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Iíve finally figured out what frustrates me about SWTOR. (It isn't that story driven)

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Story and Lore
Iíve finally figured out what frustrates me about SWTOR. (It isn't that story driven)

dalekjs's Avatar


dalekjs
05.31.2012 , 10:01 AM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by irishfino View Post
I had a debate with someone in my guild over #1. My point was yours: this doesn't feel like an MMO. It's me doing my story and a whole bunch of other people doing the same/similar in the same space. We went back and forth for a bit before I realized I was getting no where and went to solo low level flashpoints because I have nothing else to do.
This is true! How the game's focus is on the character quests is the issue I think. This decision by itself kills groups by story. It's never "the sith warrior and his ragtag guild do the impossible." It's "the sith warrior does the impossible alone by himself." Most of the people I talk to treat the class quest as a solo campaign basically, which is a shame considering that it's the main focus of the story.

Had they made the planetary stories and the main plot of the universe the central themes that drive it, I think it would have given better incentive to group. It makes more sense, and is more fun, to group up for the Tatooine tresure hunt, for example, rather than group up to do someone's class quest which you have no part of whatsoever.

Maaruin's Avatar


Maaruin
05.31.2012 , 10:02 AM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by dalekjs View Post
That's true. My point however is that they should have focused on the story at large instead of the character story. There should have been more Tatooine's imo, and that should have been their focus. I'm not saying that there should be life altering decisions like the Alderaan point you make, for instance, but that the main story that drives everything shouldn't be your character story, but the planetary story and the story of the universe at large.
But why would a smuggler have the same story like a trooper? In Kotor you were a Jedi and that determined the story. I this game you can be an agent instead. If the planetary story would be the main story of the game, you probably wouldn't feel like an agent.
"I was one of many. We were servants of the dark sideÖ Sith Lords, we called ourselves. So proud. In the end we were not so proud. We hidÖ hid from those we had betrayed. We fellÖ and I knew it would be so."
-Ajunta Pall

dalekjs's Avatar


dalekjs
05.31.2012 , 10:07 AM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by Maaruin View Post
But why would a smuggler have the same story like a trooper? In Kotor you were a Jedi and that determined the story. I this game you can be an agent instead. If the planetary story would be the main story of the game, you probably wouldn't feel like an agent.
I'm not saying that they remove the class quests outright. I think they should have made the planetary quests the focus, with the class quests as a coming of age sort of thing. I'd probably still feel like an agent, because the agent has a different class mechanic and feel than, say, a warrior.

The character driven story worked with Kotor because it was a single player game. You were the only one there, so it catered to you and you alone. Here, however, you're playing with many other people, and the main story should accommodate everyone, so having the character driven story be the focus makes little sense in this context.

Dezzi's Avatar


Dezzi
05.31.2012 , 10:09 AM | #14
Great insights, OP. I agree with just about everything you've said over the last two pages.
Ebon Hawk (RP)
Peace | Knowledge | Serenity | the Force
I'm a Jedi because the galaxy needs Jedi.

dalekjs's Avatar


dalekjs
05.31.2012 , 10:12 AM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Dezzi View Post
Great insights, OP. I agree with just about everything you've said over the last two pages.
Why thank you! I'm glad you share my opinions.

Verce's Avatar


Verce
05.31.2012 , 10:18 AM | #16
They took a huge undertaking and imo were mostly successful. It's true that the writing and execution of some stories isn't as good as others, but It's also unreasonable to expect that all stories would be at the same level.
What can change the nature of a man?

dalekjs's Avatar


dalekjs
05.31.2012 , 10:22 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by Verce View Post
They took a huge undertaking and imo were mostly successful. It's true that the writing and execution of some stories isn't as good as others, but It's also unreasonable to expect that all stories would be at the same level.
Why is it unreasonable? Isn't it their job? I think it's completely reasonable to expect them to be good at it, especially when you consider that this game has the larges budget of any video game, ever.

Had it been like other mmo's with the focus not on the story, then I would have agreed with you. But considering that the main selling point of SWTOR is the story, having most of them being badly written is a pretty bad deal.

trussasp's Avatar


trussasp
05.31.2012 , 10:32 AM | #18
HI Dalekjs:

I want you to know that I basically agree with you with your "story not so great: comments.


The thing is, the people who left, and who are leaving, are NOT leaving for that reason.


They're leaving because this game doesn't function so well as a repeatable MMO.
Economy, end game content, open world PvP, etc. etc., blah blah blah...


Even if they had written the most awesome STORY you could imagine, would that keep you playing this (supposed) MMO for a year?


In my humble opinion, they should have focused even less on story, and made this a more "sticky" repeatable MMO.


