on my jug (i post on here because there seems to be more vig guards than veng jugs on the forums) i seem to be bosting the exact same numbers in a 3 minute parse as rage spec in comparision to my vengeance spec. So with rage being perfectly viable in pve and an absolute monster and fotm in pvp, i cant see any reason to spec as vengeance. Is this the death of this spec or what?

Pretty much also vigilance received a slight nerf Edited September 26, 2012 by denpic

In short, yes. I actually made a thread about it. It's actually worse than we thought honestly. I have no idea why but they nerfed Viglance/Vengeance as well. Pooled Hatred is now only 4% per stack. That was one of the many changes that went through but weren't listed in the PTS patch updates. I have no idea why the would have made that change. Vigilance was viable in PvP but by no means overpowered. If it needed any changes it needed buffs not nerfs. But yeah, the buffed Focus through the roof and it's too good to pass up.

Vig died a long time ago. Sure it was decent, and there were a few people who could make it work reasonably well, but it never offered anything that was worth going all the way to the top for. And then the devs do the farthest possible opposite of what is needed and actually nerf the spec Between that and the focus buffs, it really is over for Vig. It was already dead, now its just buried and forgotten as well. Which is really sad, I don't want to play the FOTM Focus, but I didn't roll a guardian to tank, so its either Focus or shelving the Guardian

I would really

Like a response from bioware as to the reasoning for these changes

Especially the nerf to vigliance

its not even the nerf that pissed me off. I mean it pisses me off, cuz its like we needed a buff a hell of a lot more than focus did. Its like for pvp, focus is king. for pve, vig was king. Now its like vig is simply NOT viable for pvp, i mean ya you can be good with it, but that doesnt change the fact that its the worst pvp spec out there now. And its like with focus being equal to vig for pve, whats the point of even going vig other than if you want to tank in pvp, cuz all tanks in pvp are hybrids, not full tanks. I'm just REALLY pissed off cuz i got a full BH augmented vengeance juggernaut for pve and i feel like i completely wasted hours upon hours on building up a spec that wasn't worth it. The best i've done is 1550 over a three minute parse, and there's no way in hell thats good when i'm seeing ppl on the dps project putting up 1900 plus... Edited September 26, 2012 by TwistedTony

I would really

Like a response from bioware as to the reasoning for these changes

Especially the nerf to vigliance

 

Well consdiering for pvp focus is the "go to" spec the vigi change won't really make a difference.Asto a response from bioware good luck with that.......

Vigilance is dead. Match this if you want to argue with me -_-

 

http://www.torparse.com/a/24611/time/1348758167/1348758469

Just out of curiosity, if I choose to reset my skill tree, go for a Vigilance build and not include Gather Strength, what other skill can I put the points in to somewhat compensate for the GOD FORSAKEN NERF?

 

*Repost, might get a response here*

Just out of curiosity, if I choose to reset my skill tree, go for a Vigilance build and not include Gather Strength, what other skill can I put the points in to somewhat compensate for the GOD FORSAKEN NERF?

 

*Repost, might get a response here*

 

I'm going to run this, probably: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#500MMZfMrRMhddGRZMM.2

 

Kinda universal; Defiance is unnecessary if you only plan to do PvE; Victory Rush is redundant for PvP (not crucial in PvE either but I like not having to worry about Focus generation ever). You can sacrifice some of the burns for added Accuracy but I find that Guardian gear has enough Accuracy on it.

Just out of curiosity, if I choose to reset my skill tree, go for a Vigilance build and not include Gather Strength, what other skill can I put the points in to somewhat compensate for the GOD FORSAKEN NERF?

 

*Repost, might get a response here*

 

Wow, I just noticed what everyone was calling a nerf. I don't use that skill anyway since it's mostly worthless I had it in my build for a week and feel it's 2 points better spent elsewhere.

 

My build: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#500MZfGMRMuddGRZMM.2

 

It works for me, and a saber throw/leap/masterstrike will take most people down to 50-60% health off the bat. The rest is just working your rotation for the dispatch. Having the free blade storm makes the initial burst even more lethal since I don't need to use any of the weaker focus building attacks as quickly.

Wow, I just noticed what everyone was calling a nerf. I don't use that skill anyway since it's mostly worthless I had it in my build for a week and feel it's 2 points better spent elsewhere.

 

My build: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#500MZfGMRMuddGRZMM.2

 

It works for me, and a saber throw/leap/masterstrike will take most people down to 50-60% health off the bat. The rest is just working your rotation for the dispatch. Having the free blade storm makes the initial burst even more lethal since I don't need to use any of the weaker focus building attacks as quickly.

 

Is there any reason you put a point into Narrowed Focus? I think it has a strong claim to be the Single Most Useless Talent in SWTOR.

To add to my above post depending on my final accuracy with the augmented war hero gear if possible I'd drop the accuracy skill and take second wind for all 2 points. Having two self heals no matter how small is really nice.

