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I've gone through the first three pages - Queuing for WZ/FPs rationale?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Flashpoints, Operations, and Heroic Missions
I've gone through the first three pages - Queuing for WZ/FPs rationale?
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TUXs's Avatar


TUXs
10.03.2012 , 12:03 PM | #71
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
It injects more exception case cycles into the GF, just so an individual player is able to stack his queues. It encourages stacking of queues... which was not the intended play style.
Andryah, stacking the queue's allowed for multiple styles of gameplay (PvP while waiting for PvE). All the removal of this ability does is make it HARDER to fill the GF queue's. There's NO CHANCE it could be "abused" if it popped up AFTER a WZ. None. It would simply HELP those using the GF queue. They may have to wait a few minutes, but doesn't that beat not having a player queue up? I often queued for both because I wanted to do both, but I didn't want to waste my time. All this new change does is removes my tank from the GF pool...how on earth is this "good" for the game?!
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Lium's Avatar


Lium
10.03.2012 , 12:51 PM | #72
How exactly does suppressing the queue work? And would it inconvenience other group members who are ready to go?

iamthehoyden's Avatar


iamthehoyden
10.03.2012 , 01:07 PM | #73
Quote: Originally Posted by Lium View Post
How exactly does suppressing the queue work? And would it inconvenience other group members who are ready to go?
It would be hard to say exactly how it would work without access to BW's LFG mechanics, but I'm assuming they have some sort of numbering system. So someone who is DPS (I'll call him Dan) might queue up with 21 other DPS in front of him, for example. Dan's #22. If someone ahead of Dan drops out of queue, he moves up to #21. A queue pops and #1 and #2 in the DPS queue are put into a group. So now Dan is #19.

If Dan is queuing for wz's along with lfg then perhaps a wz pops at this point. If you pause Dan at #19 then he won't get a lfg pop during the wz. Instead the current #20, 21, 22, and so forth, will continue to move up the line, skipping Dan. When he gets out of the wz, he'll still be #19 but some of the people who were behind him will have moved in front of him in line.

Such a system shouldn't inconvenience other group members. If Dan were #2 in line, for example, and joins a wz, then he pauses at #2 and the people at #1 and #3 would be given the next group.
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anakedcowboy's Avatar


anakedcowboy
10.03.2012 , 01:07 PM | #74
Quote: Originally Posted by Lium View Post
How exactly does suppressing the queue work? And would it inconvenience other group members who are ready to go?
It would work similarly to how it works now. When the group finder has a tank, 2 DPS and a heals queued at the top of the list, it checks if they are in a warzone. If yes, i picks the person on the list below them for that slot and leaves that person at the top of the list. Ideally, it would let you know that you have been skipped by the GF so you don't requeue for PVP because you are at the top of the list.

It's like how when you get matched and someone declines, the 3 who didn't decline are left at the top of the list for the next attempted match.

I would love to hear arguments about who this hurts or doesn't benefit, or how to tweak it, because I think this is a far better solution than hurting both FP and PVP queues, while using existing mechanics and not creating too much extra work.

Lium's Avatar


Lium
10.03.2012 , 01:16 PM | #75
Quote: Originally Posted by iamthehoyden View Post
It would be hard to say exactly how it would work without access to BW's LFG mechanics, but I'm assuming they have some sort of numbering system. So someone who is DPS (I'll call him Dan) might queue up with 21 other DPS in front of him, for example. Dan's #22. If someone ahead of Dan drops out of queue, he moves up to #21. A queue pops and #1 and #2 in the DPS queue are put into a group. So now Dan is #19.

If Dan is queuing for wz's along with lfg then perhaps a wz pops at this point. If you pause Dan at #19 then he won't get a lfg pop during the wz. Instead the current #20, 21, 22, and so forth, will continue to move up the line, skipping Dan. When he gets out of the wz, he'll still be #19 but some of the people who were behind him will have moved in front of him in line.

Such a system shouldn't inconvenience other group members. If Dan were #2 in line, for example, and joins a wz, then he pauses at #2 and the people at #1 and #3 would be given the next group.
Oh, okay. That could work. I was thinking you guys meant the entire group would be held up until whoever was in the WZ was done and ready.

