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Is Telekinetics DPS a "smart player" build?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Sage / Sorcerer
Is Telekinetics DPS a "smart player" build?

pureeffinmetal's Avatar


pureeffinmetal
06.18.2012 , 03:33 AM | #11
Quote:
For DoTs force management shouldn't be a problem running balance/madness. If' you're talking Toth and Zorn I'd worry if you were in a group where the dps was so low that you actually needed to keep DoTs on both bosses as that encounter is really just a gear check in HM and in story mode even easier. For Balance due to the longer DoTs you end up overlapping on them no matter what you do.
Single target DoTs are not a problem. Multi-target they are. Seeing as Toth and Zorn also cleanse themselves when they jump - this is even more force intensive on a Madness/Balance specc.

Its not about needing to DoT the other mob to help the group beat enrage. Its about maximizing your own DPS. Otherwise why are we having a discussion?

Quote:
There aren't really many occasions where you actually need to multi-spam force quake. On Kephess for example in a reasonably geared group the other dps, e.g. gunslinger/commando, uses their AoE on the mob packs at the same time so hard to imagine you'd ever need to do more than 1 FiB followed by 1 force quake per pack. Most of Kephess is single target, so by your logic hybrid/balance works out best for most of it.
Gunslinger and Commando's major AoE abilities have 1 minute CDs and therefore they are of minimal help quite frankly. Furthermore not every raid group has a Gunslinger/Commando. We usually do of course (16m guild) but I've also done it on 8 with 2 Marauder and an Assassin. I was the ONLY one capable of putting down some AoE. If this is the case for any Sage or Sorc, then speccing TK/Lightning will be a benefit to the group. They are the kings of AoE.

Furthermore, most of Kephess is NOT single target. Immediately on the pull there is 3 mobs. Followed by a small burn phase (Balance is terrible burst damage). This is follow by an AoE phase, another burn phase and phase with 2 Mobs. Only after the last burn phase does the fight become single target.

Quote:
There isn't that much AoE needed in any Ops, either EV, EC, or KP. That's why they are all a bit similar in a way, on three bosses you need to cast the occasional AoE, but there isn't a really intensive AoE encounter so not critical to have AoE build. Balance does just fine having to put up the odd force quake over a boss encounter.

I have to write that to be honest with you once you get to mainly BH/campaign level gear any Sage build will work out alright in EC
Its true AoE is only useful for 5/14 fights in game at the moment. That still doesn't mean its not a strength of a TK Sage.

I have full Campaign Gear and am mostly BiS. I know what each specc is capable of and how to play each specc competitively.

And I'm not saying any specc isn't viable. I'm just arguing TK/Lightning is the best. If you prefer another, by all means play it.
Fallschirmjager
Lightning Sorcerer
<Rapture>
The Shadowlands (Formerly Shadow Hand)

eventidephoenix's Avatar


eventidephoenix
06.18.2012 , 10:42 AM | #12
heh who says TK sages cannot excel in single target bosses... several times I pull aggro especially with mental alacrity and force potency switched on...

All 3 specs are viable, we are definitely not saying that Balance/Hybrid sucks. Or isn't viable for EC. Just that for EC, TKs have an advantage that Balance/Hybrids dont -> Much more efficient AOEs.

elvavwiel's Avatar


elvavwiel
06.18.2012 , 04:03 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by eventidephoenix View Post
heh who says TK sages cannot excel in single target bosses... several times I pull aggro especially with mental alacrity and force potency switched on...

All 3 specs are viable, we are definitely not saying that Balance/Hybrid sucks. Or isn't viable for EC. Just that for EC, TKs have an advantage that Balance/Hybrids dont -> Much more efficient AOEs.
I still don't see where you base the 'much more efficient' aoe's part on. 3vs5 is hardly a big difference in packs of 10+, not to mention that other classes their aoe's are a lot more damaging in the same timespan as our force quake.

The fact that you manage to pull aggro from everyone else in the group might mean that your group/tank isn't doing their job properly.
Isra ~ 55 Sage: Jack of all trades, master of none.

