Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

Low FPS - Poor Performance

First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

Malteserz's Avatar


Malteserz
07.20.2012 , 11:10 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by DotFreelance View Post
You can buy a sufficient overclocking cooler for about $60. A closed loop setup is available for around $100.

This generation of i5 is much slower, the newer generation is post 3.0ghz which shows a huge performance boost ( I can't quote you the other improvements on that chipset. )

My friend has my old video card ( 4890 ) and I have a newer one ( 6950, 2GB ) and he gets similar performance. His CPU is the 3.5ghz i5, and mine is the 2.78ghz i5. We run the same settings and resolution.

CPU does matter, and boosting your CPU even 500mhz will show a good performance increase.
If it were the CPU slowing this game down, surely lowering graphics settings would fix this, whats weird to report is that I infact get better performance over all with the higher graphics settings than the lower.
The game might be graphical, but looking at it, its not that graphical, there is a lot of blur and pixelating textures. If this game is demanding that much there must be some sort of cluster of information happening or something in the games engine.
I got Oblivion running maxed on a old Pentium 4 HT 3.2ghz set up back in the days by tweaking the engine code, read up that its main problem was memory management. Would slowly clutter its self up and eventually cause rapid slow downs the longer you played it in the most illogical areas.
I cant say that this is the problem with this title as it only slows down when the game is required to load things from their server via the internet like players and attack effects.
A low resolution or low latency combat effects option might help.
I say this because I remember getting a performance boost when I DMZ'd and port forwarded the game in the modem configuration. Its almost as if the latency is holding the game performance back in some weird attempt to average out latency.
Windows 7 Home Premium 64bit OS, Intel Quad Core i5 @2.8GHz CPU, 12GB Kingston Extreme RAM, Sapphire 2GB HD6970 Flex/VaporX/Battlefield3 Edition GFX
"Great warrior, hmm? Wars not make one great." ~ Master Jedi Yoda

billyconnite's Avatar


billyconnite
07.20.2012 , 11:17 PM | #12
To the reports posted above.

Yes of course I have tried running SWTOR from the same SSD as the OS. No advice you or customer service will give me will provide any kind of solution.

The point of this thread is not really to ask for any kind of advice - I know there is nothing wrong with my system or others. I have tweaked this game in every way possible, and also run it on lower-end PC's to achieve the EXACT same results on a reasonable system.

This is more of a report and proof that this game engine is currently unoptimized, and requires alot of work to actually utilize hardware to the full extent, like any decent game does. Bottle-necking due to engine restraints is result of both poor programming, and a priority on content production over performance and optimization.

I aim to receive nothing more than a response from BioWare acknowledging their game engine needs work - And hopefully an ETA on an overhaul if they have plans. This is something that BioWare has NOT yet acknowledged. Until that happens this means BioWare can go on ignoring issues the community has with the game, the way they have the past 6 months, resulting in the eventual death or F2P of SWTOR.

Re-read my original post. Every. Word. Then tell me there's something wrong with my system. If you have no suggestion for me specifically - Do not post here.

Please do not hijack this thread. Thankyou.


Malteserz, I understand you are having similar issues - Hopefully a BW employee can help us. In the mean-time, I wouldn't bother listening to any non-advice you will get from SW-Lovers trying to defend a broken engine.
Kramer // Cake is Real // Giddy Up

Griffinous's Avatar


Griffinous
07.20.2012 , 11:24 PM | #13
Did you try a RAM drive?
Watercooled i7 2600k @5ghz, Asus Maximus IV Extreme Z with watercooled chipset, 16gb DDR3, Watercooled 4gb AMD Radeon HD6990, Creative X-Fi Champion Kingston Hyper X 256gb SSD 3x 23" LED monitors @ 5760x1080

billyconnite's Avatar


billyconnite
07.20.2012 , 11:26 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Griffinous View Post
Did you try a RAM drive?
Yes
Quote: Originally Posted by billyconnite View Post
Re-read my original post. Every. Word. Then tell me there's something wrong with my system. If you have no suggestion for me specifically - Do not post here.
Re-read my original post. Every. Word.
Kramer // Cake is Real // Giddy Up

DotFreelance's Avatar


DotFreelance
07.20.2012 , 11:32 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by billyconnite View Post
To the reports posted above.

Yes of course I have tried running SWTOR from the same SSD as the OS. No advice you or customer service will give me will provide any kind of solution.

The point of this thread is not really to ask for any kind of advice - I know there is nothing wrong with my system or others. I have tweaked this game in every way possible, and also run it on lower-end PC's to achieve the EXACT same results on a reasonable system.

This is more of a report and proof that this game engine is currently unoptimized, and requires alot of work to actually utilize hardware to the full extent, like any decent game does. Bottle-necking due to engine restraints is result of both poor programming, and a priority on content production over performance and optimization.

