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wallywaffles's Avatar

07.16.2012 , 12:44 PM | #11
Shield Specialist
1. How do you think your Vanguard spec is perceived by other classes?
In both PvE and PvP I feel that most people would prefer a Guardian as a tank due to their better defensive cooldowns, but I don't think anyone would exclude me because of my class.
2. How do you perceive your own spec?
I love playing a vanguard, especially for the numerous AoE abilities. I may not have the survivability cooldowns of a Guardian but because of the AoE attacks I can put out higher numbers in warzones, and presumably operations. It is also great to have both a charge and a pull ability to manage the field of enemies, and a 30m base attack is very useful.

1. I think most people feel that Vanguard assault is overpowered in terms of damage output.
2. The damage may be a bit too high in PvE (though no higher than some gunslinger/sentinel specs), but in PvP it is mitigated by our lack of a gap closer to be able to use our reset procs on high impact bolt (Ion Pulse/Stockstrike). We are also pretty easy to kill, so I think it's a good balance in PvP. I do think that in PvE at least, Vanguard Assault has more damage than Commando Assault (in PvP their longer range negates this advantage in many situations).

Cylestat's Avatar

07.16.2012 , 12:50 PM | #12
1 ) We are seen as the top PVP DPS out there. On par with Sentinel, but not quite as desirable given a choice.
2) I find my assault Vanguard DPS sometimes boring, I spam 3 moves with very little change between. I'm playing this class until sage DPS is viable again or until my sentinel DPS has been leveled.
.: Lestat :.

iamthehoyden's Avatar

07.16.2012 , 12:51 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by CommunitySupport View Post

1. How do you think your Vanguard spec is perceived by other classes?
2. How do you perceive your own spec?
Assault Spec (primarily pve)
1. I think van dps is seen as a flexible class that provides some options in terms of off-tanking in a pinch, switching between range and melee when necessary, and generally having a lot of tools. The lack of a longer cc and a pushback are negatives.
2. Ammo management is not particularly fun, but the burst dps is. I've tried tactics, and it's too melee-centric without a really good way to close distance to a group.
aren't you a little short for a stormtrooper?
Fan Fiction: My Name is Solomon Crae The Man in the Box

MattFrontino's Avatar

07.16.2012 , 12:54 PM | #14
Shield Specialist

1. How do you think your Vanguard spec is perceived by other classes?
I believe my AC is looked at as one of the strongest in the game, but my spec is looked at as a tank who can deal plenty of damage with average tanking ability (a better off-tank then main tank). In PvE we are totally viable tanks if geared properly. In PVP, we are looked at as just another tank, but 2nd tier huttball carriers behind guardians.

2. How do you perceive your own spec?
In PVE, I think my spec does great due to my gear but I feel I fall short just a little to guardians during boss fights.
In PVP, I wish my shield made a greater impact but we do OK, less now since the 1.3 changes and I find myself tempted to cross over to assault spec (which is a little stronger right now).
Frontino - Vanguard
<Final Chapter>

SiddNeverr's Avatar

07.16.2012 , 01:06 PM | #15
I've played all three specs with vanguard ... shield, tactics, and assault. I will buck a lot of "trend" in saying that tactics is by far my favorite and most fun to play ... but it is also the most flawed and lacking. Recent changes to shields made it far less viable in pvp due to how shield rating and absorption work ... and shield spec was my second favorite spec. Assault, to me, is a FOTM due to how you can stack numbers if you are smart about spreading around your plasma dot and getting several targets ticking at once.

I've also messed around with a tactics "tank" using a 8/31/2 build under ion cell ... this to me is a lot of fun to play, but it just comes up short in a lot of ways, too. "Fun factor" unfortunately doesn't translate well into group stuff ... when people are like "oh we thought you were dps assault, tactics sucks." They're not entirely wrong in saying that, either, but like I said ... I find some of the more subtle things in tactics to be fun. Currently I run what I call a "run and gun" setup which is 1/22/18 tactics/assault blend. It won't put up the sexy numbers of a true assault but it gives me some of the fun factor of tactics I like and some utility.

1. How do you think your Vanguard spec is perceived by other classes?
Suboptimal tank, suboptimal melee, and only good as a high dps assault spec (2/6/33). I used to enjoy doing tanking with shield or tactics based builds but everyone I run with has made the case over and over ... guardians and shadows are far superior tanks for pvp due to vanguard's poor survivability when compared to the other two (mainly lack of stellar defensive CDs). they also lack any sort of dps when compared to the other two. I went with a dps build so I at least had a chance to get an invite for warzone teams.