My evidence? The comments you surely see every time you run an instance. (more spacebar plz, etc.)


Sadly, the game doesn't really work as a great story-driven single player game, and it DEFINITELY doesn't work as a true MMO.



TLDR.... I agree with you, but that is not why SWTOR is circling the drain right now.

Monoth's Avatar


Monoth
05.31.2012 , 10:32 AM | #19
As for the stories I think a lot of you guys forget these class stories will continue with expansion packs.... The only criticism I might make was there should be at least two completely different endings of the class quest, I know that makes it harder for them with the next expansion pack as they have to continue both endings and eventually you end up with a lot of different paths in the story, but if they wanted to do it right thats how they should of done it. By making all the choices feel pointless and removing the consequences system they had with companions based on the choices you made in game it really made the story component feel bland.

As for the general MMO, yes they needed to make less linear content and make some dynamic stuff, Dailies should of been based around Public Quests (IE: Guild Wars 2, Warhammer Online, Rift) and not around linear quests that you would want to rip your skull out after doing a gazillion times..... To me this is where they blew it with end content for PvE.... as for PvP they just need end game content period... right now they have nothing and its causing a lot of people to leave..
F2P is like driving on a long stretch of highway with toll booths every 1/2 mile

dalekjs's Avatar


dalekjs
05.31.2012 , 10:45 AM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by trussasp View Post
HI Dalekjs:

I want you to know that I basically agree with you with your "story not so great: comments.


The thing is, the people who left, and who are leaving, are NOT leaving for that reason.


They're leaving because this game doesn't function so well as a repeatable MMO.
Economy, end game content, open world PvP, etc. etc., blah blah blah...


Even if they had written the most awesome STORY you could imagine, would that keep you playing this (supposed) MMO for a year?


In my humble opinion, they should have focused even less on story, and made this a more "sticky" repeatable MMO.


My evidence? The comments you surely see every time you run an instance. (more spacebar plz, etc.)


Sadly, the game doesn't really work as a great story-driven single player game, and it DEFINITELY doesn't work as a true MMO.



TLDR.... I agree with you, but that is not why SWTOR is circling the drain right now.
Hello!

Oh I agree that this isn't why people are leaving. I wrote in the beginning that I was not going to talk about all the issues with pvp and end game all everything. The point of my thread was, for a game that's this massively story driven, it really isn't, and the stories themselves are spread around, cluttered, and poorly written.

I disagree about needing less story however. I stated that I think they should make the planetary stories the main ones and condense them, so that all the quests on a planet are related to the main one. For example, Tatooine. The main quest is the tresure hunt. They should have made that the focus, and get rid of the random grindy quests and make them in line with the story. For example, rather than go kill the Exchange thugs quests ( I think there were like 3 of these to be honest), something that related to the plot would have made much more sense with what the game is trying to accomplish. Like, escort the expedition team through the desert, or collect source materials.

Sure these can and will be somewhat grindy, but they're intertwined with the main story instead of being completely random quests that have nothing to do with anything.

Also, I think that the reason people space bar is because, literally, the only story driven flashpoint they can run is the esseles/black talon, and they are one of the very few ways to farm social points. Had other flashpoints had actual plots, I think this would be less of an issue, yet still an issue, understandably.

Again, I agree that there are much bigger problems with gameplay, but my point was that this game doesn't do a very good job with it's supposed main draw.

Quote: Originally Posted by Monoth View Post
As for the stories I think a lot of you guys forget these class stories will continue with expansion packs.... The only criticism I might make was there should be at least two completely different endings of the class quest, I know that makes it harder for them with the next expansion pack as they have to continue both endings and eventually you end up with a lot of different paths in the story, but if they wanted to do it right thats how they should of done it. By making all the choices feel pointless and removing the consequences system they had with companions based on the choices you made in game it really made the story component feel bland.

As for the general MMO, yes they needed to make less linear content and make some dynamic stuff, Dailies should of been based around Public Quests (IE: Guild Wars 2, Warhammer Online, Rift) and not around linear quests that you would want to rip your skull out after doing a gazillion times..... To me this is where they blew it with end content for PvE.... as for PvP they just need end game content period... right now they have nothing and its causing a lot of people to leave..
I agree with the first point partly, but I don't think that having the stories expanded by expansions would have any effect on how they are viewed now. I think most are poorly written in general, as well as the whole bland feeling you get as you said, but I don't think that adding to an already broken story can 'fix' it. They'll add to it and hopefully the added parts will be better, but that doesn't change that the fundamental basics of the story, from levels 1-50, are still bad.

As for the second, I agreed completely. When I saw the GW2 dynamic quest system, my immediate thought was this should have been what SWTOR was like!