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What is the gear req for denova?


pureeffinmetal's Avatar


pureeffinmetal
05.28.2012 , 11:58 AM | #21
I really don't see why people keep missing this point.

Stock Columi Gear > Stock Rakata Gear.

The enhancements on Rakata gear are BAD. If your guilds are as casual as you say they are, they problably haven't spent the time farming EV and KP over and over to replace all their Rakata gear.

Rakata does not become more powerful until its reitemized

Also. To the above poster above me. You yourself said you had an average player in your raid. If you bring less skilled DPS into your raids, of course your going to need more gear.

The OP didn't say how skilled he or his team is. And none of us have anyway of judging that. That being said, assuming he has a skilled raid group, the minimum can be done in Columi.

Baradium Bombers have 104k HP on 8m normal. You have 20s to kill it. This means If you only have your 4 DPS members attacking the Bomber, you need an average of 1300 DPS per member to kill it. Thats pretty harsh. HOWEVER

If you add in both your Tanks DPS - the require comes down from 1300 to 866. Which is pathetically easy. And if your healers can also contribute damage it goes down even further to 650 DPS per person in an 8 man normal EC Group.

Honestly, its not that difficult. Columi geared Raiders should at least be able to pull 1000 DPS raid buffed. (That means stims too, if you're not using them, thats your fault). Which leaves 2 tanks and 2 Healers, (assuming the DPS people didn't pop any cooldowns) to comes up with 350 DPS each.

Shocking I know, but healers and tanks can do damage too! Its a group effort. If your DPS has to be responsible for avoiding unnecessary damage to help the healers, the Healers can then help out the DPS if they are tight on DPS checks! And Tanks should also be doing some damage too of course.
Fallschirmjager
Lightning Sorcerer
<Rapture>
The Shadowlands (Formerly Shadow Hand)

Thoffs's Avatar


Thoffs
05.28.2012 , 04:22 PM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by pureeffinmetal View Post
I really don't see why people keep missing this point.

Baradium Bombers have 104k HP on 8m normal. You have 20s to kill it. This means If you only have your 4 DPS members attacking the Bomber, you need an average of 1300 DPS per member to kill it. Thats pretty harsh. HOWEVER

If you add in both your Tanks DPS - the require comes down from 1300 to 866. Which is pathetically easy. And if your healers can also contribute damage it goes down even further to 650 DPS per person in an 8 man normal EC Group.

Honestly, its not that difficult. Columi geared Raiders should at least be able to pull 1000 DPS raid buffed. (That means stims too, if you're not using them, thats your fault). Which leaves 2 tanks and 2 Healers, (assuming the DPS people didn't pop any cooldowns) to comes up with 350 DPS each.

Shocking I know, but healers and tanks can do damage too! Its a group effort. If your DPS has to be responsible for avoiding unnecessary damage to help the healers, the Healers can then help out the DPS if they are tight on DPS checks! And Tanks should also be doing some damage too of course.
You know, its funny - you make it sound like my grandma and a three year could do this. Do you think our tanks and healers were sitting around reading books while the DPS were working on killing these guys? They were DPS'ing as well, and it was tight. By the time you locate the bomber, get to the bomber, cast your first spell -- you don't have 20 seconds any more. And yep, we do know what stims are, believe it or not! Sheesh.

The real problem is the third bomber, when at least one tank is missing. I am sure we will be able to do it, but it is not the cakewalk you make it sound like it should be.

Anyway, I am sure there is a group of players out there that could do this in tionese, much less Columi. However, I am betting that many groups, if they are only columi geared, will have a tough time.

Styrka's Avatar


Styrka
05.28.2012 , 04:57 PM | #23
That's entirely true, but it then makes the OP question mostly invalid. You don't need gear for the operation -- you need skill. Depending on your handicap, you'll want better gear. Obviously the standard is set to Columi, but that requirement will fluctuate based on how casual/hardcore your players are.

pureeffinmetal's Avatar


pureeffinmetal
05.28.2012 , 04:59 PM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by Thoffs View Post
You know, its funny - you make it sound like my grandma and a three year could do this. Do you think our tanks and healers were sitting around reading books while the DPS were working on killing these guys? They were DPS'ing as well, and it was tight. By the time you locate the bomber, get to the bomber, cast your first spell -- you don't have 20 seconds any more. And yep, we do know what stims are, believe it or not! Sheesh.

The real problem is the third bomber, when at least one tank is missing. I am sure we will be able to do it, but it is not the cakewalk you make it sound like it should be.

Anyway, I am sure there is a group of players out there that could do this in tionese, much less Columi. However, I am betting that many groups, if they are only columi geared, will have a tough time.
Thats fine then. But that doesn't change the answer. "Whats the minimum gear required for Denova"

Which means that in can be done in Columi. And Who knows? Maybe in Tionese like you said. I wouldn't know I don't have a tionese geared raid to try.