I aim to receive nothing more than a response from BioWare acknowledging their game engine needs work - And hopefully an ETA on an overhaul if they have plans. This is something that BioWare has NOT yet acknowledged. Until that happens this means BioWare can go on ignoring issues the community has with the game, the way they have the past 6 months, resulting in the eventual death or F2P of SWTOR.

Re-read my original post. Every. Word. Then tell me there's something wrong with my system. If you have no suggestion for me specifically - Do not post here.

Please do not hijack this thread. Thankyou.


Malteserz, I understand you are having similar issues - Hopefully a BW employee can help us. In the mean-time, I wouldn't bother listening to any non-advice you will get from SW-Lovers trying to defend a broken engine.
If you believe it's simply due to the engine being broken, then there's nothing we can do, and nothing support can do for you on the forums.

Looks like this thread is done.

Griffinous's Avatar


Griffinous
07.20.2012 , 11:36 PM | #16
Your original post says nothing about a RAM Disk. At the end of the day, your setup is very similar to mine. Your issues are likely down to either a hardware bottleneck or a driver issue. Your specifications are good, but perhaps you have an underlying issue, like a poorly setup BIOS.
Your computer is dropping FPS when it is under stress in high populated areas and in PVP which is high population and multiple simultaneous combat effects.

Be a good a chap and actually think logically about why you're getting the FPS you are
Watercooled i7 2600k @5ghz, Asus Maximus IV Extreme Z with watercooled chipset, 16gb DDR3, Watercooled 4gb AMD Radeon HD6990, Creative X-Fi Champion Kingston Hyper X 256gb SSD 3x 23" LED monitors @ 5760x1080

Kyuuu's Avatar


Kyuuu
07.20.2012 , 11:49 PM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by billyconnite View Post
The past few weeks I've done much research into figuring out what exactly may be either A) Wrong with my system, or B) Wrong with your game engine.

I've searched countless threads on this issue - The most profound fps issues people (And myself) are experiencing are obviously when more than X number of characters appear in one area, and namely in warzones (Notably The Voidstar). Note ALL of these threads, every last one ends in supporting simply ceasing discussion and offering no explanation, or further assistance past simply "Update windows, update drivers, bla bla bla."

My issues: NOTE: I receive 60fps consistently outside the following situations: Most importantly - In warzones I can achieve as low as 20-25fps whilst amongst most of the players in the warzone battling it out - This affects my performance personally, as well as my enjoyment of the game. Less important, more of an annoyance is on fleet I will achieve as low as 30-35fps when the fleet is highly populated. Frankly I don't care that I receive lower than 60fps on fleet, however in a warzone with only 16 players visible maximum at any given time, it's pathetic receiving any lower than a constant 60fps. Note these issues have been exactly the same throughout 1.2 and 1.3 - 1.3 offered no performance increase at all.

My settings: Everything on Very High (Including Visible Character Limit, dropping this helps in Fleet, but obviously does nothing to help in warzones). I have AA in-game on, and don't use FXAA as it will blur the text and interface as well. Note I have tried mixing and matching settings, all low, all high - Tweaking some settings via the NVIDIA Control Panel. Nothing makes any difference to the base-line low fps I will receive.

My system: I'm not going to call it high-end, obviously you can achieve much better quite easily - However this is certainly enough to run a game like this, and also runs both BF3 and Crysis 2 at max settings with full HD textures at 1080p without dropping below 60fps at all. No exaggeration.

Monitoring system: Throughout the past few weeks I've monitored the system, ensuring nothing is bottle-necking, hardware-wise.
CPU: CPU usage overall will never reach over 30-35%, and never moves higher or lower when receiving the lowest fps, temperature sits at around 50C. Not I have disabled core parking also, this may reduce stutter ever so slightly, but does not help overall. I have also tried disabling HT, this does not help at all.
GPU: GPU usage never exceeds about 50% unless loading maps. Even whilst receiving the lowest fps GPU usage will not move above or below that mark. Temperature never exceeds 53-54C. Note, I have also tried forcing constant voltages and clock speeds to this model temporarily, this does not help. The highest utilized VRAM sits at around 800MB.
SSD's: Regardless of how many files are currently being read or written to, the drive achieve consistent 1ms seek times.
RAM: Usage sits between 4-6GB. Page faults are very low even after long game play (RAM being paged).

Specs:
i7-2600
8gb RAM (Usually 16gb HyperX Kingston, had to swap out temporarily - Note performance is EXACTLY the same)
Intel 330 SSD X 2 (One running Windows, the other running SWTOR)
Gigabyte GTX 670 OC'd

Spoiler


What I have already tried before constructing this post: Clean install of both Windows 7, drivers and SWTOR. RAMDisk: This did not help at all, it MAY have increased the base lower fps I receive very slightly, but not significantly enough to continue utilizing. Running as administrator, under compatibility modes. Running from different locations. Hardware: I had upgraded from an older SSD to two newer Intel 330's - I also upgraded from a 560 Ti GFX card to the GTX 670.

