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Reasons Galen Marek is NOT a Gary Stu

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > STAR WARS Discussion
Reasons Galen Marek is NOT a Gary Stu

Captain_Zone's Avatar


Captain_Zone
06.29.2012 , 02:22 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by Liquidacid View Post
you don't have to read a book to endorse it... 99 percent of the "celebrities" who you see endorsing products have never ever used them... I'm sure he has someone read him the highlights /cliff notes tho... he's stolen enough stuff from the EU someones gotta be telling him what's in there if he doesn't read it... lol

besides SotE was different.. it wasn't even a book first... but he endorsed it because it was the first really large cross media project.. it had games, a book, comics, toys, etc...

but none of that matters because it was SW... technically Lucas endorses everything that is SW
First of all, George doesn't steal anything from the Expanded Universe. It's his automatically. He took what he wanted (Coruscant, Aayla Secura, the name "Mandarlorian", etc.) and left the rest. Remember, it's his IP. Everything published in his IP is his. Period.

And if Lucas endorsed everything that was SW, not just what HE wants to see in SW, then Cortosis vibroswords would still be able to stop a lightsaber, Wookiees would still be able to become Jedi, and the Original Jedi Code would still be part of C-Canon. He retcons anything he doesn't like.

It's like Leland Chee says in this quote:

Quote:
CHEE: "GL is certainly not bound by the EU, though he's certainly open to using things created in it (Aayla Secura and the Coruscant name, for example). On the other hand, the quote you provide makes it sound like the EU is separate from George's vision of the Star Wars universe. It is not. The EU must follow certain tenets set by George through the films and other guidelines that he provides outside of the films."
And this one:

Quote:
In a December 6, 2006 post, Chee suggests the existence of a second continuity composed only of the films:

The only relevant official continuities are the current versions of the films alone, and the combined current version of the films along with whatever else we've got in the Holocron. You're never going to know what George's view of the universe beyond the films at any given time because it is constantly evolving.
Note the highlighted part. He uses the term "evolving" as a euphamism for George contradicting himself. He might approve something one day, then retcon it the next.

It's basically one huge mess when George gets involved. He says "Luke, Leia, and Han can't die!", so the ExU authors make them so OP or lucky that they literally can't be beaten. That, in turn pisses off the fans that are like "Seriously??? Since when can Luke do THAT???" Oh, and when George said "Only a lightsaber can stop a lightsaber", that retconned anything being lightsaber proof or resistant. That's how I see it, anyhow.
. OPOD
The New Jedi Code: "Keep Calm & Carry a Lightsaber"

Liquidacid's Avatar


Liquidacid
06.29.2012 , 02:29 PM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by Captain_Zone View Post
First of all, George doesn't steal anything from the Expanded Universe. It's his automatically. He took what he wanted (Coruscant, Aayla Secura, the name "Mandarlorian", etc.) and left the rest. Remember, it's his IP. Everything published in his IP is his. Period.

And if Lucas endorsed everything that was SW, not just what HE wants to see in SW, then Cortosis vibroswords would still be able to stop a lightsaber, Wookiees would still be able to become Jedi, and the Original Jedi Code would still be part of C-Canon. He retcons anything he doesn't like.

It's like Leland Chee says in this quote:



And this one:



Note the highlighted part. He uses the term "evolving" as a euphamism for George contradicting himself. He might approve something one day, then retcon it the next.

It's basically one huge mess when George gets involved. He says "Luke, Leia, and Han can't die!", so the ExU authors make them so OP or lucky that they literally can't be beaten. That, in turn pisses off the fans that are like "Seriously??? Since when can Luke do THAT???" Oh, and when George said "Only a lightsaber can stop a lightsaber", that retconned anything being lightsaber proof or resistant. That's how I see it, anyhow.
meh the newer outweighs the older.. and since lightsabers can still be stopped in games and novels since he said that and it was then approved by LL the people he has in charge of lore right now lightsaber resistant metals are still lore,,, not that it matter because again commentary and interviews are not canon by Lucas own canon rules so it really doesn't matter since not only has none of his published works said "only a lightsaber can stop a lightsaber" but he's shown other things stopping lightsabers in his own movies and series (droids shields and such)...

again there is a reason why the canon rules specifically don't include commentary, interviews and off hand remarks in the list of what is lore

again at the end of the day GL does own it all and could burn it all down if he so chose... but he hasn't... in fact he has retired and left everything in the hands it's been in
"bibo ergo sum" ( I drink, therefore I am)

Teamwork is essential; it gives the enemy other people to shoot at.

Captain_Zone's Avatar


Captain_Zone
06.29.2012 , 02:33 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by Liquidacid View Post
meh the newer outweighs the older.. and since lightsabers can still be stopped in games and novels since he said that and it was then approved by LL the people he has in charge of lore right now lightsaber resistant metals are still lore,,, not that it matter because again commentary and interviews are not canon by Lucas own canon rules so it really doesn't matter since not only has none of his published works said "only a lightsaber can stop a lightsaber" but he's shown other things stopping lightsabers in his own movies and series (droids shields and such)...

again there is a reason why the canon rules specifically don't include commentary, interviews and off hand remarks in the list of what is lore
Game mechanics are not, nor have they ever been Canon.

