we all know that skills with cast times is risky for to many classes, cause of interrupt and stuns..like gunnery tree is good but really in pvp its a liability in a sense..i mean one of your best attack skills have a cast to it..any good pvper not gonna let you sit there and hep derp spam gravity round..

actually assault spec is probably your best build for pvp.sure you only spam a few skills.but you is mobile and doing damage..instead of being in 1 spot trying to spam cast your gravity round becoming cannon founder for melee classes..the key word here is mobile..commandos/mercs are made to be on the run when attacking not standing still..for pvp specs that is another subject..

commandos/mercs having problems with melee alot of people say in this thread i dont see how honestly..commandos/mercs have a big advantage over melee in a sense..they are range attackers..meaning if you is mouse turning they can actually attack in a full 360 degree rotation..explain next paragraph what i mean..

a good melee player using keybinds and mouse turning cant actually attack in a 360 degree rotation cuz they will get that message "NOT FACING TARGET" usually.even with strafing they are limited to there melee attack rotations..a commando/merc one that mouse turns and uses keybnds can constantly attack out of melee range at a 360 roatation making it hard for the melee player to get on him even if he do he wont keep up with turning mechanism of the commando/merc..

say a shadow get on you unless he uses a stun or some form of cc to keep you in place for him to attack in melee..he gonna have a hard time closing in on you cause of the range and the constant 360 rotaion movememnt of your merc..sure they have instances of mercs getting force lift and other things but they can get away and go back on the attack..

i could go on about this topic..i think i just wanted to hit a few basic points,,the have more factors to include like team make up, gear and tree specs..your attack rotations with your movements either mouse turnng or backpedaling..anybody think they have more to say please feel free to add on your opinion..i'm pretty sure they have more to talk about ..

lastly all the threads on classes being op or classes being terrible..i would say overall most classes are pretty balance..before people come with the fotm issue..a mara can only do much as the person behind playing the toon...again its not the class issue but the player issue..alot of people dont want to admit that the problem is them and they way how they is playing there class..

some people roll a mara or pyrotech think easy pawnage in pvp..they get the gear and still get owned wondering why..its not the class or the gear since you have the best on your toon..only problem it can be is YOU..hope alot of people will actually look at there class in general and try to figure out what you is doing wrong..alot of times that is the problem and the only solution is when you admit to it and better yourself..
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Technohic's Avatar


Technohic
10.10.2012 , 01:53 PM | #214
^^ I know what I have been doing wrong now. I haven't been fighting melee people who have a hard time with facing their target. Shame on my for no L2P. Strictly keyboard turners for me from now on.

dalevan's Avatar


dalevan
10.10.2012 , 02:56 PM | #215
Commando/Merc, I agree, needs much better survivability. I will admit I haven't been playing in Ranked Warzones because only about 4 at the most ever sign on in my guild at once. And joining PUG Ranked WZ's is worse than PUG regular most of the time.

I wouldn't say Commando/Merc is terrible, but I would say their survivability is less than the other classes. We do depend more on healers and that would take away more heals from classes that can stay up longer and do the same if not more damage.

I will also say that MOST of the time, it is the fault of the player and less about the class.

Commando/Merc definitely needs some love, but overall it isn't as terrible as a lot of people play it.
Dalevan - Commando Sibella - Vanguard Trystie - Scoundrel
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Volxen's Avatar


Volxen
10.10.2012 , 03:09 PM | #216
Quote: Originally Posted by Xertasian View Post
usually i stay out of these threads..but the whining on mercs/commandos by people who dont understand the class..since im started this gonna explain the reason why mercs/commandos are not terrible in dps..

1st off this is important..truly no class is terrible or underpowered actually it is the person playing the toon that make it terrible..you can have the best gear around but if you dont understand your class and know how to play to it full capabilities you gonna suck...that is not the fault of the toon but the person playing it..

for starters i see to many commandos and mercs backpedaling while attacking in pvp..thats just wrong if you have to backpedal and keyturn you gonna have problems when a skilled person that mouse turn and uses keybinds get on you..again thats is not the toon fault but the player..

in 50 pvp we all know that skills with cast times is risky for to many classes, cause of interrupt and stuns..like gunnery tree is good but really in pvp its a liability in a sense..i mean one of your best attack skills have a cast to it..any good pvper not gonna let you sit there and hep derp spam gravity round..

actually assault spec is probably your best build for pvp.sure you only spam a few skills.but you is mobile and doing damage..instead of being in 1 spot trying to spam cast your gravity round becoming cannon founder for melee classes..the key word here is mobile..commandos/mercs are made to be on the run when attacking not standing still..for pvp specs that is another subject..

commandos/mercs having problems with melee alot of people say in this thread i dont see how honestly..commandos/mercs have a big advantage over melee in a sense..they are range attackers..meaning if you is mouse turning they can actually attack in a full 360 degree rotation..explain next paragraph what i mean..

