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Same gender relationships clarifications?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Story and Lore
Same gender relationships clarifications?
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Nozybidaj's Avatar


Nozybidaj
12.02.2012 , 05:59 PM | #3501
Quote: Originally Posted by Zandilar View Post
Just had a quick glance through the Vette 101, and noticed that again in the romance section - while the big picture is a male Sith and Vette, the text is gender-neutral (deliberately so).
Meh, BW can pretend to be inclusive all they want, until they actually are inclusive though its just words that don't mean anything. /shrug If the furthest BW is willing to go is use gender neutral pronouns in some companion mock up blog instead of actually addressing the concerns of the community and actually giving us the content in the game I'm not terribly impressed.

MetalGenocide's Avatar


MetalGenocide
12.02.2012 , 06:11 PM | #3502
Quote: Originally Posted by Zandilar View Post
Just had a quick glance through the Vette 101, and noticed that again in the romance section - while the big picture is a male Sith and Vette, the text is gender-neutral (deliberately so).
A lot of people have said they wouldn't mind just switching the lines round.
like when you do a model switch in mass effect (fem shep on ashley <3 )
Using 'Go-fast' stickers on my Lightsaber's increased my Alacrity Rating by point oh-oh-oh-oh eight percent!

Samy_Merchi's Avatar


Samy_Merchi
12.02.2012 , 06:22 PM | #3503
I don't think the point was that Bioware is trying to portray itself as being gay-friendly with that Vette gender neutrality.

I think the point was more that they are writing their material in such a way that they won't have to go back and change them if gay is implemented. Which gives some hope that it's still being planned. If, internally, gay was thrown out for sure, then they wouldn't bother with gender-neutrality in the articles.

fabiyun's Avatar


fabiyun
12.02.2012 , 06:33 PM | #3504
Quote: Originally Posted by Samy_Merchi View Post
I don't think the point was that Bioware is trying to portray itself as being gay-friendly with that Vette gender neutrality.

I think the point was more that they are writing their material in such a way that they won't have to go back and change them if gay is implemented. Which gives some hope that it's still being planned. If, internally, gay was thrown out for sure, then they wouldn't bother with gender-neutrality in the articles.
That would imply that BW would rewrite dialogue for current companions. Which wouldn't make that much sense. I think this has nothing to do with SGRs at all. It's just as likely a smart intern ghost wrote that text. With stupidity things like asking about favourite romances on FB, printing stories about SWTORs inclusiveness, "no gays in Star Wars" laughs, this all sounds way too smart for the BW Austin we know.
"..the worst kind of DARTH one can dig up!"

Samy_Merchi's Avatar


Samy_Merchi
12.02.2012 , 06:35 PM | #3505
Quote: Originally Posted by fabiyun View Post
That would imply that BW would rewrite dialogue for current companions. Which wouldn't make that much sense.
I don't quite get what you're saying here. Why would it imply that, and why wouldn't it make sense?

Palar's Avatar


Palar
12.02.2012 , 06:43 PM | #3506
Quote: Originally Posted by Samy_Merchi View Post
I don't think the point was that Bioware is trying to portray itself as being gay-friendly with that Vette gender neutrality.

I think the point was more that they are writing their material in such a way that they won't have to go back and change them if gay is implemented. Which gives some hope that it's still being planned. If, internally, gay was thrown out for sure, then they wouldn't bother with gender-neutrality in the articles.
The Kaliyo one got some heat, so they're probably just playing it neutral to skip a repeat.

fabiyun's Avatar


fabiyun
12.02.2012 , 06:45 PM | #3507
Quote: Originally Posted by Samy_Merchi View Post
I don't quite get what you're saying here. Why would it imply that, and why wouldn't it make sense?
There's no reason why they wouldn't gender these romances now, they're (if not rewritten) heterosexuals romances.

Rewriting existing content is a not an investment, but rather putting down money for something that already exists. I've voiced my views on this before, I think it's unlikely that they'd rewrite anything. It makes more business sense to spend the money on new companions and game options and additions. If they rewrite then for most of the player base there would not be any noticeable content changes. If they add now companions, everyone would have a new companion, and for us there'd be a new romance option. Everyone gets new content that way. They need to hire writers, voice actors and put animators at work for whichever option they go for. But one way leads to no new addition for the majority of the player base, and the other leads to something new for everyone. Whether they SGR or not, a new companion is a new character with its own personality and quirks for all. Cost effectiveness is much higher with the new companion option.

Addit:
But about the gendering, I don't get it. Okay she writes (it's written by a woman) "the Warrior". But you could also insert "the Soldier" or "The/Our Hero" and isn't that what we hear in pop culture all the time. I don't see this as an example of feminism or gender neutrality. In fact it kind of puts males on a pedestal, it's still so much implied also visually that this is a story about males.
"..the worst kind of DARTH one can dig up!"

fabiyun's Avatar


fabiyun
12.02.2012 , 07:09 PM | #3508
Our current predicament has a history. A history on the old forums. A history of inappropriate developer behaviour. A history of a quick statement. And silence.
Meanwhile both EA and BW like to parade around with an image of being so inclusive and caring about LGBTQ interests.
Yet constant excuses are made for them. It takes time. It costs money. They might mean with writing so and so that perhaps we can have hope that something may come. Nothing is achieved with being loud. Etc etc.
But really. If some party wants to take credit for being inclusive. When a party makes promises. When a party can address every other game part. Then they can address SGRs.
And BW Austin's track record is simply plain bad. They've had a year since their quick statement. They had had the entire time of the old forums to take notice of our interests. They've had plenty of questions come in from us through every available contact line. And they have done nothing but ignore us.
I think that speaks for itself.
"..the worst kind of DARTH one can dig up!"

natashina's Avatar


natashina
12.02.2012 , 07:36 PM | #3509
Quote: Originally Posted by fabiyun View Post
Thanks amnie . Every angle would be great!
Allies are especially needed. Unfortunately it is still common that without the approval of others, a minority's interests are often not perceived as valid. We still need validation from people outside our group.
I don't think we need validation from another group. At all. Especially from GLAAD; we are that group. We are a representation of the LGBT gamer community.

All it'll take is the playerbase to do something. We stepping out of the little box we've been placed in. I really feel writing to GLAAD is going to bear far more fruit than waiting for someone else to say it's okay to speak up.

I'm not going to sit back and wait for someone else to validate me. I'd rather do it myself and the only way to do it is to get my voice out there.

Throughout the history of the LGBT community, we've had to stand on our own two feet. When other people felt our existence was invalid, the ones that came before us took it upon themselves to say something.

No one is going to stand up for us or validate us. We have to do it for ourselves. Writing to GLAAD is the best course of action. I don't want to just let my hope die in the forums with a whimper. I'm gonna go down swinging if that's what it takes.

Edit: Doup is a genus, I swear. He suggested writing to Dan Savage. Dan Savage, for those of you that don't know, is a syndicated columnist that's gay and VERY pro-LGBT rights. He does get national attention with some of his articles, so this is another direction. If we more outside support, than that is it.

Kioma's Avatar


Kioma
12.02.2012 , 07:48 PM | #3510
Quote: Originally Posted by natashina View Post
Edit: Doup is a genus, I swear. He suggested writing to Dan Savage. Dan Savage, for those of you that don't know, is a syndicated columnist that's gay and VERY pro-LGBT rights. He does get national attention with some of his articles, so this is another direction. If we more outside support, than that is it.
Writing to Dan Savage has been suggested before, though I forget who by. I also forget why it didn't come to pass.
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