Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

2859 RWZ Rated Juggernaut PvP Movie

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
2859 RWZ Rated Juggernaut PvP Movie

paowee's Avatar


paowee
07.24.2012 , 01:34 PM | #81
Quote: Originally Posted by DimeStax View Post
Speed isn't always > than Positioning. Backpedaling is still useful for positioning,
If I understand you correctly, here is one instance i feel backpedalling will be a little bit more useful.

==================================================
BP = back pedal
= you
◊ = charge target
- - - - -> = min charge range / distance between and ◊
==================================================

Scenario 1: BP > Strafe
Goal: - - - - -> ◊

1. - - - -> ◊ = can not charge (BP~0.15 seconds to get to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ )
2. backpedal for 0.15 seconds**
3. - - - - -> ◊ = charge

** said player instead used Strafe = resulted in ~0.50*EDIT FOR ~MTGREX second to reach Goal (due to hitting key + mouse turn)
Also Strafe depended on player skill; might take longer for some people

Scenario 2: Strafe > BP
Goal: - - - - -> ◊

1. - ◊ = strafe + camera turn to get into min range (BP ~6 seconds to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ , Strafe takes 2 sec)
2. - - ◊ = strafe + camera turn to get into min range (BP ~4 seconds to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ Strafe takes 1.5 sec )
3. - - - ◊ = strafe + camera turn to get into min range (BP ~3 seconds to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ Strafe takes 1 sec)

Conclusion:
In Scenario 1, BP is better as it takes a mere one hit of the button ~0.25 sec to get to charge range as opposed to a strafe + mouse turn which would take ~0.75 sec and is vastly dependent on player skill

In Scenario 2, Strafe will always come out better.

Query: If you are 0.25m away from min charge range, would it not be easier, better, FASTER to hit the BP + Charge key rather than hit Strafe Key + Mouse turn + Charge key?


Thoughts anyone?
Republic < Intrepid > The Harbinger slinger sage vanguard dps
swtorboard.org dps blog.class guides.end-game stuff
16 man | 8 man DPS leaderboards | Galactic Starfighter Records

Megatfx's Avatar


Megatfx
07.24.2012 , 01:39 PM | #82
Quote: Originally Posted by paowee View Post
If I understand you correctly, here is one instance i feel backpedalling will be a little bit more useful.

==================================================
BP = back pedal
= you
◊ = charge target
- - - - -> = min charge range / distance between and ◊
==================================================

Scenario 1: BP > Strafe
Goal: - - - - -> ◊

1. - - - -> ◊ = can not charge (BP~0.25 seconds to get to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ )
2. backpedal for 0.25 seconds**
3. - - - - -> ◊ = charge

** said player instead used Strafe = resulted in ~0.75 second to reach Goal (due to hitting key + mouse turn)
Also Strafe depended on player skill; might take longer for some people

Scenario 2: Strafe > BP
Goal: - - - - -> ◊

1. - ◊ = strafe + camera turn to get into min range (BP ~6 seconds to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ )
2. - - ◊ = strafe + camera turn to get into min range (BP ~4 seconds to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ )
3. - - - ◊ = strafe + camera turn to get into min range (BP ~3 seconds to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ )

Conclusion:
In Scenario 1, BP is better as it takes a mere one hit of the button ~0.25 sec to get to charge range as opposed to a strafe + mouse turn which would take ~0.75 sec and is vastly dependent on player skill

In Scenario 2, Strafe will always come out better.


Thoughts anyone?
Your numbers are complete nonsense. How would it take .75 seconds to strafe and mouse turn? That's right, it wouldn't. It might take YOU .75 seconds, but any person who knows how to multi-task more than one thing at a time would do it faster than the backpedaller.

DimeStax's Avatar


DimeStax
07.24.2012 , 01:40 PM | #83
Quote: Originally Posted by paowee View Post
If I understand you correctly, here is one instance i feel backpedalling will be a little bit more useful.

==================================================
BP = back pedal
= you
◊ = charge target
- - - - -> = min charge range / distance between and ◊
==================================================

Scenario 1: BP > Strafe
Goal: - - - - -> ◊

1. - - - -> ◊ = can not charge (BP~0.25 seconds to get to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ )
2. backpedal for 0.25 seconds**
3. - - - - -> ◊ = charge

** said player instead used Strafe = resulted in ~0.75 second to reach Goal (due to hitting key + mouse turn)
Also Strafe depended on player skill; might take longer for some people

Scenario 2: Strafe > BP
Goal: - - - - -> ◊

1. - ◊ = strafe + camera turn to get into min range (BP ~6 seconds to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ )
2. - - ◊ = strafe + camera turn to get into min range (BP ~4 seconds to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ )
3. - - - ◊ = strafe + camera turn to get into min range (BP ~3 seconds to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ )

Conclusion:
In Scenario 1, BP is better as it takes a mere one hit of the button ~0.25 sec to get to charge range as opposed to a strafe + mouse turn which would take ~0.75 sec and is vastly dependent on player skill

In Scenario 2, Strafe will always come out better.

Query: If you are 0.25m away from min charge range, would it not be easier, better, FASTER to hit the BP + Charge key rather than hit Strafe Key + Mouse turn + Charge key?


