Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

Developer Update: Class Changes and Balance in Game Update 1.4

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Developer Update: Class Changes and Balance in Game Update 1.4
First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

oredith's Avatar


oredith
09.05.2012 , 03:38 PM | #481
Quote: Originally Posted by Rogaldr View Post
Hmm Overload and Force Wave have been redesigned gr8 but why the same ability for Comando merc ist redesigned ? Thats balance.
merc can't get away after a knockback.

if you wanna make everyone the same, then yeah, go ahead and change merc KB to cone, and then give them a sprint on a 20s cooldown. I'd happily take that.
(╯□)╯┻━┻
flipp'n yo desk, like a bauss
Tankie

DroidDreamer's Avatar


DroidDreamer
09.05.2012 , 03:46 PM | #482
Quote: Originally Posted by Sundragon View Post
The problem isn't that someone got lots of resolve fast and thus unstoppable, the problem is that we are getting stunned left and right and can't move. All you've done is insure that we will continue to be stunned as long as possible under a coordinated attack, even if the attack isn't coordinated.

So let me make it a bit clearer.

Pre 1.4 Scenario 1: Coordinated team stun locks you for 8 seconds and you die.
Pre 1.4 Scenario 2: Uncoordinated team can only stun lock you for 4 seconds because they stacked your resolve and gives you a slim chance to do something to survive.
Pre 1.4 Average stun-lock = 6 seconds (assuming 50% likelihood of each scenario)

Post 1.4 Scenario 1: Coordinated team stun locks you for 8 seconds and you die.
Post 1.4 Scenario 2: Uncoordinated team can now stun lock you for 8 seconds because your resolve isn't filling up as fast, and you die.
Post 1.4 Average stun-lock = 8 seconds

As you can see with this remarkably simple analysis/math, the players are going to be stunned MORE ON AVERAGE after the patch, although the MAXIMUM REMAINS UNCHANGED.
Yep. More stuns.
The DroidDreamer Legacy (Pot5 Server)
Eblen 50 Sorc heals | Sodan 50 Sniper | Trilliant 37 Immortal Jugg | Somnis 50 TankSin
They mark me with the lightning bolt in Huttball.

Sundragon's Avatar


Sundragon
09.05.2012 , 03:47 PM | #483
Quote: Originally Posted by oredith View Post
merc can't get away after a knockback.

if you wanna make everyone the same, then yeah, go ahead and change merc KB to cone, and then give them a sprint on a 20s cooldown. I'd happily take that.
Hey, you there in the heavy armor! Yeah, you! You are wearing heavy armor. Maybe you didn't notice.
█||||()||||█Ξ███████████████████)

Caerna's Avatar


Caerna
09.05.2012 , 03:47 PM | #484
Well I read this over two or three times, I am truly happy with the changes. I'll have to see how they effect PVE, but I do like the changes to the stuns and even the resolve system fix where chain stunning causes the bar to fill up, that was a pain when everyone was stunning... So overall this becomes more friendly for PVP and I quite like that as there's still some things in PVP I still feel need addressed.

I think any of the break stun abilities need to have a better cool-down in particular, even as a Tank in PVE or PVP getting stunned and staying stunned is entirely possible and the cool-down on the break-out ability sort of hinders that. At least that would fix some of the issue with the ridiculously long stuns in PVP and help PVE at the same time.

Beyond that, I really don't have any complaints, I'll just have to see how it is when it comes to the server.

Edit - Maybe also including a 3-4 second period where you can't be stunned again after use of the ability?

awesomepossam's Avatar


awesomepossam
09.05.2012 , 03:58 PM | #485
I can see nerfing the sorcerer every update but for fairness when are we going to be able to get better armor to protect ourselves.

LordArtemis's Avatar


LordArtemis
09.05.2012 , 04:01 PM | #486
I just really feel, prior to trying the changes, that any change to a popular PVE solo mechanic like stealth or wave is really not the best idea in the world. Yes, the changes for PVP are positive, and perhaps needed to be made to make pvp more palatable, but you are changing two early iconic specials for classes that define that class, and that is not wise IMO.

It would have been far wiser to either offer a different special that would only work in PVP and set the current one to only work in PVE OR just make the changes only in effect during PVP.

This could potentially ruin the classes that use these specials for those that prefer the PVE leveling experience.