And WHERE does it say he retconned it yet it still happens? The ONLY C-Canon overrides to G-Canon are Boba Fett's continued survival in post-RotJ, and Lowbacca being the last remaining Wookiee Jedi. If it's still happening in novels and/or comics, it's N-Canon.
. OPOD
The New Jedi Code: "Keep Calm & Carry a Lightsaber"

Liquidacid's Avatar


Liquidacid
06.29.2012 , 02:37 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Captain_Zone View Post
Game mechanics are not, nor have they ever been Canon.

And WHERE does it say he retconned it yet it still happens? The ONLY C-Canon overrides to G-Canon are Boba Fett's continued survival in post-RotJ, and Lowbacca being the last remaining Wookiee Jedi. If it's still happening in novels and/or comics, it's N-Canon.
no it's not...

"C-canon is Continuity Canon, consisting of all recent works (and many older works) released under the name of Star Wars: books, comics, games, cartoons, non-theatrical films, and more. Games are a special case, as generally only the stories are C-canon, while things like stats and gameplay may not be;[7] they also offer non-canonical options to the player, such as choosing female gender for a canonically male character. C-canon elements have been known to appear in the movies, thus making them G-canon; examples include the name "Coruscant," swoop bikes, Quinlan Vos, Aayla Secura, YT-2400 freighters and Action VI transports."

"when asked if the G and C-levels formed separate and independent canon, Leland Chee responded by stating that both were part of a single canon:

"There is one overall continuity.""

C and G canon is THE SAME until something is moved to N-canon which has hardly ever happened ... C canon CAN NOT override G canon ever... unless the G canon is moved to N canon it takes presidence and the contradictory C canon becomes N canon.... this didn't happen to Boba Fett's death because the G cannon and C cannon DON"T CONTRADICT... all new books published are canon they have to follow the rules and are checked before they are published... and guess what the LotF published THIS YEAR has Beskar in it... so it passed LL as still being canon

honestly if you can read the canon rules, which are very clear and simple, and still not figure it out properly it's a waste of time to even try because you either can't understand or are purposely misunderstanding
"bibo ergo sum" ( I drink, therefore I am)

Teamwork is essential; it gives the enemy other people to shoot at.

Captain_Zone's Avatar


Captain_Zone
06.29.2012 , 02:52 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Liquidacid View Post
no it's not...

"C-canon is Continuity Canon, consisting of all recent works (and many older works) released under the name of Star Wars: books, comics, games, cartoons, non-theatrical films, and more. Games are a special case, as generally only the stories are C-canon, while things like stats and gameplay may not be;[7] they also offer non-canonical options to the player, such as choosing female gender for a canonically male character. C-canon elements have been known to appear in the movies, thus making them G-canon; examples include the name "Coruscant," swoop bikes, Quinlan Vos, Aayla Secura, YT-2400 freighters and Action VI transports."

"when asked if the G and C-levels formed separate and independent canon, Leland Chee responded by stating that both were part of a single canon:

"There is one overall continuity.""

C and G canon is THE SAME until something is moved to N-canon which has hardly ever happened ... C canon CAN NOT override G canon ever... unless the G canon is moved to N canon it takes presidence and the contradictory C canon becomes N canon.... all new books published are canon they have to follow the rules and are checked before they are published... and guess what the LotF published THIS YEAR has Beskar in it... so it passed LL as still being canon

honestly if you can read the canon rules, which are very clear and simple, and still not figure it out properly it's a waste of time to even try because you either can't understand or are purposely misunderstanding
And here are the statements from Chee posted AFTER his "single continuity" flub.

Quote:
In a December 6, 2006 post, Chee suggests the existence of a second continuity composed only of the films:

The only relevant official continuities are the current versions of the films alone, and the combined current version of the films along with whatever else we've got in the Holocron. You're never going to know what George's view of the universe beyond the films at any given time because it is constantly evolving.[9]

On a post made on the same day, Chee stated that:

Anything not in the current version of the films is irrelevant to Film only continuity.[10]
Which was a response by Chee when he realized he had contradicted his boss:

Quote:
In July 2001, Lucas gave his opinion on the matter of what is canon in Star Wars during an interview with Cinescape magazine:

“There are two worlds here," explained Lucas. "There’s my world, which is the movies, and there’s this other world that has been created, which I say is the parallel universe—the licensing world of the books, games and comic books. They don’t intrude on my world, which is a select period of time, [but] they do intrude in between the movies. I don’t get too involved in the parallel universe.
. OPOD
The New Jedi Code: "Keep Calm & Carry a Lightsaber"

Liquidacid's Avatar


Liquidacid
06.29.2012 , 02:54 PM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Captain_Zone View Post
And here are the statements from Chee posted AFTER his "single continuity" flub.