Thoughts anyone?
LOL. I love your post but had to stop myself from bursting out laughing. It's funny how it takes a mathematical formula to prove to misguided players what a good player instinctively knows. But seriously, good post.
Sakz <Good Talk> 55 Guardian - The Bastion
Dimes <Good Talk> 55 Gunslinger - The Bastion
Six-t'nine<Synergy> 55 Commando - The Bastion
Nickels <Synergy> 36 Scoundrel - The Bastion

paowee's Avatar


paowee
07.24.2012 , 01:42 PM | #84
Quote: Originally Posted by Megatfx View Post
Your numbers are complete nonsense. How would it take .75 seconds to strafe and mouse turn? That's right, it wouldn't. It might take YOU .75 seconds, but any person who knows how to multi-task more than one thing at a time would do it faster than the backpedaller.
Ok skew the numbers. They are guesstimates and in now way can be proven given current resources. Check the Query at the end of the post then. Also 0.75 sec takes too long, then let's adjust it.
Republic < Intrepid > The Harbinger slinger sage vanguard dps
swtorboard.org dps blog.class guides.end-game stuff
16 man | 8 man DPS leaderboards | Galactic Starfighter Records

Blasphemerr's Avatar


Blasphemerr
07.24.2012 , 01:42 PM | #85
Interesting video from an underplayed class; How often do you respec? The spec within the video & description box are different.
Something pretentious.

Megatfx's Avatar


Megatfx
07.24.2012 , 01:44 PM | #86
Quote: Originally Posted by dimestax View Post
lol. I love your post but had to stop myself from bursting out laughing. It's funny how it takes a mathematical formula to prove to misguided players what a good player instinctively knows. But seriously, good post.
he just made those numbers up. It does not take .75 seconds to strafe and mouse turn simultaneously, it is still faster to do that, than to backpedal at 40% slower speeds.

Megatfx's Avatar


Megatfx
07.24.2012 , 01:46 PM | #87
Quote: Originally Posted by Megatfx View Post
he just made those numbers up. It does not take .75 seconds to strafe and mouse turn simultaneously, it is still faster to do that, than to backpedal at 40% slower speeds.
Quoting myself to further explain, you are strafing and mouse turning SIMULTANEOUSLY. A player does not go, "Right I need to strafe... let me slowly angle my camera, now I will begin strafing". It becomes an instinctual turn done instantly and simultaneously.

Megatfx's Avatar


Megatfx
07.24.2012 , 01:48 PM | #88
Quote: Originally Posted by Megatfx View Post
Quoting myself to further explain, you are strafing and mouse turning SIMULTANEOUSLY. A player does not go, "Right I need to strafe... let me slowly angle my camera, now I will begin strafing". It becomes an instinctual turn done instantly and simultaneously.
In fact, I'm going to record a video later because I have been doing it over and over again to try and find ANY situation where you might be correct and have yet to come close.

DimeStax's Avatar


DimeStax
07.24.2012 , 01:51 PM | #89
Some people will just never get it. Let them play the way they feel comfortable playing; if they don't want to backpedal then let them strafe for every little positioning movement they need to do in the game.

In my opinion, using backpedal isn't bad, but never using strafe IS bad. As long as you're strafing more than you're backpedaling you're doing fine. Heck, as long as your achieving the desired results, doing your job, and are noticed as a good player; then you're doing fine. You don't need to change every aspect of your play style to match other people's because they say its the best. There are many ways to reach successful results, and no one is perfect.

All I know is that if I'm a sniper on a ledge and it says I'm too far forward to use cover, I'm going to press the back pedal button once so I can drop cover and I'm not going to hold my mouse button while strafing sideways because I'm not concerned with speed loss in this situation, only positioning, and it is achieved just fine by pressing backpedal once.
Sakz <Good Talk> 55 Guardian - The Bastion
Dimes <Good Talk> 55 Gunslinger - The Bastion
Six-t'nine<Synergy> 55 Commando - The Bastion
Nickels <Synergy> 36 Scoundrel - The Bastion

paowee's Avatar


paowee
07.24.2012 , 01:51 PM | #90
Quote: Originally Posted by Megatfx View Post
Your numbers are complete nonsense. How would it take .75 seconds to strafe and mouse turn? That's right, it wouldn't. It might take YOU .75 seconds, but any person who knows how to multi-task more than one thing at a time would do it faster than the backpedaller.
Ok let us change the numbers. They were guesstimates and thanks to your added insight, we're able to put out a more accurate scenario. Let's change the numbers: BOLD will be the changes made.

Scenario 1: BP > Strafe
Goal: - - - - -> ◊

1. - - - -> ◊ = can not charge (BP~0.15 seconds to get to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ )
2. backpedal for 0.15 seconds**
3. - - - - -> ◊ = charge

** said player instead used Strafe = resulted in ~0.25*EDIT FOR ~MTGREX second to reach Goal (due to hitting key + mouse turn)
Also Strafe depended on player skill; might take longer for some people
================================================== =========

There edited it for you. Also let me add some things:

- - - -> ◊
- - - - -> ◊
difference in distance is 0.2 meters.
Character position needs to move 0.2 m for minimum range

Problem: Which method would give the faster solution = move 0.2m backward ◊?
1) Hit BP key
2) Hit A key + Hold right mouse button + move mouse towards the right ( to keep forward facing angle)
done SIMULTANEOUSLY as per ~MGTFERX which is a given anyways....

1. - - - -> ◊ = can not charge (BP~0.15 seconds to get to get to Goal: - - - - -> ◊ )
2. backpedal for 0.15 seconds**
3. - - - - -> ◊ = charge

Actually after doing some mental simulations of 1) and 2), they might actually be around the same amount of time! With the difference being a few micro seconds. lol. Although BP is better for QoL.
Republic < Intrepid > The Harbinger slinger sage vanguard dps
swtorboard.org dps blog.class guides.end-game stuff
16 man | 8 man DPS leaderboards | Galactic Starfighter Records