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Can we get an update on Bioware's stance?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Can we get an update on Bioware's stance?

Wraiven's Avatar


Wraiven
10.07.2012 , 10:21 PM | #61
Quote: Originally Posted by Qarran View Post
Ok.. back to the original post. First and foremost, nothing was taken away from Inqs. AOE has actually been improved for PVE. That's right improved. I ran into this today.

Blow back is now directional (not removed). This is a bonus because it allows for the use of AOE with out breaking CC. Ran a few HMs and had great runs because of it: CC elites, blew mobs off ledges and finished the elites. Easy peasy.

So... before you start talking about what they took away, maybe you should look at what was left behind. Change is not always a bad thing.
For every use you can find for it, I can counter with a better use I had before the change. What you feel and what I feel are only a minor relevance in the whole scheme of things. It was a bad decision for Bioware to make...period. Most people were fine with how it was...I can not recall anyone ever complaining about it the way it was previously, and to be quite honest, I refuse to play an Inquisitor class now because of it. I am almost half temped to refuse to play the Merc now because of their change as well. Let them nerf to the remaining classes and guess what...see ya, taking my 15 bucks a month and going elsewhere. Let you guys have fun with the Free to Play kids. Oh, and you will enjoy the mass amount of kids coming to play.

Think trolling is bad now? Hahaha, wait till the Free to Play kids get here. Been there, done that, seen it all. If I am to tolerate the Free to Play kids, this game had better stop with the silly changes and get back on track. I love this game, but they continue to make goofy changes, it won't be the same game anymore...and I will not stand around and let somebody paint my cherry red 1976 Trans-Am puke green, and tell me that it's actually better just because a few of you like puke green as opposed to my cherry red.
Republic: Krulex (Shadow) Kn (Guardian) Krll (Sentinel) Wanatrime (Vanguard)
Imperial: Wraiven (Assassin) Krullous (Marauder) Krawl (Jugg) Xin (Jugg)
♠♠♠ The Soulstalker Legacy ♠♠♠
-FIGHT-

Thylbanus's Avatar


Thylbanus
10.08.2012 , 09:36 AM | #62
Quote: Originally Posted by Wraiven View Post
...and I will not stand around and let somebody paint my cherry red 1976 Trans-Am puke green, and tell me that it's actually better just because a few of you like puke green as opposed to my cherry red.
How is that even a comparative analogy? For one, this is not YOUR game. This is OUR game. So it's not your cherry red Trans-Am (and a '76 Trans-Am? It's no wonder they would have to go F2P).

If you want to compare it to a vehicle, this would be a cruise ship. The Captain (EA) decides the the course and speed. We are all just passengers. It's not the color of the ship, that would be cosmetic, this is functionality. More and more people are jumping ship because they don't like the course the ship has set, but the Capt. still needs money to keep her running. Can't charge people who aren't there. So at the next stop he will let everyone on for free and start charging for rooms, amenities, drinks, dinner, and entertainment. (microtransactions). Some will not like the change and they will jump ship, too. That's ok, as long as they can take in enough money to keep her running. The S.S. SWTOR (Some might say TORtanic) will make new ports and see new sights, and some of us are willing to put up with the kids since they gave us an IPod that will tune out the noise (ignore). Basically it's like Cartman said about Chat Roulette, "If you want to find some quality friends, you have to wade through all the [bleep]s first" A larger base of players means faster queue times, less waiting for WZ to populate, and new people who are not ALL jerks experiencing a new game that they may not have tried if it weren't free. Numbers bear this uncomfortable fact out. DDO, LotRO, DCUO, STO, and AoC would have shut down if it weren't for F2P. Some are slowly dying, but some have even posted record profits. It all depends on how it's done.

I'll wait.

Unless they keep puting out garbage like the 1.4 update. Then I'll just drop my sub and pop in from time to time to see if they made enough positive change to warrant a re-sub.
It's amazing how loud a dollar can be.
"Computer games don't affect kids; I mean if Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic music." - Kristin Wilson

Wraiven's Avatar


Wraiven
10.08.2012 , 10:02 AM | #63
Quote: Originally Posted by Thylbanus View Post
How is that even a comparative analogy? For one, this is not YOUR game. This is OUR game. So it's not your cherry red Trans-Am (and a '76 Trans-Am? It's no wonder they would have to go F2P).

