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BW Bait and Switch


Kolreth's Avatar


Kolreth
08.05.2012 , 01:29 AM | #111
Quote: Originally Posted by RazielHex View Post
TEXT BASED DIARRHEA
Couching your statements in pseudo-lawspeak and adopting eloquence after being berating does not make your arguments correct. They are still wrong, but not borderline rude this time around. Here in the merry old land of australia any clause of a contract that contravenes a law pertinent to the transaction, that clause and any referencing clause is considered null and void. For instance, just because you put NO REFUNDS in a contract of sale for a water heater, if said water heater is faulty, or unsuitable for the purpose intended for it, or the salesman has misrepresented the product in any way, you're entitled to a refund, full stop. Consumer Affairs will drag anyone through the wringer if they try and screw people.

Your bringing up examples that are of cases that are obviously copyright infringements does not prove EULAs are, in their entirety, enforcable. You cannot sign away a right, UN Charter. Say for instance, I put in a EULA I get to stab you in the chest with a knife repeatedly if you annoy me, what do you think is going to happen if I go through with the stabbing?

Alephen's Avatar


Alephen
08.05.2012 , 01:49 AM | #112
Quote: Originally Posted by Kolreth View Post
Couching your statements in pseudo-lawspeak and adopting eloquence after being berating does not make your arguments correct. They are still wrong, but not borderline rude this time around. Here in the merry old land of australia any clause of a contract that contravenes a law pertinent to the transaction, that clause and any referencing clause is considered null and void. For instance, just because you put NO REFUNDS in a contract of sale for a water heater, if said water heater is faulty, or unsuitable for the purpose intended for it, or the salesman has misrepresented the product in any way, you're entitled to a refund, full stop. Consumer Affairs will drag anyone through the wringer if they try and screw people.

Your bringing up examples that are of cases that are obviously copyright infringements does not prove EULAs are, in their entirety, enforcable. You cannot sign away a right, UN Charter. Say for instance, I put in a EULA I get to stab you in the chest with a knife repeatedly if you annoy me, what do you think is going to happen if I go through with the stabbing?
you are taking this out of context. noone has said that eula supercedes criminal laws. the statement was made that the eula is always thrown out, so these cases illustrated that they indeed are not always thrown out and the EULA has the same legal standing as any contract, if done correctly.

also since different countries have different laws it was specific to the US, although it seems by your statement that both are very close or the same at least on this point.

Durasturan's Avatar


Durasturan
08.05.2012 , 09:49 AM | #113
Quote: Originally Posted by RazielHex View Post
T Long long pointless rant.
So all you've proven is that they have created a legal shield to protect them from suit. You haven't actually proven that these tactics are legal or ethical much less why we should trust a company.

You even admit that they have destroyed several key marketing platforms.

No Ilum or open world PVP in fact they even TURNED THE PLANET OFF as in, you couldn't even enter the area for several days when it was truly bugged.

They have removed content from the game between beta and going live.

They have not delivered on even HALF of their promises.

No armor dye. No multispec. No RvR. No new updates month after month. No consistent world events. How many weeks have we had server maintenance 2 or 3 or even 4 times after hearing "one of the big advantages of this engine is that you don't have to bring the servers down for maintenance and updates, you can do it LIVE!"

And now all this content that we have been paying a sub for while we patiently wait is being postponed week after week and month after month so they can save it all up for their cash shop.

So BW has created a "shield" to protect them from lawsuits, but that's just one more example of how they refuse to deal fairly and on an even keel with us the consumer, it just goes to further illustrate my point. They are liars that have lied about every plan or prospect they've had. Virtually none of their promises have been delivered and the ones that have been delivered on are negated by the things they delivered on and then later took away.

They cannot be trusted, we cannot trust them.

Tickdoff-Tank's Avatar


Tickdoff-Tank
08.05.2012 , 10:35 AM | #114
Quote: Originally Posted by Gungan View Post
I keep editting while you're responding, or vice versa...

As I said in my edit, subs get a monthly allowance of cartel points to spend in the cash shop as part of their paid plan. You will be able to buy stuff without additional charge unless you want every possible thing there is (assuming a vast selection). It will depend on the cost of the items in the shop

Furthermore, there are already things in this game not everyone has access to. The security key vendor and the collector's edition perks for example. Both examples of paid perks.
Just to be fair, you do not have to pay for the security key. I have the smart phone app for my security key, did not pay a dime for it and it allows me to use the security key vendor.