So I now leave it in your hands support - Although I expect to receive absolutely no fix, or any suggestions at all - At the very least I want a reply from a BW employee either: A) Acknowledging their game engine is currently not up to the task. B) Giving me some indication as to whether BW is currently working on overhauling the current engine to improve performance. C) Totally avoiding the fact their engine has issues.

I hope I receive some information from BW here, and not some thread hijackers looking to defend their loved game, as I have noticed in other support threads. I love this game too - But I need some answers here.
It is the game engine and its OWN bottlenecks that are the problem. One of them being the terrible bad compression system that is being used the game engine it self cant even feed the data fast enough, mostly cause of how heavy the compressing in the game is and how slow it is at uncompressing it.

I have this feel if all the games data was uncompressed things would be alot faster. But that dont explain why GPU usage is all over the place and 50% or less of the gpu is used in situations where we have low fps.

billyconnite's Avatar


billyconnite
07.20.2012 , 11:52 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Griffinous View Post
Your original post says nothing about a RAM Disk. At the end of the day, your setup is very similar to mine. Your issues are likely down to either a hardware bottleneck or a driver issue. Your specifications are good, but perhaps you have an underlying issue, like a poorly setup BIOS.
Your computer is dropping FPS when it is under stress in high populated areas and in PVP which is high population and multiple simultaneous combat effects.

Be a good a chap and actually think logically about why you're getting the FPS you are
Can you read?
Quote: Originally Posted by billyconnite View Post
What I have already tried before constructing this post: Clean install of both Windows 7, drivers and SWTOR. RAMDisk: This did not help at all, it MAY have increased the base lower fps I receive very slightly, but not significantly enough to continue utilizing. Running as administrator, under compatibility modes. Running from different locations. Hardware: I had upgraded from an older SSD to two newer Intel 330's - I also upgraded from a 560 Ti GFX card to the GTX 670.
Be a good chap and tell me why my CPU/RAM/GPU/SSD is bottle-necking when in my first post I provided data that shows my CPU usage, GPU usage, RAM usage, Seek times and heat at all very low levels in high population areas/WZ's (A warzone contains 16 people... This is not high population). When I receive lower fps the levels all remain the same.

If you were being logical and perhaps READ MY FIRST POST. EVERY. WORD. And perhaps did some research also you would know that the SW/Modified HeroEngine STOPS video rendering altogether whilst performing some tasks, obviously related to character data/rendering as this occurs in highly populated areas and when many abilities are being used concurrently. This is why a RAMdisk can SLIGHTLY increase the base lower fps I receive whilst in these situations - SLIGHTLY. This is ONLY because character and ability related textures are being loaded slightly faster than normal. The rest is due to poor threading related to character data (i.e. what OTHER characters are currently doing, and the data being received by the server being processed very poorly due to none other than bad programming and poor threading).

Please leave your simple suggestions to yourself. Thankyou.

Please do not hijack my thread. Thankyou.
Kramer // Cake is Real // Giddy Up

Griffinous's Avatar


Griffinous
07.21.2012 , 12:06 AM | #19
Apologies for missing the RAM Disk remark. Many more people have no issues with the engine then those complaining about it. Have fun with your 25fps. What server are you PVPing on again?
Watercooled i7 2600k @5ghz, Asus Maximus IV Extreme Z with watercooled chipset, 16gb DDR3, Watercooled 4gb AMD Radeon HD6990, Creative X-Fi Champion Kingston Hyper X 256gb SSD 3x 23" LED monitors @ 5760x1080

billyconnite's Avatar


billyconnite
07.21.2012 , 12:11 AM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Griffinous View Post
Apologies for missing the RAM Disk remark. Many more people have no issues with the engine then those complaining about it. Have fun with your 25fps. What server are you PVPing on again?
No, many more people simply don't even notice they've dropped below 60fps - Something i've noticed from many players - Upon forcing them to use the same settings as me, with vsync ON they report the exact same fps limitations when in the same warzones.

Quote: Originally Posted by Griffinous View Post
Watercooled i7 2600k @5ghz, Asus Maximus IV Extreme Z with watercooled chipset, 16gb DDR3, Watercooled 4gb AMD Radeon HD6990, Creative X-Fi Champion Kingston Hyper X 256gb SSD 3x 23" LED monitors @ 5760x1080
In regards to drivers mentioned earlier - My 560 Ti would report the exact same results, regardless which drivers I would use. Old, new, beta - Doesn't matter. This is not driver related.

Please enjoy your current setup, this kind of system with an i7 OC'd at 5Ghz and a 6990 should not be necessary to run a game like this. If you're having no issues, Great! Stay out of my thread. Thanks. Good day sir.
Kramer // Cake is Real // Giddy Up