Which was a response by Chee when he realized he had contradicted his boss:
you do understand when he says "whatever else we've got in the Holocron" that the holocron included every single piece of SW media published that isn't N canon? the Holocron has in it all G, T, C and S canon listed... it's a source of what is and isn't canon made to use for reference material to SW media writers and creators

not to mention that random babbling by Lucas would make the entire canon system invalid all arguments are moot... it's one of the reasons he stepped back and put LL solely in charge of canon

your taking them all out of context.. Lucas personally follows a "film only" continuity because he has said he simply can't keep up with everything else... while LL who is in charge of canon follows the "film + EU" continuity that is used for licensed products because while Lucas doesn't have to do anything but work on the films he keeps "remastering" they have to deal with the entire franchise

you can't pick and choose EU... you either go Film ONLY in which case not a single one of your arguments have mattered because nothing but the movies are relevant... or you go with LL's film+EU canon... in which case your arguments are just wrong because you seem to not want to follow their canon rules
"bibo ergo sum" ( I drink, therefore I am)

Teamwork is essential; it gives the enemy other people to shoot at.

Captain_Zone's Avatar


Captain_Zone
06.29.2012 , 03:10 PM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by Liquidacid View Post
you do understand when he says "whatever else we've got in the Holocron" that the holocron included every single piece of SW media published that isn't N canon?

not to mention that random babbling by Lucas would make the entire canon system invalid all arguments are moot... it's one of the reasons he stepped back and put LL solely in charge of canon

your taking them all out of context.. Lucas personally follows a "film only" continuity because he has said he simply can't keep up with everything else... while LL who is in charge of canon follows the "film + EU" continuity that is used for licensed products.
No. George still controls G and T. Chee is in charge of C, S, and the N-Canon "Infinities" series.

The thing is, C is overriden by G and/or T when they say something different. Some things that were once N-Canon in conjunction with something else were then placed in S-Canon and/or C-Canon in the case of Boba Fett's alias. Also, the backstory that was originally supposed to belong to Fett was applied to the actual character of Jaster Mereel when he was created, and he was placed back into C-Canon as an actual character.

Vibroswords blocking lightsabers is now in the realm of N-Canon game mechanics.

So "literal meaning" is taking those quotes and rules out of context, now? How so? If you're interpreting George's and Leland's quotes to mean something other than they are, or you're interpreting the rules of Canon to mean something other than they are, then I suggest you stop trying to interpret them. They say what they say. They mean what they mean. Simple as that. lol
. OPOD
The New Jedi Code: "Keep Calm & Carry a Lightsaber"

Liquidacid's Avatar


Liquidacid
06.29.2012 , 03:19 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Captain_Zone View Post
No. George still controls G and T. Chee is in charge of C, S, and the N-Canon "Infinities" series.

The thing is, C is overriden by G and/or T when they say something different. Some things that were once N-Canon in conjunction with something else were then placed in S-Canon and/or C-Canon in the case of Boba Fett's alias. Also, the backstory that was originally supposed to belong to Fett was applied to the actual character of Jaster Mereel when he was created, and he was placed back into C-Canon as an actual character.

Vibroswords blocking lightsabers is now in the realm of N-Canon game mechanics.

So "literal meaning" is taking those quotes and rules out of context, now? How so? If you're interpreting George's and Leland's quotes to mean something other than they are, or you're interpreting the rules of Canon to mean something other than they are, then I suggest you stop trying to interpret them. They say what they say. They mean what they mean. Simple as that. lol
ah i'm gonna drop it since I assume you have read the canon rules you keep copy and pasting but still don't seem to grasp them at all... have fun with your personal SW canon tho
"bibo ergo sum" ( I drink, therefore I am)

Teamwork is essential; it gives the enemy other people to shoot at.

Captain_Zone's Avatar


Captain_Zone
06.29.2012 , 03:30 PM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by Liquidacid View Post
ah i'm gonna drop it since I assume you have read the canon rules you keep copy and pasting but still don't seem to grasp them at all... have fun with your personal SW canon tho
Definitely a wise move, running when you can't prove your point or explain how your interpretation of Canon is anywhere near what's written. Well, you have fun with your head canon that says the rules have way more meaning than they really do. Fly safe. lol
. OPOD
The New Jedi Code: "Keep Calm & Carry a Lightsaber"

Wolfninjajedi's Avatar


Wolfninjajedi
06.29.2012 , 03:36 PM | #20
Galen isn't even overpowered much less a Gary Su, but ya know people just love to go off of game mechanics as actual canon. But then again, in SW theres a number of things people have taken the wrong way.
"There is one lesson you've yet to learn. How to become one with the Force!"
―Cin Drallig to Darth Vader

Maucs the Tauntaun King, former SWG player.