If you want to compare it to a vehicle, this would be a cruise ship. The Captain (EA) decides the the course and speed. We are all just passengers. It's not the color of the ship, that would be cosmetic, this is functionality. More and more people are jumping ship because they don't like the course the ship has set, but the Capt. still needs money to keep her running. Can't charge people who aren't there. So at the next stop he will let everyone on for free and start charging for rooms, amenities, drinks, dinner, and entertainment. (microtransactions). Some will not like the change and they will jump ship, too. That's ok, as long as they can take in enough money to keep her running. The S.S. SWTOR (Some might say TORtanic) will make new ports and see new sights, and some of us are willing to put up with the kids since they gave us an IPod that will tune out the noise (ignore). Basically it's like Cartman said about Chat Roulette, "If you want to find some quality friends, you have to wade through all the [bleep]s first" A larger base of players means faster queue times, less waiting for WZ to populate, and new people who are not ALL jerks experiencing a new game that they may not have tried if it weren't free. Numbers bear this uncomfortable fact out. DDO, LotRO, DCUO, STO, and AoC would have shut down if it weren't for F2P. Some are slowly dying, but some have even posted record profits. It all depends on how it's done.

I'll wait.

Unless they keep puting out garbage like the 1.4 update. Then I'll just drop my sub and pop in from time to time to see if they made enough positive change to warrant a re-sub.
How can you not like a Cherry Red 1976 Trans-am?!?!?
Republic: Krulex (Shadow) Kn (Guardian) Krll (Sentinel) Wanatrime (Vanguard)
Imperial: Wraiven (Assassin) Krullous (Marauder) Krawl (Jugg) Xin (Jugg)
♠♠♠ The Soulstalker Legacy ♠♠♠
-FIGHT-

Qarran's Avatar


Qarran
10.08.2012 , 12:49 PM | #64
Quote: Originally Posted by Wraiven View Post
For every use you can find for it, I can counter with a better use I had before the change. What you feel and what I feel are only a minor relevance in the whole scheme of things. It was a bad decision for Bioware to make...period. Most people were fine with how it was...I can not recall anyone ever complaining about it the way it was previously, and to be quite honest, I refuse to play an Inquisitor class now because of it. I am almost half temped to refuse to play the Merc now because of their change as well. Let them nerf to the remaining classes and guess what...see ya, taking my 15 bucks a month and going elsewhere. Let you guys have fun with the Free to Play kids. Oh, and you will enjoy the mass amount of kids coming to play.

Think trolling is bad now? Hahaha, wait till the Free to Play kids get here. Been there, done that, seen it all. If I am to tolerate the Free to Play kids, this game had better stop with the silly changes and get back on track. I love this game, but they continue to make goofy changes, it won't be the same game anymore...and I will not stand around and let somebody paint my cherry red 1976 Trans-Am puke green, and tell me that it's actually better just because a few of you like puke green as opposed to my cherry red.
Lol. Liked how you worked your feelings about F2P in there. But it is totally irrelevant to the subject at hand.

Look, you have your opinion which is fine. But you seem to be thinking you speak for a multitude and you are not. Now that the AOE change has been implemented, for many that continue to play, it is not a problem. If you refuse to play because of the change it is your loss. I have an Assassin dps and a Shadow tank both at 50 and play has never been better IMO. Instead of waiting for a response that may or may not come, take the blinders off and play. You may find it is not ruined. However, if it is that black and white for you, c'est la vie. But don't presume you know what others think or find appealing about classes, nerfs, and or tuning. You don't.

DarthFamine's Avatar


DarthFamine
10.08.2012 , 01:10 PM | #65
I would like a response, and a hotfix to these poorly thought out and completely unnecessary changes.

/signed
"It might be fear, or anger, or hatred, or perhaps even suffering that makes a man fall to the dark side, but it is without a doubt regret, that keeps him there."
-Darth Famine
www.RJKgaming.com

Wraiven's Avatar


Wraiven
10.08.2012 , 02:28 PM | #66
Quote: Originally Posted by Qarran View Post
Lol. Liked how you worked your feelings about F2P in there. But it is totally irrelevant to the subject at hand.

