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Bioware can you explain to me why...

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Bioware can you explain to me why...
First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

Coldin's Avatar


Coldin
10.18.2012 , 10:03 AM | #21
Thing is...it really didn't need buffing at all. It was already a very powerful spec. Maybe it could be cleaned up a little to be easier to play, but these changes actually increased the amount of damage it can do, and how often it can do it. I really don't get it.

And unfortunately by that dev comment, it sounds like it will take a long while before any change happens. DPS scoundrels are still waiting their turn at being "flavor of the month" by the way.

CommanderKeeva's Avatar


CommanderKeeva
10.18.2012 , 10:06 AM | #22
And maybe Bioware can explain to us now as well when Commandos/Merceneries will become a rated-viable class?
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veyl's Avatar


veyl
10.18.2012 , 10:12 AM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by AllisonBerryman View Post
I asked Austin Peckenpaugh (Senior Designer) about Rage and Focus builds and how they're fitting into PvP overall right now, and here was his comment:

Rage and Focus have always been high burst specs, but they haven't been very popular due to some usability and quality of life issues in the past. Our goal for Focus and Rage was to address those issues without significantly affecting their burst. In large part, I think we've done that, but the result is that many people are playing them now, which means there's a lot of AOE burst happening in warzones that wasn't happening before. We're willing to wait and see if their popularity is a result of being viewed as "flavor of the month" (i.e. Rage/Focus populations will naturally subside as people realize the spec doesn't suit their playstyle) or if they are truly too good and were just too unusable before. In short, we're going to keep a close eye on it.
In short: You still have no idea what you're doing on the PVP end of the spectrum. Assassin/Shadow Tank hybrids are outDPS'ing PURE dps classes (This is possible in Tank stance mind you), Sentinel/Marauder burst death squads are obliterating everything within 6 gcds (Yet still retain the most defensive CDs and TEAM BUFFS) and Paired smash (geared) warriors are AOE bombarding the **** out of clusters of players. Sorcs still don't have a defensive CD, mercs are still a red headed step child in the DPS department (just like lightning sorcs, the lack of mobility // reliance on one spell makes them a joke) and Operative healers are still the best PVP healer in the game.

The only thing I've seen *fixed* recently was the Pyro/vanguard ability to destroy someone at range and melee.

SIDENOTE: I am happy to see another "we're keeping an eye on it" response which is along the same lines of "Soon" and "stunlocking operative teams ruining PVP". /sarcasm.

On a more serious note: Can any of the developers respond to the Class Feedback threads? Because as of right now, they haven't listened to a damn word in them and have mentioned NOTHING about balancing PVE or PVP.

Capt_Beers's Avatar


Capt_Beers
10.18.2012 , 10:12 AM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by AllisonBerryman View Post
I asked Austin Peckenpaugh (Senior Designer) about Rage and Focus builds and how they're fitting into PvP overall right now, and here was his comment:

Rage and Focus have always been high burst specs, but they haven't been very popular due to some usability and quality of life issues in the past. Our goal for Focus and Rage was to address those issues without significantly affecting their burst. In large part, I think we've done that, but the result is that many people are playing them now, which means there's a lot of AOE burst happening in warzones that wasn't happening before. We're willing to wait and see if their popularity is a result of being viewed as "flavor of the month" (i.e. Rage/Focus populations will naturally subside as people realize the spec doesn't suit their playstyle) or if they are truly too good and were just too unusable before. In short, we're going to keep a close eye on it.
Thanks for the reply, Allison.

One of the biggest problems with Smash/Sweep now is the fact you can't stop it. It used be if you saw it coming you could knock them back and stop it. Now I notice that when a Jugg/Guardian leaps to me even if I knock them back before it goes off I'll see them land the animation goes off 20m away and I still eat a 5k hit. It also takes little to no setup. Leap, Smash/Sweep isn't exactly a complex rotation. Force Stasis/Choke, get knocked back, Leap, Smash/Sweep isn't exactly rocket science either. It's an incredibly hard hitting AoE instant it should take some significant setup to deal the kind of damage that it does.
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wallywaffles's Avatar


wallywaffles
10.18.2012 , 10:17 AM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by Coldin View Post
DPS scoundrels are still waiting their turn at being "flavor of the month" by the way.
LOL... just LOL.



