Take one example. Scoundrels are strong enough to make any class mostly (except tanks) to lose half HP in those 4 seconds of his main stun. With animation buged since beta (not fixed after so long long time) is hard to counter them. When you get on your feet he will dodge you for the next 3 seconds and drop you even more. If you are a marauder or sentinel you will use GBTF and he will vanish. When it will reopen on you is time for you to die.

So i find scoundrels / operatives strongest dps class atm.

Spoked with alot of tanks and they admited that scoundrels / operatives is the only class that drop thier HP faster then any other.

To make shadow infiltration competitive against them you have to do alot:

If they use dodge we use resilience=fair chances.

If they cleanse we cant =scoundrel advantage

If they can put a bit of healing we cant = scoundrel advantage

If he use recuperate we cant =scoundrel advantage

Spining kik is a stun up to 4 sec stun but usualy is only 2 seconds (scoundrel stun 4 sec) = scoundrel advantage

Low slash isnt by far same strong as their bomb that aoe stun all players for 4 sec, low slash is weak.

We have a 4 sec stun but that must be used last or it will full resolve the target.

 

Overall you can see the diference. hen a class have alot of tool s and others dont then we have a problem.

Scoundrels after PT is strongest dps class in the game in any 1v1, 1v2 encounters. And hybrids are way too much OP.

Discuss.

So many of your facts are just completely wrong, maybe have an actual look at both classes then write this again.

I agree, nerf operatives!

I recommend you try to play one, and we'll see how much you own.

[quote=Marisblood;4930398

If they use dodge we use resilience=fair chances.

If they cleanse we cant =scoundrel advantage

If they can put a bit of healing we cant = scoundrel advantage

If he use recuperate we cant =scoundrel advantage

Spining kik is a stun up to 4 sec stun but usualy is only 2 seconds (scoundrel stun 4 sec) = scoundrel advantage

Low slash isnt by far same strong as their bomb that aoe stun all players for 4 sec, low slash is weak.

We have a 4 sec stun but that must be used last or it will full resolve the target.

 

Discuss.

 

Resilience is better than dodge (shadow advantage)

Scoundrel have a manual cleanse yes, but both have the option for cleanse (scoundrel advantage)

Healing, yes (scoundrel

If he is using recuperate, he's out of combat, which means so are you....(exactly the same)

spinning kick is 2 seconds, shoot first is 1.5 seconds, then both also get the 4 second hard stun, but shadows is ranged (shadow advantage)

The mez has more escape uses than low slash i think it is if i remember correctly, so yer (scoundrel advantage)

 

You think a scoundrels cc doesnt count at all towards resolve or something?

Hahaha. Haha. Hahaha.

 

No, wait, you are not actually serious, are you?

 

Okay, on the topic of stuns: As a Deception assassin, you have a 2 second stun from stealth and a 4 second stun with 30 m range. Operatives/Scoundrels in Concealment/Scrapper spec have a 1.5 second knockdown and a 4 second stun from melee range. Not exactly seeing the advantage here.

 

Yes, your incapacitating effect lasts shorter and only affects one person. It also deals some damage. Ours lasts longer and has an 8 meter radius. If your goal is to disable a large group of enemies, that sure is easier with the AoE solution.

 

You've gone into dodge vs. resilience. Let's just note that Evasion counters Knight/Warrior damage (when not in Rage spec, mainly used to counter Ravage/Master Strike) and probably a smaller part of assassin damage. It's good against MM snipers. That's about it.

Force shroud is helpful against... oh, right, everyone BUT these cases. Fun fact: The scoundrel stun is a tech ability. Go figure.

 

You've also blissfully ignored the points "Area knockback" and "Force Speed". I understand. There simply can't be any discussion about those abilities. Inherently useless.

 

Now Deception assassins certainly have some issues with their tree, but to blame it on scoundrels is just...

 

No, actually, I agree. Nerf Scoundrels and Operatives. We can take it. There's too many of us anyway, sometimes I see two in a single warzone. Even met one in group finder the other day.

Edited July 29, 2012 by tacito

Lol! Infil has better burst than Scrappers, out of stealth, with better control thanks to Low Slash and Spinning Kick able to be used before a hard stun or lift.

 

So yeah, no. Just no. Buff -Scoundrels- up to Infil Shadow with one more control ability, or differentiate the two by giving Scoundrel another Vanish option and thus more damage potential from more Shoot Firsts. They have to decide, but it does seem like they want Infil to be control and Scrapper to be burst, but Scrapper doesn't have better burst....

Thread creator I suggest you research the stun times again and properly educate yourself in this matter. When you say things that are factually incorrect it invalidates your entire argument.

Thread creator I suggest you research the stun times again and properly educate yourself in this matter. When you say things that are factually incorrect it invalidates your entire argument.

 

Pretty much.

Stun times? Did everyone miss this little gem?

Scoundrels after PT is strongest dps class in the game in any 1v1, 1v2 encounters. And hybrids are way too much OP.

 

Thinking Spinning Kick stuns for 4 seconds is the least of OP's ignorance.

Lots of misleading remarks in the OP, on my tank I lose health faster from a pyro more than an operative, an operative I just basically ignore and CC or run away from. You want an already bad assassin/shadow spec to be as bad as operative's concealment? HS doesn't hit that hard anymore, backstab is a bit more reliable and there's no gap closer.

 

What kind of tanks have you been talking to telling you that operative/scoundrel take their health down fast? On my operative when concealment spec, it shines in regular warzones against recruit and partial BM players but against WH players it's not even worth trying.