But, yeah, we'd need to know how BW's LFG tool is set up. This might not be as easy as it sound to implement.

iamthehoyden's Avatar


iamthehoyden
10.03.2012 , 01:23 PM | #76
Quote: Originally Posted by Lium View Post
Oh, okay. That could work. I was thinking you guys meant the entire group would be held up until whoever was in the WZ was done and ready.

But, yeah, we'd need to know how BW's LFG tool is set up. This might not be as easy as it sound to implement.
My suspicions are that the queue stacking was disabled because it was easy, while this type of solution would take more time to code and debug. However, if they decided to do this kind of coding, it would be to their advantage to not only suppress lfg pops during wzs but also allow players to pause the queue for a few minutes which would alieviate the coming back from a bio break and seeing that the queue has popped and you have to start all over.
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LarryRow's Avatar


LarryRow
10.03.2012 , 01:23 PM | #77
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
How does Rob, the Senior PvP Designer, not realize/understand the counter effect this change has?!

Rather than queuing up for their dailies and waiting for the queue to pop while doing WZ's, now people are just skipping the WZs. This harms the very thing he's directly involved in designing...PvP.

The BETTER solution would have been to suppress the GF pop-up until AFTER a WZ. 13min max.
TUX, you and I are in complete agreement for once. Such an obvious solution, and the tech is already in place with the ranked/unranked queue. I'm simply dumbfounded.

It's no biggie on my tank, but on my marauder I have serious idle time waiting for that lfg queue.
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scullzomben's Avatar


scullzomben
10.03.2012 , 01:28 PM | #78
It really only makes it harder for DPS players to get groups, which isn't a major problem at all.

The less DPS in a FP queue, the better IMO.

LarryRow's Avatar


LarryRow
10.03.2012 , 01:35 PM | #79
Quote: Originally Posted by iamthehoyden View Post
If Dan is queuing for wz's along with lfg then perhaps a wz pops at this point. If you pause Dan at #19 then he won't get a lfg pop during the wz. Instead the current #20, 21, 22, and so forth, will continue to move up the line, skipping Dan. When he gets out of the wz, he'll still be #19 but some of the people who were behind him will have moved in front of him in line.
Well this is a little more sophisticated than the "hold the queue til the warzone ends" concept, and I think I like it.

One tweak: Dan should move up in the queue if he is in a warzone and a queue pops for someone else. Otherwise, it still gives incentive to not join warzones and sit idle.

Once Dan gets to #2, if he is still in his warzone and the queue pops, #1 and #3 should get the invite. When Dan gets out of his warzone, he should get a message on his PvP interface that he is next in line in the LFG.
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SithEater's Avatar


SithEater
10.03.2012 , 01:39 PM | #80
Quote: Originally Posted by iamthehoyden View Post
It would be hard to say exactly how it would work without access to BW's LFG mechanics, but I'm assuming they have some sort of numbering system. So someone who is DPS (I'll call him Dan) might queue up with 21 other DPS in front of him, for example. Dan's #22. If someone ahead of Dan drops out of queue, he moves up to #21. A queue pops and #1 and #2 in the DPS queue are put into a group. So now Dan is #19.

If Dan is queuing for wz's along with lfg then perhaps a wz pops at this point. If you pause Dan at #19 then he won't get a lfg pop during the wz. Instead the current #20, 21, 22, and so forth, will continue to move up the line, skipping Dan. When he gets out of the wz, he'll still be #19 but some of the people who were behind him will have moved in front of him in line.

Such a system shouldn't inconvenience other group members. If Dan were #2 in line, for example, and joins a wz, then he pauses at #2 and the people at #1 and #3 would be given the next group.
Under this solution you'd still take forever to get a FP Q to pop cause PVP pops are dime a dozen and you'd have a cloud of perpetually stuck people in the limbo in-between the two. Dan is #19 and gets out of his PVP Q and gets another 30 seconds later, so he has a whole 30 seconds for the PVE Q to pop before he's back in limbo again.

How is this in anyway a workable solution? How much of the games resources are going to be tied up keep track of the massive cloud of people in the Q but not really because the are in a PVP match at the same time? Yes eventually they would get lucky and get a pop inbetween the two but in the meantime the only reliable way to get in a PVE grp is too...not Q up for another WZ...just like they are asking you to do now.
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