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Reverse Engineering Other People's Crafted Black Hole Mods for schematics

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Crew Skills
Reverse Engineering Other People's Crafted Black Hole Mods for schematics
First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

Tyrdville's Avatar


Tyrdville
10.18.2012 , 03:44 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by AllisonBerryman View Post
We've seen players ask about this before, and have some clarification for you from Jason Attard (Senior Game Balance Designer):

This behavior was unintended, but we do not consider it an exploit. We do intend to make reverse engineering more consistent in the future, and that may be by not allowing this or by allowing players to reverse engineer this type of mod by design. We do not consider this a violation of the rules.
you may say it wasnt intended but not a exploit, but surely it can be easily fixed? when TFB HM came out my guild ran it on the day, i Re'd the mod from my gear and was lucky enough to learn it, i post them on gtn, 24 hours later 17 different people knew the same schemetic undercutting each person, as someone said earlier, we do the big risk to re a BIS n others take the easy way out *** is up with that, im proud i have 3/4 dead guard peices that drop from tfb hm and then i see people with custom gear who have never stepped foot in tfb busting out the same gear, what is the point, if someone can gear themselves up within 1 week is there any reason to even raid and as a crafter, which im sure all others would agree, who risk their own gear to learn a schemetic, making any sort of feesible profit is ridiculous, a 63 mod then started at 2mill now struggles to sell at 1mill just a few weeks later. this needs to be fixed, simple as. if you can remove a rock from EC to stop people taking a shortcut cause its not how the game is meant to be played, then take the shortcut out in gearing up aswell

WanaRideMyPwny's Avatar


WanaRideMyPwny
10.18.2012 , 03:54 PM | #12
I don't want to beat a dead horse with this but clearly every person that has commented agrees that this needs to be addressed. Gearing is way too fast. It takes away from the experience of learning a BiS schematic and generally just degrades the game experience. It is unfortunately one of those things that does make me want to leave, and I have been in since day one. I really hope they do the right thing here and fix this exploit. It gives people way too much access to gear that they didn't have to do anything to get.
Forgotten Hope
Gibbler - Defense Guardian | Why - Seer Sage | Shootey - Assault Vanguard | Mayke - Sawbones Scoundrel

OSUKirkland's Avatar


OSUKirkland
10.18.2012 , 04:23 PM | #13
Grats to everyone who has been doing this for months, building up a massive credit advantage while the rest of us either didn't know, or sat on the information wondering if it was an exploit.

dinwitt's Avatar


dinwitt
10.18.2012 , 04:53 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by WanaRideMyPwny View Post
I don't want to beat a dead horse with this but clearly every person that has commented agrees that this needs to be addressed. Gearing is way too fast. It takes away from the experience of learning a BiS schematic and generally just degrades the game experience. It is unfortunately one of those things that does make me want to leave, and I have been in since day one. I really hope they do the right thing here and fix this exploit. It gives people way too much access to gear that they didn't have to do anything to get.
The people who are dissatisfied with the current system are the most likely to comment when they are told that they are wrong. The fact is that end game crafting would have been a joke without this. A 20% chance on a once a week drop to learn the armoring schematic? A drop that isn't even guaranteed any more, since 1.4? No thanks. I learned the Advanced Skill Armoring 26 on my 15th attempt. That would have been almost 4 months of raiding HM EC, if the skill dropped every time and was fed to the crafters every time, to learn just that one schematic. But the truth is that during approximately that amount of time raiding, we only saw a couple skill armorings drop. So I still wouldn't have the schematic despite, as another poster put it, putting in the effort and taking the big risk. And I'd probably still be raiding in rakata armorings, with a full campaign set rotting in my bank, becuase they gave snipers patron armorings in almost every slot..

And for those that think us people learning from crafted items have it easy, think again. It took me seven tries to learn the Advanced Artful Mod 27. The only one that could craft was refusing to do so directly, and I had to buy all seven on the GTN. For 2.5 million credits each. Of course I crashed his market 45 minutes after learning the schematic (mostly to protest his ridiculous crafting policies), but it still drove me nearly broke and made him, the one that learned it from a piece of dread guard, filthy rich.

Finally, this idea that its wrong to gear up easily is ridiculous. Content grows stale after 6 months of repeating it weekly regardless of how fast it gives you gear, and making it take 6 months to get your gear from it is just frustrating. Raiding dies when guilds can't easily bring in new members, and being able to craft top end, or near top end, gear is a great way to keep fresh blood in the potential raiding pool. Gear will not teach you how to play your class, grant you raid awareness, or give insight into boss mechanics. Over gearing isn't possible for progression raiding. Easy to obtain raid gear will only allow you a fair chance at the fight, and denying that to others so you can be in your special club is short sighted.

P.S. You should get on the test server and start raising a stink, cause people are able to buy best in slot campaign armorings, set bonus and all, for a few dozen Black Hole comms. Talk about gearing up fast, at least buying rank 26 armorings off the GTN is expensive compared to what will happen in 1.5.

Quote: Originally Posted by OSUKirkland View Post
Grats to everyone who has been doing this for months, building up a massive credit advantage while the rest of us either didn't know, or sat on the information wondering if it was an exploit.
Its unfortunate to hear that the people on your server were like this. I know I've been telling everyone that has asked about my methods, as well as fleet chat a few times. People have also posted it in a few crafting threads, but it has been rather buried until now.