I agree with what you said, just wanted to point that out.
"He uses statistics like a drunken man uses a lightpost: For support rather than Illumination." E. Lang

Andryah's Avatar


Andryah
08.05.2012 , 06:07 PM | #115
Quote: Originally Posted by Durasturan View Post
So all you've proven is that they have created a legal shield to protect them from suit. You haven't actually proven that these tactics are legal or ethical much less why we should trust a company.
Actually, you are the one making accusations, so the burden of proof is on you. And you have not met that burden, not even close. The only burden you have met is that you have successfully injected hyperbole into the forum over and over again. Got to give you credit for that I guess.

RazielHex is correct, and you are incorrect. I'm surprised RazielHex has been as patient and attentive to detail with you as he has been.

The only possible disagreement I have with RazielHex is on the matter of headgear. It is entirely possible you put that last post together without any headgear.
Judgments are often inaccurate because the brain relies on cognitive biases over hard evidence. Cognitive bias is the tendency to make irrational judgments in consistent patterns. Researchers have found that cognitive bias wreaks havoc by forcing people to make poor, irrational judgments.

Nimithril's Avatar


Nimithril
08.05.2012 , 06:48 PM | #116
Yes, because everyone in the world except for EA/BW has done everything perfectly in their lives and have met every deliverable/deadline that they have ever been given or attempted to make.

Mistakes are made, deadlines missed, goals are sometimes too optimistic. It happens.

Btw, responding to self-involved entitlement d'bags with ridiculous expectations in an appropriate manner isn't arrogance, just self-defense. Play the game or don't, but stop posting garbage just for the sake of boosting your own sense of self-worth. This game has problems that need to be addressed and if they aren't, TOR will probably fade away...but threads like this do not help in any way, shape or form.
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthAbominor View Post
And finally, sitting through this video is like watching a 6 year old bash his own head in with a frying pan.. just not as entertaining.
Quote: Originally Posted by nvoid View Post
That's my new facebook status: Shut up the f$$%$% mouth!

GarfieldJL's Avatar


GarfieldJL
08.05.2012 , 07:03 PM | #117
Quote: Originally Posted by Nimithril View Post
Yes, because everyone in the world except for EA/BW has done everything perfectly in their lives and have met every deliverable/deadline that they have ever been given or attempted to make.

Mistakes are made, deadlines missed, goals are sometimes too optimistic. It happens.

Btw, responding to self-involved entitlement d'bags with ridiculous expectations in an appropriate manner isn't arrogance, just self-defense. Play the game or don't, but stop posting garbage just for the sake of boosting your own sense of self-worth. This game has problems that need to be addressed and if they aren't, TOR will probably fade away...but threads like this do not help in any way, shape or form.
It isn't about missing deadlines, I think people would be okay if things are a week or two late, the problem is a lot of what EA/BW has promised has never materialized. Some of it is things that are so basic, they really have no excuse. My Bachelor's Degree is in Computer Graphics Technology, I may not have gone the gaming route, but seriously changing the color of an armor is ridiculously easy and only takes a maximum of 5 to 10 minutes tops, and most of that time would be the time it takes to boot up photoshop on your pc, it isn't all that hard. It doesn't take any hardcore coding, in fact I seriously suspect (since some armors are fairly identical except for colors, with the match chest piece option in existance), that it wouldn't even take that long.

For all this bashing of people whom are complaining, well some of what they are saying isn't fair, but quite a bit of what they are complaining about is rather legit.

BW/EA's problem is they haven't even addressed the little things let alone the big things that they promised, things that probably wouldn't create any additional bugs and there is a pattern of it. Adding color options isn't exactly a hard thing to do, could be a little tedious, but there isn't any real difficulty.

CommunitySupport's Avatar


CommunitySupport
08.06.2012 , 09:22 AM | #118
Hello everyone. We appreciate you sharing your thoughts, but will be closing this thread, as it is largely unconstructive arguing. If you have feedback regarding the game, we're happy to hear your (specific, detailed) thoughts, and ask that you post them in the appropriate subforum. Thanks!