2. How do you perceive your own spec?
I enjoy my 1/22/18 spec in that it gives me a lot of mobility and some good dot and burst dmg options. It will certainly not challenge a full assault in numbers, but it offers some additional utility and as I have said before I genuinely find the tactics stuff to be the most "fun" so this brings that to the table.

Sanctusvox's Avatar

07.16.2012 , 01:11 PM | #16
1. How do you think your Vanguard spec is perceived by other classes?
I think that the vanguard assault spec is perceived as a top end raid and pvp spec.

2. How do you perceive your own spec?
I think that assault spec is one of the most balanced specs. it requires you to work hard on your rotation for success.
Basileus Reges 80+ valor
670k+ Voidstar, 580k+ Huttball, 600k+ Civil War, 500k+ Novare Coast

Nyoro's Avatar

07.16.2012 , 01:17 PM | #17
Assault spec: At the moment this seems to be a very solid build with great sustained DPS thanks to DoTs and Armour ignore, although I'll admit that the damage can be extremely spikey thanks to HiB and AssaultPlastique.(which is fine by me, I love spikey builds.) Most of the talents are decent although the lower tier abilities seem to benefit AS exclusively which is boring for other specs.

Tactics: I don't really understand this build at all. I think it was supposed to be advertised as the meleeDPS build or a PvP build but using HE cell over Plasma cell just loses far too much DPS and the abilities are inferior than AS even for meleeDPS. This tree needs a serious rework in my opinion.

In closing I'd like to see Explosive Round worked into the Vanguards trees because it's a fun ability. A proc that made it free and off the globalcooldown would be great since it's a very weak ability that costs far too much ammo.
Triggerhappy - lvl50 Vanguard Tomb of Freedon Nadd R.I.P Trayus Academy
The Honkhonk Legacy
"I haven't enjoyed myself this much since the sacking of BioWare Austin!" -John Riccitiello

Samohnat's Avatar

07.16.2012 , 01:40 PM | #18
Okay, so a brief introduction: I'm playing vanguard since the beta. It's my main and always will be (I've many chars, but I decided to play vang long before beta). I'm playing all 3 specs and some hybrids. Currently somewhere near 1700r in RWZs, clearing EC HM weekly w/o wipes sometimes (playing Tank or DPS, whatever is needed).

My take on the trees
Shield Specialist and hybrids
  1. PvP - Very poor tank in the higher tier of games compared to the other tanks. Guardian has better cooldowns, AOE slow, and Guardian leap => hold outs longer when solo defending, better mobility, better protecting allies. Shadow has stealth and again - better cooldowns. The only area where Shield Specialist shines is dmg, his overall dmg is on a par with some DPS classes thanks to his AOEs (in damage gear). But then again, he'd better be off in a pure DMG build or a hybrid (31 or 23 points in tactics + ion cell).

    Sadly the trees are designed to not support hybrids, as they are very based on a specific cell. Tactics + ion cell works though - if you play it wise and use Battering Ram. This makes your damage output just slightly below pure DPS classes and grants you the guard ability, yet you miss the utility and survivability of other tanks (but full tank spec wouldn't help you with that anyway).

    Shield specialist is built heavy around the shield and absorb stats, which is a big mistake for PvP as they've much less use in it than in PvE.
  2. PvE - All fine there, I'm our healers favorite tank and never ever had a problem with tanking any boss. Probably the best tank to hold aggro of multipe mobs.
  1. PvP - Monstrous single target DPS that brings taunts and an aoe stun in addition to the awesome burst, everyone wants one or two.... or three on their team. May or may not do as much overall damage as a well played focus sent, still shines at killing single targets.
  2. PvE - Being the top DPS on most of the bosses, can dish out 1900 sustained DPS on an Operations dummy after mastering the rotation on a 5 minute window (this is for fully re-modded rank 146 gear). To be exact, it's more like 1750-2000 depending on the Ionic Accelerator procs and crits, very spiky DPS, still great overall and one has to be cautious with the procs and ammo.
  1. PvP - Great damage potential with much higher utility and mobility than Assault. The biggest problem of this spec is the lower burst in comparsion to Assault, which is the main thing why is a vanguard brought to a premade team. Situationally can be as good at overall DPS as an Assault, but will never reach such burst. Unlike Assault can be countered.
  2. PvE - I don't see much place for this spec in PvE. It's more mobile, right... but it's kind of useless as the mobility isn't a problem for a well played assault at all. The sustained DPS is about 10 to 15% lower than Assault. The only bright side is that it's more ammo friendly and as that, can be better for newer players.