WanaRideMyPwny's Avatar


WanaRideMyPwny
10.18.2012 , 05:21 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by dinwitt View Post
P.S. You should get on the test server and start raising a stink, cause people are able to buy best in slot campaign armorings, set bonus and all, for a few dozen Black Hole comms. Talk about gearing up fast, at least buying rank 26 armorings off the GTN is expensive compared to what will happen in 1.5.
.
26's are not best in slot. What you are doing is taking away from the core experience of mmo's and top end content clearing. Giving away gear to everyone is a mistake on Bioware's part and you contributing to it is a mistake on yours. Not having to clear top tier content to get the gear from there is garbage and anyone with sense can see that. The point of games like these isn't to see who can buy the best in slot gear, it's to see who can earn through their ability to play the game and beat the bosses that give them.
Forgotten Hope
Gibbler - Defense Guardian | Why - Seer Sage | Shootey - Assault Vanguard | Mayke - Sawbones Scoundrel

KorrigTS's Avatar


KorrigTS
10.18.2012 , 05:53 PM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by dinwitt View Post
Finally, this idea that its wrong to gear up easily is ridiculous. Content grows stale after 6 months of repeating it weekly regardless of how fast it gives you gear, and making it take 6 months to get your gear from it is just frustrating. Raiding dies when guilds can't easily bring in new members, and being able to craft top end, or near top end, gear is a great way to keep fresh blood in the potential raiding pool. Gear will not teach you how to play your class, grant you raid awareness, or give insight into boss mechanics. Over gearing isn't possible for progression raiding. Easy to obtain raid gear will only allow you a fair chance at the fight, and denying that to others so you can be in your special club is short sighted.
It shouldn't be this easy to be full BiS (Easy in this example means 3 weeks after a brand new tier of gear is released).

I also don't follow how you imply others are denied a chance at a fair fight. Not giving in to the instant gratification crowd isn't excluding players. You do know the encounters are all tweaked to be doable in the previous tier of gear, right? People on the PTS were downing HM TFB encounters in a mix of campaign and rakata.

The issue isn't with allowing players to gear up quickly enough to participate in raids. It's when players can obtain the best gear available for little to no effort, especially when that's made possible by the players that do put in a lot of effort.
< D I A B O L I C > - The Bastion
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WanaRideMyPwny's Avatar


WanaRideMyPwny
10.18.2012 , 05:59 PM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by KorrigTS View Post
It shouldn't be this easy to be full BiS (Easy in this example means 3 weeks after a brand new tier of gear is released).

I also don't follow how you imply others are denied a chance at a fair fight. Not giving in to the instant gratification crowd isn't excluding players. You do know the encounters are all tweaked to be doable in the previous tier of gear, right? People on the PTS were downing HM TFB encounters in a mix of campaign and rakata.

The issue isn't with allowing players to gear up quickly enough to participate in raids. It's when players can obtain the best gear available for little to no effort, especially when that's made possible by the players that do put in a lot of effort.
Amen.
Forgotten Hope
Gibbler - Defense Guardian | Why - Seer Sage | Shootey - Assault Vanguard | Mayke - Sawbones Scoundrel

Ansalem's Avatar


Ansalem
10.18.2012 , 08:42 PM | #18
so nice of bioware to respond to this a month late after the game economy has been destroyed and everyone was fully equipped in best in slot mods within the first week of the patch. GG bioware. Not deeming it an exploit because so many of your limited player base abused it eh? Too afraid to whip out that ban hammer on folks who cheat? And you wonder why people dont want to play anymore....pretty shameful bioware pretty darned shameful.

Alec_Fortescue's Avatar


Alec_Fortescue
10.19.2012 , 12:25 AM | #19
Unintended? Come on, guys, in a ticket which I received last month you stated it is designed and meant to work like this... Bioware you are starting to confuse!
Si vis pacem, para bellum

Traditional Jedi robes please! And then I am gone from general discussion. Promise! :]
Devs, it can't get any more iconic and traditional than this: http://i.imgur.com/9ha8ELu.jpg http://i.imgur.com/2NoBT6o.jpg

Spends 2000 euro on a gaming rig exclusively for TOR to be riddled by graphical issues in TOR. Loving it.

Alec_Fortescue's Avatar


Alec_Fortescue
10.19.2012 , 12:32 AM | #20
And, last month, when I was typing about schematic stealing and ppl going bis too fast because of morons that were giving away g26 (and now 27) for free I was flamed, called elitist and other crap... There even were arguments that the sods who stole my schematic didn't steal it because they had to buy the overpriced (lololololo, charging 50%-25% of the crafting price is overcharging? You people are just scabby) item first...

To everyone that steals schematics to flood the servers: screw you. You are the one contributing to unsubbing and demise of your game, because you leave players with no further work.
Si vis pacem, para bellum

Traditional Jedi robes please! And then I am gone from general discussion. Promise! :]
Devs, it can't get any more iconic and traditional than this: http://i.imgur.com/9ha8ELu.jpg http://i.imgur.com/2NoBT6o.jpg

Spends 2000 euro on a gaming rig exclusively for TOR to be riddled by graphical issues in TOR. Loving it.