Look, you have your opinion which is fine. But you seem to be thinking you speak for a multitude and you are not. Now that the AOE change has been implemented, for many that continue to play, it is not a problem. If you refuse to play because of the change it is your loss. I have an Assassin dps and a Shadow tank both at 50 and play has never been better IMO. Instead of waiting for a response that may or may not come, take the blinders off and play. You may find it is not ruined. However, if it is that black and white for you, c'est la vie. But don't presume you know what others think or find appealing about classes, nerfs, and or tuning. You don't.
You don't need statistics to know what the majority of the players want here. It pretty much is black and white. Sometimes it's simply painfully obvious. You can hide behind statistics if you like. I don't don't need them in this case. It is a majority of the players who hate these changes. That is a fact that needs no statistic.

Not trying to be a jerk here, just calling it like I see it. Usually I am a facts man myself, but only a facts driven blind folded individual would require "facts" on this one.
Republic: Krulex (Shadow) Kn (Guardian) Krll (Sentinel) Wanatrime (Vanguard)
Imperial: Wraiven (Assassin) Krullous (Marauder) Krawl (Jugg) Xin (Jugg)
♠♠♠ The Soulstalker Legacy ♠♠♠
-FIGHT-

NoFishing's Avatar


NoFishing
10.08.2012 , 02:47 PM | #67
Quote: Originally Posted by DashaAdair View Post
We are now in the zone for a mea culpa from someone in the company and I can see it going one of three ways:

1) Say nothing-not a good choice.

2) Blame the metrics-try to justify the decision based on what they measured. To me it suggests maybe they need to measure some other things e.g. playability, feel, consistency, stability. It also suggests the metrics may be the problem. Maybe they are measuring the wrong thing.

3) Take responsiblity for the problems in 1.4, outline what's in place to fix it, and put out what they intend to do to prevent these things from happening in the future.
It will be #1, and then IF they ever do say anything, it will be #2. At least that is the pattern established when the 1.2 healer nerfs went live. Even if healers (like me) could accept nerfs to healing output, pretty much no healers were pleased with the changes to their rotations and feel of the classes. Well, except scoundrels/operatives.

I don't intend to resurrect that debate here, just point out that player complaints about how their class plays as a result of changes have been generally ignored. That is too bad, because it is probably more than a coincidence that the population started to drop dramatically soon after 1.2 went live.

Thylbanus's Avatar


Thylbanus
10.08.2012 , 11:12 PM | #68
Quote: Originally Posted by Wraiven View Post
How can you not like a Cherry Red 1976 Trans-am?!?!?
Nah, Jet Black '72 'Cuda, baby FTW.
It's amazing how loud a dollar can be.
"Computer games don't affect kids; I mean if Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic music." - Kristin Wilson

Andryah's Avatar


Andryah
10.08.2012 , 11:19 PM | #69
Quote: Originally Posted by Qarran View Post
Look, you have your opinion which is fine. But you seem to be thinking you speak for a multitude and you are not. Now that the AOE change has been implemented, for many that continue to play, it is not a problem. If you refuse to play because of the change it is your loss.
I agree.

Wraiven, just because you don't like the changes and for whatever reason cannot adapt, does not make them bad changes. As changes go in MMOs, this set was pretty reasonable and only required minor adjustments to PvE playstyle to get past it and move on. The fact that Bioware did not revert them based on feedback from some players during PTS is irrelevant.... being as it was mostly complaining and demanding they revert it (which it was clear they were not going to do). PTS on the changes was to see the changes in action and make sure it was giving the intended results in changes to game play.

Adapt, move forward. It did not break PvE, it just required some adjustments to play, which is pretty much happens in all MMOs over time.
sayonara SWTOR. I will miss the game, I will miss many players, I will NOT miss being lied to and deceived. I will not miss rookie level mistakes of epic proportions.

Thylbanus's Avatar


Thylbanus
10.08.2012 , 11:21 PM | #70
OK, getting back to the subject at hand, when RWZ have groups of just one class there is a problem. That means that there is not balance. The ideal team would be one of each: Vanguard, Commando, Scoundrel, Gunslinger, Shadow, Sage, Guardian, and Sentinel or their Imperial counterparts. Should groups spec only in one class, that means that it is OPed. Watching a group of just one class type, skyrocket up the ranked charts is a clue. Perhaps a solution would be to have range/cooldown differences in PvP. I don't know, but if it works in a WZ, it should work in PvE.
It's amazing how loud a dollar can be.
"Computer games don't affect kids; I mean if Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic music." - Kristin Wilson