In my view the extra stacks of shockwave and cooldowns and stuff do make it easier to use, the problem is it also makes the spec significantly stronger. When combined with the instant cast it's too much; dodging/knockbacks used to be the way to counter smashes. It is very fun to play as, but kinda ridiculous when there's more than one (just like pre-1.4 assault vanguards).

And an even more serious problem IMO is that it makes Vigilance/Vengeance specs completely obsolete. Seriously, the only benefit is extra damage reduction, as a DPS spec. Rage/Focus hits 5-10% higher on a single target, and completely obliterates groups. Our Vig Guardian was already our raid's highest DPS, and now he's respecced and does 8% more damage without even practicing on Focus.

anwg's Avatar


anwg
10.18.2012 , 10:45 AM | #26
It's even more laughable when you compare smash to other AoEs, eg. flamethrower which is a 3 second cast, does less damage, does not auto crit, longer cooldown, and costs more resource.

MatticusFinch's Avatar


MatticusFinch
10.18.2012 , 10:55 AM | #27
I'm glad there is finally a response given, since this is probably the 6th thread that I can think of that has asked reasonably for an explanation and wasn't just complaining. Unfortunately, this response only indicates that the developers in all reality are entirely unaware of the current situation of warzones and PvP balancing, unless they are simply trying to mask their poor decisions in PR language. I'm content with neither.

Where are the promised class balance patches that were supposed to occur on shorter intervals?
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jmsutton's Avatar


jmsutton
10.18.2012 , 11:01 AM | #28
This is going to be crazy talk I know. But what's the AOE range on Smash?

Couldn't you people just... not stand so close together?

I mean seriously. God forbid we fight intelligently. Also, I don't have a Rage spec Warrior/Knight. In fact, my Warrior is Immortal tank spec.

CBRGhostRider's Avatar


CBRGhostRider
10.18.2012 , 11:01 AM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by AllisonBerryman View Post
I asked Austin Peckenpaugh (Senior Designer) about Rage and Focus builds and how they're fitting into PvP overall right now, and here was his comment:

Rage and Focus have always been high burst specs, but they haven't been very popular due to some usability and quality of life issues in the past. Our goal for Focus and Rage was to address those issues without significantly affecting their burst. In large part, I think we've done that, but the result is that many people are playing them now, which means there's a lot of AOE burst happening in warzones that wasn't happening before. We're willing to wait and see if their popularity is a result of being viewed as "flavor of the month" (i.e. Rage/Focus populations will naturally subside as people realize the spec doesn't suit their playstyle) or if they are truly too good and were just too unusable before. In short, we're going to keep a close eye on it.
I just want to say... thank you very much for your reply! Good to see devs and mods starting to address some of the things being brought up, we need more of this involvement from you guys.

EDIT: FYI, I think the main issue with smash is the ridiculous auto-crit, which enables the player to stack surge and power and have big smash numbers.
Spoiler

Majspuffen's Avatar


Majspuffen
10.18.2012 , 11:21 AM | #30
On my server there were plenty of focus/rage knights/warriors. And they did nice damage, too. Focus/rage tanks were also very good, being able to guard and kill at the same time. I have a friend who is a rage-specced juggernaut tank and he has been playing that spec since before 1.2 and he's now disgusted by it. The same way I'm disgusted by the medic operative buffs in 1.2. Operatives were fine, aside from the lacklustre top talent. You could have buffed that, and that alone.

It's kinda funny how you claimed that infiltration shadows were fine, but apparently focus knights were not. When a class can dish out 400-500k damage in an average WZ and have around 150k protection, something is not right.
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