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Will anything actually retain customers?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Will anything actually retain customers?

Styxx's Avatar


Styxx
09.09.2012 , 04:25 PM | #161
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
I agree.

The small number of "loyal hardcore" raiders in the MMO community over rate themselves IMO. Particularly in the context of an MMO that was clearly made to cater to a broader more casual player base that loves SW IP.
Oh yes. But they are gamers, first and foremost, so you must make a game . And a pop-up picture MMO ala Heavy Rain won`t cut it. So you have to follow the "classic" route. And "raid or die" games are not precisely good for casual players, which, I think, was the first mistake.

The world is coming to an end.. I agreed with you ...
Quote: Originally Posted by John Riccitiello View Post
When you are six hours into playing Battlefield and you run out of ammo in your clip, and we ask you for a dollar to reload, you're really not very price sensitive at that point in time...We're not gouging, but we're charging.

Hessen's Avatar


Hessen
09.09.2012 , 04:44 PM | #162
Quote: Originally Posted by Metalmac View Post
All very true.
I would add that the Dailies are the same on 3 other Alts for me so after the second round with my Alt I am already on Ilum or Belsavis and bored out of my mind tired of the same ol same ol.

BioWare wants me to do Dailies with 4 Characters on 3 planets every day including Hard Mode Flash Points.
I can do this in 10 hours and by the third Alt I am sick of playing, but push through till done.

Also I see less and less people playing the game, numbers are going down and this game is dying.
Wait, you're playing the game 10 hours a day and are wondering why the content is repetitive?
Twisted
EU - Tomb of Freedon Nadd
16m Raiding Guild - Recruiting

Scritchy's Avatar


Scritchy
09.09.2012 , 04:56 PM | #163
Quote: Originally Posted by Hessen View Post
Wait, you're playing the game 10 hours a day and are wondering why the content is repetitive?
We haven't had a content update in what, 5 months? A one-eyed, one-armed, drunken monkey could be playing the game a couple hours every weekend and figure out it is repetitive.

Moaky's Avatar


Moaky
09.09.2012 , 06:10 PM | #164
Quote: Originally Posted by Scritchy View Post
We haven't had a content update in what, 5 months? A one-eyed, one-armed, drunken monkey could be playing the game a couple hours every weekend and figure out it is repetitive.
I thought the one eyed and one armed thingy was a flying purple people eater?

LordArtemis's Avatar


LordArtemis
09.09.2012 , 06:26 PM | #165
Quote: Originally Posted by Styxx View Post
Oh yes. But they are gamers, first and foremost, so you must make a game . And a pop-up picture MMO ala Heavy Rain won`t cut it. So you have to follow the "classic" route. And "raid or die" games are not precisely good for casual players, which, I think, was the first mistake.

The world is coming to an end.. I agreed with you ...
I had a way to take care of hardcore gamers. The Tomb of Lords. I talked about it in Beta.

The idea is to have a heroic instance that changes almost every time you enter it. First, just to get there you have to hijack an enemy ship. This takes an entire group, and each member has to do something different on the ship. Unfortunately no matter what you do you will die. The idea is to last as long as you can.

When you respawn your prisoners on board the enemy ship you tried to hijack. You break out, you have to liberate your gear (fight unarmed and ungeared, grabbing things to use along the way), and once you have your original gear you then have 4 tasks to escape. You have to split up because all 4 have to be done at the same time for it to work. One group takes the bridge, next assaults security to lower the force fields, next group takes the shuttle bay, last group targets the engine room.

When all four targets are down, all players rush to the shuttle bay. The ship is crashing, you have 5 minutes to make it to the bay, get on the ship, and escape before it crashes.

But the shuttle is damaged, so you crash land and have to fight your way on foot. That means fighting against and avoiding large groups of troops, mechanized vehicles, etc.

You finally reach the tomb. When you go inside, each section has 4 different areas, 8 sections. Every time you get one area, one section, and the mobs change. Sometimes you fight a single high level mob, other times you fight trash or groups of high level mobs. Sometimes its as simple as a jumping and moving puzzle with traps.

Three scenarios for combat if that is what you draw....survive until help arrives, seek and destroy and negotiate to survive.

This way this heroic would change to a new run almost every time you ran it. The mobs would change, scenarios change, etc. This is how end game should have been done.

I also had similar heroic runs for the Jedi Council and Sith Order.

Scritchy's Avatar


Scritchy
09.09.2012 , 06:29 PM | #166
Quote: Originally Posted by LordArtemis View Post
I had a way to take care of hardcore gamers. The Tomb of Lords. I talked about it in Beta.