Final thoughts:
  1. Assault plastique - please fix the tool-tip or make it do AOE damage. It confused every sinlge new vanguard I knew. Sticky grenade has the EXACTLY SAME TOOL-TIP as Assault Plastique. Sticky grenade does AOE damage, Assault plastique is single target only.
  2. Assault vs. Tactics - Tactics brings more utility and AOE damage potential, Assault is better at damage and burst (which is kind of the main thing). I suggest to build Tactics even more about the utility and AoE damage. Completely remove High Impact Bolt from the Tactics tree and build it around Explosive Round, that's very ammo-ineffective yet very underrated skill. With the proper talents it could be a very nice AoE damage/objective-interrupting/harassing/ranged ability to go on par with the utility of a Tactics vanguard.
  3. Assault vs. Tactics no. 2 - Assaults are gonna hate me for this, but switch Fire Pulse and Assault Plastique (make it an AOE!). It would lower the Assaults burst that is over-the-top, yet it wouldn't mess with their DPS (10m range for Vang, 30m for Commando to boost those poor guys).

1. How do you think your Vanguard spec is perceived by other classes? - Most people I know are thinking that the Assault spec is overpowered for PvP and they don't want to accept tactics as a worhty alternative.
2. How do you perceive your own spec? - I love all three specs but it's true that I feel like the worst PvP tank of those 3, guardian and shadow would be more useful any day. Great Tank/DPS hybrid though if Guard is the only thing your team needs. Tactics is a jack of all trades, master of none, still it has fine DPS and utility.

Grimoir's Avatar

07.16.2012 , 01:56 PM | #19
1. How do you think your Vanguard spec is perceived by other classes?
PvE: Starting to get more recognition in PvE for being viable thanks to the AC's mobility as a whole.
PvP: I currently run a hybrid spec that has slightly less burst than pure AS/Pyro. Other players see me as a threat and usually try to burst me down as fast as possible.

2. How do you perceive your own spec?
PvP: My hybrid build(seen in my signiture as Terminal Velocity) is super fast-paced and incredibly fun to play. I love running in and bursting almost as hard as an AS/Pyro while retaining incredible mobility thanks to Hold the Line and/or Hydraulic Overrides. Its great to watch turret classes waste their knock-backs as I pummel them in melee range.
~The Jykoor Legacy of The Bastion(PvP)~
Anasė - Terminal Velocity[Hybrid] Powertech - Level: 55
Jerīcho - Tactics Vanguard - Level: 55

CitizenFry's Avatar

07.16.2012 , 02:11 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by CommunitySupport View Post
1. How do you think your Vanguard spec is perceived by other classes?
2. How do you perceive your own spec?
Vanguard Tank, PVE.

1. People who've played with me or another well-geared Vanguard appreciate the fact that the Vanguard's health drops very steadily, as opposed to the spikier damage profile of the other two tanks. People who haven't often assume Vanguard tanks are just bad, because their dodge% is much lower, and they don't have any self-heal/bubble effects that other tanks do.

2. I think Vanguards are pretty great. I am a little frustrated with the layout of the skill tree though...there are many talents that feel like they do nothing for me, particularly after the 1.3 update (two free Explosive Surges per Storm? Meh). I would like it if there were more opportunities to fiddle with my ratio of offense to defense in my skill tree, right now it feels like the choices are very obvious. Soldier's Endurance is pretty awful, even if I am weighting almost entirely towards defense I still hate putting points into it. I understand it's pretty hard to get the balance on that correct though, particular for PVP vs PVE.

It feels like High Impact Bolt/Ion Cell was nerfed overall...while the "smart" splash damage is nice, it's still very not-smart in many situations (hits neutral scanner droids in Lost Island, and shield generators in Firebrand+Stormcaller fight of Explosive Conflict)

I wish the combat logs were a bit more verbose, particularly about incoming hits. I'd like to know how much damage was avoided from shielded attacks, or even what the unmitigated damage of the attacks was. I'd also like to know whether incoming attacks are melee/ranged/force/tech, in addition to energy/kinetic/internal/elemental.
Crafting on The Ebon Hawk. PST/mail: Blayze (rep) / K'ron (imp)
Armoring: Commando 26, Reflex 26; Barrel: Patron 26
Mod: Weighted 26+26B, Deflecting 26 Enhancement: Bulwark 26, Battle 26, Finesse 26
Ear: Black Hole Mender's MK-2 Relay