Ewgal's Avatar


Ewgal
06.19.2012 , 05:29 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by pureeffinmetal View Post
Single target DoTs are not a problem. Multi-target they are. Seeing as Toth and Zorn also cleanse themselves when they jump - this is even more force intensive on a Madness/Balance specc.
Not certain what madness/balance build you're playing , but if you are gooing OOF casting DoTs in an Ops operation you're playing the spec wrong. As for Toth and Zorn many will end up casting DoTs on the targets as they are being exchanged by the Tanks after they jump...

Quote: Originally Posted by pureeffinmetal View Post
Gunslinger and Commando's major AoE abilities have 1 minute CDs and therefore they are of minimal help quite frankly.
Comando and Gunslinger both have more than one AoE...

Quote: Originally Posted by pureeffinmetal View Post
Furthermore, most of Kephess is NOT single target. Immediately on the pull there is 3 mobs. Followed by a small burn phase (Balance is terrible burst damage). This is follow by an AoE phase, another burn phase and phase with 2 Mobs. Only after the last burn phase does the fight become single target.
The majority of the fight is single target. The AoE phase isn't very intesive for Balance or Hybrid specs, they just cast Force quake.


Quote: Originally Posted by pureeffinmetal View Post
And I'm not saying any specc isn't viable. I'm just arguing TK/Lightning is the best. If you prefer another, by all means play it.
I'd say about equal with hybrid or balance in Ops, in PvP it isn't viable.
May the farce be with you

pureeffinmetal's Avatar


pureeffinmetal
06.19.2012 , 10:11 PM | #15
I free for each of your latest responses you didn't read clearly what I wrote or didn't understand it. So its hard for me to make a response.

And TK is fine for PVP. Ironic that most people play Balance, but a Balance Sage is probably one of the easiest match ups for a TK Sage. To each his own.

But anyways, I've stated my opinions, you've stated yours. OP can do as he likes.
Fallschirmjager
Lightning Sorcerer
<Rapture>
The Shadowlands (Formerly Shadow Hand)

Ewgal's Avatar


Ewgal
06.20.2012 , 12:34 AM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by pureeffinmetal View Post

And TK is fine for PVP. Ironic that most people play Balance, but a Balance Sage is probably one of the easiest match ups for a TK Sage. To each his own.
If 4 of your rotation have significant activation times good luck getting all that down in PvP on a target without them moving or simply interrupting or cc ing you. In most competitive PvP matches I have seen lightning/TK sages mainly ending up spamming TK throw...that's why some people consider Powertech/Vanguard dps build OP, their rotations are instant cast. In PvP the Balance/Madness rotation is instant outside of TK Throw, so it means we can get most of it off without having to stand still for 10 seconds or so to complete a dps rotation cycle.
May the farce be with you

eventidephoenix's Avatar


eventidephoenix
06.20.2012 , 06:28 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by elvavwiel View Post
I still don't see where you base the 'much more efficient' aoe's part on. 3vs5 is hardly a big difference in packs of 10+, not to mention that other classes their aoe's are a lot more damaging in the same timespan as our force quake.

The fact that you manage to pull aggro from everyone else in the group might mean that your group/tank isn't doing their job properly.
it's completely up to your playstyle as purefin has more or less mentioned. You think it's not so efficient? Spec balance. You think it's more efficient? Spec TK.

If your group is comfortable with you using balance? go ahead. They're not? Spec TK.

And no, we do parse our damage and I do come out top or amongst the top in raids. So save your condescending tone for elsewhere. My tank knows when and how to pull aggro back, and communication makes it possible so that even when I pull aggro it will not become a problem. I'm just trying to show that TK spec is a very viable PvE spec.

Skaol-dirtyd's Avatar


Skaol-dirtyd
06.20.2012 , 08:54 AM | #18
I still prefer a 0/20/21 hybrid build, at least for PVP purposes. I feel it gives me the most utility... I use it in PVE as well all though I will admit I have not ran an operation yet just HM FP and it holds up fine there also.

I will agree it is an easy rotation though.....
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