Is there any reason you put a point into Narrowed Focus? I think it has a strong claim to be the Single Most Useless Talent in SWTOR.

 

Because in PVP AOE damage is always around. If you PVE only I can understand not using it. With PVP just by playing like I normally would I'm building focus and not having to use a weaker attack to do so. 1 point is worth that.

I'm going to run this, probably: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#500MMZfMrRMhddGRZMM.2

 

Kinda universal; Defiance is unnecessary if you only plan to do PvE; Victory Rush is redundant for PvP (not crucial in PvE either but I like not having to worry about Focus generation ever). You can sacrifice some of the burns for added Accuracy but I find that Guardian gear has enough Accuracy on it.

 

Thank you! I was leaning towards a similar build myself without Gather Strength. I like my Vigilance Guardian a lot and really don't feel like going Focus.

Because in PVP AOE damage is always around. If you PVE only I can understand not using it. With PVP just by playing like I normally would I'm building focus and not having to use a weaker attack to do so. 1 point is worth that.

 

But it's so counter-intuitive for me; I prefer to avoid AoE damage and the likes of Death from Above, Force Storm, Orbital Strike are all avoidable rather easily. Defiance looks a much better bet to me because you will be stunned, slept or knocked down an awful amount. And even with only 1 point in it it generates 2 Focus, not just one.

But it's so counter-intuitive for me; I prefer to avoid AoE damage and the likes of Death from Above, Force Storm, Orbital Strike are all avoidable rather easily. Defiance looks a much better bet to me because you will be stunned, slept or knocked down an awful amount. And even with only 1 point in it it generates 2 Focus, not just one.

 

As much as you try to avoid it all, you never can. I consider it bonus focus. The CC based one is less effective considering I'm usually not in a position to take advantage of it because I'm CC'd. After end of the CC if the person is smart enough they aren't in my range anyway and I will have to leap or saber throw generating the focus I'd have otherwise. Compare this to AOE damage near a door in voidstar where typically I'm not controlled and it is available for immediate use.

 

Just thought of another one, you are trying to cap denova and get caught in the sorc epic spam of force storm (you can tell the people that aren't good at their profession when they spam this constantly) and now you have the focus you need if you aren't able to jump at the enemy due to the tight spaces.

Edited September 27, 2012 by Tim-ONeil

Defiance is awesome for focused defense as is narrowed defense. You can pop it any time you are stunned w defiance, narrowed defense can keep you fed for it.

Narrowed Focus would be better served as an AOE damage reduction while in Shien. The fact that we can't get an AOE reduction for any reason is one of the more massive things holding vig back. Besides the part where it has better tank talents than the tank tree.

Got 550k damage in a 8 minute VS last night as vigilance. Next highest DPS under me was a 350k smash marauder.

 

Spec: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#500MMZfRrRMhddGkZMM.2

 

Been getting top DPS still in other games, but not with that big of a gap between DPS.

 

Vigilance can still work in PVP, it just takes more work to yield high-end results. However, it's harder to shut down due to unremitting.

Got 550k damage in a 8 minute VS last night as vigilance. Next highest DPS under me was a 350k smash marauder.

 

Spec: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#500MMZfRrRMhddGkZMM.2

 

Been getting top DPS still in other games, but not with that big of a gap between DPS.

 

Vigilance can still work in PVP, it just takes more work to yield high-end results. However, it's harder to shut down due to unremitting.

 

This is very close to my own spec. I think that people take for granted the absolute necessity of building 4-5 stacks of sunder as soon as possible. That's direct armor mitigation and it's absolutely necessary. The nerf to gather strength I didn't even notice, since I've rarely seen the ability really flourish anyway. The reason I'm still Vigilance is because I don't like being a glass cannon; If I switch to Soresu, most of my damage abilities still work the same, just not as quickly, and I can get quite a bit of utility out of Focused Defense.

This is very close to my own spec. I think that people take for granted the absolute necessity of building 4-5 stacks of sunder as soon as possible. That's direct armor mitigation and it's absolutely necessary. The nerf to gather strength I didn't even notice, since I've rarely seen the ability really flourish anyway. The reason I'm still Vigilance is because I don't like being a glass cannon; If I switch to Soresu, most of my damage abilities still work the same, just not as quickly, and I can get quite a bit of utility out of Focused Defense.

 

The extra DR that commanding awe gives is extremely significant. With it, it lowers the damage intake which in turn makes the heals more efficient. 1v1, especially against DOT based classes, this can make FD extremely efficient at mitigating damage. In such situations, FD is actually better than rebuke. However, in 1vN situations, it becomes slightly inferior during the duration, and definitely overall considering cost and duration.

 

Like rebuke, you can stack FD and saber ward together to almost guarantee 1v1 fights.

Edited October 3, 2012 by Andrew_Past