The idea is to have a heroic instance that changes almost every time you enter it. First, just to get there you have to hijack an enemy ship. This takes an entire group, and each member has to do something different on the ship.
What you just described in your post is more content than we have at 50, even with the updates since launch.

krystianswtor's Avatar


krystianswtor
09.09.2012 , 06:31 PM | #167
Quote: Originally Posted by LordArtemis View Post
I had a way to take care of hardcore gamers. The Tomb of Lords. I talked about it in Beta.

The idea is to have a heroic instance that changes almost every time you enter it. First, just to get there you have to hijack an enemy ship. This takes an entire group, and each member has to do something different on the ship. Unfortunately no matter what you do you will die. The idea is to last as long as you can.

When you respawn your prisoners on board the enemy ship you tried to hijack. You break out, you have to liberate your gear (fight unarmed and ungeared, grabbing things to use along the way), and once you have your original gear you then have 4 tasks to escape. You have to split up because all 4 have to be done at the same time for it to work. One group takes the bridge, next assaults security to lower the force fields, next group takes the shuttle bay, last group targets the engine room.

When all four targets are down, all players rush to the shuttle bay. The ship is crashing, you have 5 minutes to make it to the bay, get on the ship, and escape before it crashes.

But the shuttle is damaged, so you crash land and have to fight your way on foot. That means fighting against and avoiding large groups of troops, mechanized vehicles, etc.

You finally reach the tomb. When you go inside, each section has 4 different areas, 8 sections. Every time you get one area, one section, and the mobs change. Sometimes you fight a single high level mob, other times you fight trash or groups of high level mobs. Sometimes its as simple as a jumping and moving puzzle with traps.

Three scenarios for combat if that is what you draw....survive until help arrives, seek and destroy and negotiate to survive.

This way this heroic would change to a new run almost every time you ran it. The mobs would change, scenarios change, etc. This is how end game should have been done.

I also had similar heroic runs for the Jedi Council and Sith Order.
yeah its how it should have been done , too bad it isnt and probably wont

LordArtemis's Avatar


LordArtemis
09.09.2012 , 06:32 PM | #168
Quote: Originally Posted by Scritchy View Post
What you just described in your post is more content than we have at 50, even with the updates since launch.
The idea was that this one heroic for end game would provide replayable content for a LONG time. Since there are so many ways to do it, and it changes so much as you run it it would take quite a while for you to get bored with it.

It also gets away from the "kill one boss" mentality...although some scenarios give you this as your test, most are multiple mob battles, some that you will not win on your own. In some of them its all trash, but a ridiculous amount of trash for pure carnage.

Scritchy's Avatar


Scritchy
09.09.2012 , 06:36 PM | #169
Quote: Originally Posted by LordArtemis View Post
The idea was that this one heroic for end game would provide replayable content for a LONG time. Since there are so many ways to do it, and it changes so much as you run it it would take quite a while for you to get bored with it.
Oh, I understand and think it would be awesome (which is why I like the exploration modes in the GW2 dungeons, there are 4 or 5 different layouts for each one), but the ineptness of the current management and dev teams could never figure it out, which is why the game is in the situation it is in.
Quote: Originally Posted by LordArtemis View Post
It also gets away from the "kill one boss" mentality...although some scenarios give you this as your test, most are multiple mob battles, some that you will not win on your own. In some of them its all trash, but a ridiculous amount of trash for pure carnage.
I don't know, I kind of liked that about EQ2 when it first launched. There were like 10 different raids, but each was a small zone with some trash and then a boss (each with unique abilities so it wasn't repetitive). That way between raids you could swap out folks that had to leave for ones that just showed up. It was a great way to get everybody involved and we were able to schedule the raids around life instead of the other way around.

LordArtemis's Avatar


LordArtemis
09.09.2012 , 07:05 PM | #170
Quote: Originally Posted by Scritchy View Post
Oh, I understand and think it would be awesome (which is why I like the exploration modes in the GW2 dungeons, there are 4 or 5 different layouts for each one), but the ineptness of the current management and dev teams could never figure it out, which is why the game is in the situation it is in.

I don't know, I kind of liked that about EQ2 when it first launched. There were like 10 different raids, but each was a small zone with some trash and then a boss (each with unique abilities so it wasn't repetitive). That way between raids you could swap out folks that had to leave for ones that just showed up. It was a great way to get everybody involved and we were able to schedule the raids around life instead of the other way around.
I would say that on some occasions it is good to know what to expect...and one could say that is what flashpoints and heroics as you level are for, especially if they have nightmare modes that scale to your level.

But I really feel that end game raids should NOT be practiced runs, instead challenging you each and every time you run it. You have dailies if you want more casual content, but the end game heroics (I would call them Epics) would be so random it would be next to impossible to be ready for any scenario. You would have to think on your feet and work with it as you went...you would repeat scenarios by chance, but that would not be common for quite some time.

it is just a way to provide fresh content from the same raid for hardcore players...makes it truly repeatable and engaging to keep players busy for quite a while.