Lostpenguins's Avatar


Lostpenguins
09.05.2012 , 04:06 PM | #487
Quote: Originally Posted by AllisonBerryman View Post
In the live game, being affected by two stuns simultaneously only controls you for 4 seconds, but it gives you full Resolve. To be plain, this makes escaping a rampaging melee player very, very difficult. It's directly related to concerns we see regarding overpowered melee and them being inescapable. Going immune after only 4 seconds of control strongly favors the one being controlled.
Sorry, I play a Marauder and I'm going to have to disagree with this. Here's the reason why: you're talking about 2 players stunning you at once. Guess what? If I'm fighting two players who are equally geared with me, I'm probably going to die regardless.

What I do hate with this new system is that I can get stunlocked even more. You talk about increasing fun and the original post mentions that being crowd-controlled to death isn't fun... well, that is exactly what's happening to Marauders who don't have a true stun. I find it frustrating when I go from near full to dead because I can't break the gang-bang of stuns on and watch as my life whittles down.

In fact, I don't think anyone has fun with that so how are you guys fixing this? This is only making it worse.

awesomepossam's Avatar


awesomepossam
09.05.2012 , 04:13 PM | #488
This would be a interesting change if you could rmove mods and armor with set bonuses and add them to - waist and wrist slots . Just a thought starwars develop team

QuickBunnie's Avatar


QuickBunnie
09.05.2012 , 04:15 PM | #489
Quote: Originally Posted by AllisonBerryman View Post

In the live game, being affected by two stuns simultaneously only controls you for 4 seconds, but it gives you full Resolve. To be plain, this makes escaping a rampaging melee player very, very difficult. It's directly related to concerns we see regarding overpowered melee and them being inescapable. Going immune after only 4 seconds of control strongly favors the one being controlled.
Wait, are you serious? Because you do realize that this also makes that VERY SAME melee player able to hold you in place longer.

My proposed solution:
Until they factor in % damage taken during a stun into the resolve system, it will ALWAYS be worthless and not work as intended.

They should also factor in stuns that are broken earlier than their full duration should NOT allow for their full resolve contribution.

Just make resolve gain by 200/sec while stunned, and add a modifier for % damage taken, like 100 resolve per 10% health lost during the duration of the stun.

Pyrinoos's Avatar


Pyrinoos
09.05.2012 , 04:25 PM | #490
Quote: Originally Posted by Sundragon View Post
Yes, we know......you act like we didn't read what you posted.

The problem isn't that someone got lots of resolve fast and thus unstoppable, the problem is that we are getting stunned left and right and can't move. All you've done is insure that we will continue to be stunned as long as possible under a coordinated attack, even if the attack isn't coordinated.

So let me make it a bit clearer.

Pre 1.4 Scenario 1: Coordinated team stun locks you for 8 seconds and you die.
Pre 1.4 Scenario 2: Uncoordinated team can only stun lock you for 4 seconds because they stacked your resolve and gives you a slim chance to do something to survive.
Pre 1.4 Average stun-lock = 6 seconds (assuming 50% likelihood of each scenario)

Post 1.4 Scenario 1: Coordinated team stun locks you for 8 seconds and you die.
Post 1.4 Scenario 2: Uncoordinated team can now stun lock you for 8 seconds because your resolve isn't filling up as fast, and you die.
Post 1.4 Average stun-lock = 8 seconds

As you can see with this remarkably simple analysis/math, the players are going to be stunned MORE ON AVERAGE after the patch, although the MAXIMUM REMAINS UNCHANGED.

We can debate all day about the merits of it, but the math is the math is the math. The average stun lock increases Post 1.4. It isn't hard man.
What I think is being missed here, is that even though the resolve level will be lower in 1.4, the two players stunning you will have both used a stun already. These have cool downs, they are not infinite.
Also, under 1.3 the two simultaneous stuns would generate full resolve, you could immediately blow your trinket and go at it (master strike, score huttball, etc.), with 1.4 you'll have to wait for the next stun, after the first simultaneous ones, to use the trinket. Under neither scenario are you staying stunlocked for eight seconds.
And if you are stunned for the full eight, keep in mind this requires you to have wasted your breaker, and for more than one person to be hitting you, in which case you're supposed to die quickly.
PS.... but you're a healer and multiple people are always trying to kill u, and getting stunned lets them kill you faster. Ummm.... Where are your teammates and why aren't they stunning, taunting, peeling the dps away from you?
Slade legacy on The Ebon Hawk