a good melee player using keybinds and mouse turning cant actually attack in a 360 degree rotation cuz they will get that message "NOT FACING TARGET" usually.even with strafing they are limited to there melee attack rotations..a commando/merc one that mouse turns and uses keybnds can constantly attack out of melee range at a 360 roatation making it hard for the melee player to get on him even if he do he wont keep up with turning mechanism of the commando/merc..

say a shadow get on you unless he uses a stun or some form of cc to keep you in place for him to attack in melee..he gonna have a hard time closing in on you cause of the range and the constant 360 rotaion movememnt of your merc..sure they have instances of mercs getting force lift and other things but they can get away and go back on the attack..

i could go on about this topic..i think i just wanted to hit a few basic points,,the have more factors to include like team make up, gear and tree specs..your attack rotations with your movements either mouse turnng or backpedaling..anybody think they have more to say please feel free to add on your opinion..i'm pretty sure they have more to talk about ..

lastly all the threads on classes being op or classes being terrible..i would say overall most classes are pretty balance..before people come with the fotm issue..a mara can only do much as the person behind playing the toon...again its not the class issue but the player issue..alot of people dont want to admit that the problem is them and they way how they is playing there class..

some people roll a mara or pyrotech think easy pawnage in pvp..they get the gear and still get owned wondering why..its not the class or the gear since you have the best on your toon..only problem it can be is YOU..hope alot of people will actually look at there class in general and try to figure out what you is doing wrong..alot of times that is the problem and the only solution is when you admit to it and better yourself..
Lmfao, congratulations on missing the entire point of this thread. Yes, we are all aware how great merc is if left alone, and how great it is against inferior players.

You might as well just give it up. The "merc is fine" arguments will just continue to get shot down and disproven each and every time. That's what happens when the entire basis for said argument is "I did pretty damn good against those lesser skilled players with my merc, so the class must be fine".

Jherad's Avatar


Jherad
10.10.2012 , 03:40 PM | #217
Quote: Originally Posted by Xertasian View Post
usually i stay out of these threads..but the whining
Do you Xertasian? Do you really?

Quote: Originally Posted by Xertasian View Post
usually i stay out of these topics on gear..truly i think the main point of the whining
Really really?

Quote: Originally Posted by Xertasian View Post
i stay out of these threads..from what i been reading it's not the fact of being stunned
Really really really?

Quote: Originally Posted by Xertasian View Post
usually i stay away from these discussions..saying that force in balance
Really really really really?

1/10 for effort. But I appreciate your dropping by. Have a super smashing day.
Zachar´ah - Commando / Chasso - Merc
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2.4 is the PvP Patch! ... J/K, Removing RWZs trolololol

Antipodes's Avatar


Antipodes
10.10.2012 , 04:20 PM | #218
Quote: Originally Posted by UGLYMRJ View Post
I didn't come into this game until shortly before 1.2 but I know sorcs had their time to shine, warriors have always been strong, assassins, operatives and snipers have been up and down, PT's of course are fine but I've never heard anyone say... "Remember when Mercs... " Or "Revert mercs back to 1.1" etc, etc...

Was just curious....
You missed all of the horrible players complaining about Tracer Missile spam back in Jan/early Feb. People complained about it as much as people complain about Smash now. These threads started thinning out as people learned to play (snare and interrupt is hard for SW nerds), but a few of them cropped up every once in awhile until 1.2.

Here are a few examples that came up from google search:
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=2735943
http://www.swtor.com/community/showt...78#post2010378
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=1074681
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=205369

The problem is that bad players are the first and the loudest complainers on the forums. Happened back then and happens now.

Here is my post that I made back in May after all the complaints with the 1.2 changes.
http://www.swtor.com/community/showt...94#post4247294

Quote: Originally Posted by Antipodes View Post
When this game was released, the hot topics the PvP forums regarding balance were:

- Nerf sorcs
- Nerf mercs and tracer missile.
- Ranged > Melee
- Healers are too good
- Expertise favors healing

Guess what, Bioware listened to the community and addressed them. Were the changes misguided? A resounding yes. But I find it ironic that appeasing the complaints only lead to more complaints.

The lesson to be learned here is that balance by popular vote (or metrics) is a terrible idea. Most people have no clue about game design/balance and are quicker to blame the game than understand it.

Amebia's Avatar


Amebia
10.10.2012 , 04:26 PM | #219
Why don't they buff all the classes to the LolMarauderp level?










Unsubbed

Wraiven's Avatar


Wraiven
10.10.2012 , 05:22 PM | #220
Quote: Originally Posted by Xertasian View Post
usually i stay out of these threads...blah blah blah
Hey bud...please tell me you are playing on Prophecy of the Five. I would be so honored to show you just how gimp you really are. You are obviously living in some sort of dream world.

Then maybe after I am finished with you, you can come back to this thread and tell us how you *really* feel about Mercs. Maybe then you will be on par with the conversation, while contributing to the thread as a man who knows what he is talking about.
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