All I know is that we've been running Denova HM in our Rakata gear since 1.2 hit. And before we had campaign gear we were beating the bomber timer by 2-3s at least. Sometimes by 5 or more.

Which is why I have a problem believing groups in partial or even full Rakata have issues with story. Strictly speaking, gear isnt the issue in that case.
Fallschirmjager
Lightning Sorcerer
<Rapture>
The Shadowlands (Formerly Shadow Hand)

AshlaBoga's Avatar


AshlaBoga
05.28.2012 , 05:05 PM | #25
As a sorc I can say that some of the Columi has better stats than the Rakata.

So I will give you the only gear suggestion I ever really give - MIN MAX.

Thoffs's Avatar


Thoffs
05.29.2012 , 06:26 AM | #26
Update on my previous post: Took an 'A' grade DPS to replace our previous sub-par DPS member that we had used for the first three bosses and which we had trouble getting down the third bomber, and promptly one-shot Kephess. The mechanics are not too bad once you know them.

My original 'TL;DR' stands -- if you have the gear/skill to do the first three EC story mode bosses, you may still not have what is needed for Kephess, so beware of that.

Also, a more accurate minimum requirement of gear+skill would be that if you can easily clear hard mode EV/KP, then you can do story mode EC.

DyasAlue's Avatar


DyasAlue
05.30.2012 , 11:36 AM | #27
Quote:
Jason: We expect a fresh level 50 character to start with a mixture of high level Premium and Prototype gear from missions, crafting and planetary commendations. For players interested in Group PvE end-game content the first step would be to use Group Finder to go through the Normal Mode Flashpoints until you acquire a full set of Prototype gear, probably mixed with several Artifact/Tionese items or mods. Next up would be hard mode Flashpoints (starting with tier 1 then moving on to the harder tier 2 Rakghoul Flashpoints) and story-mode Operations (starting with Eternity Vault then moving on to Karraga’s Palace) where you pick up your Columi/Energized gear. Finally you’d get into story mode Explosive Conflict to pick up your Rakata gear, and use the Black Hole commendations to start picking up Black Hole gear. To progress past this point you’ll need a guild at your back capable of doing Hard Mode and Nightmare Mode Operations. Starting into hard modes immediately after story mode Eternity Vault will let your dramatically accelerate your Columi and Rakata gearing, and Hard Mode Explosive Conflict lets you rapidly pick up Black Hole gear and is the only way to pick up the top-of-the-line Campaign gear set.
http://www.swtor.com/blog/community-...ame-update-1.3

There dev said so. Rakata gear is not needed for story, no all who say it is, go learn to play. I am not normally on a high horse, but you just didn't listen.
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Suzina's Avatar


Suzina
05.30.2012 , 05:54 PM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by DyasAlue View Post
http://www.swtor.com/blog/community-...ame-update-1.3

There dev said so. Rakata gear is not needed for story, no all who say it is, go learn to play. I am not normally on a high horse, but you just didn't listen.
I think we're all aware of what the developers believe to be necessary gear requirements for EC. I think we're all aware of their intentions. They intended for a full set of Tionese to be easier to get than Columi. They intended for PVP rank and gear to not benefit PVE. They intend Rakata sets to be superior to their columi counterparts without having to swap out mods. They intend Lost Island hard mode to be easier than Eternity Vault normal mode.

The OP didn't ask what the developers intended for the progression to be. He asked what is really required to beat Denova. It's assumed that he's not asking what he needs if other members of his guild are better geared and can carry him. The bombers alone I don't anticipate going down if your DPSers are all in columi. Most especially, the 3rd one while your healers are too busy healing to help out with DPS and one of your tanks is too busy tanking Kephess to help out with DPS.

If there is any guild that can beat Kephess without any Rakata pieces or mods, hats off to them. What you have done is literally unbelievable and incredible. However, until such time as you can post a video of you doing it followed by inspecting your raid members to show their gear, it has not happened.
Member of Bane Fleet

MariLupus's Avatar


MariLupus
05.31.2012 , 04:56 AM | #29
While full Rakata is not needed for EC story I would say for the final boss you should have your DPS that use weapon damage with Rakata hilts/barrells to max DPS. It may be possible with one sub par DPSer. Unfortunatly the one time in an undergeared group we ran out of raid time after the second boss and was not able to go again till after reset. It is definatly possible to do the first four bosses in columni though.

My advice if you have sub gered raiders who want to do this raid is do the first three bosses then those who have had new parts drop for them exit area get their new gear then come back in. Provided it is only one or two that need to do so this should push you over the top so that your DPS will be good enough for the third bomber.
At last we will reveal ourselves to the Trolls. At last we will have revenge.
Former guildleader Mayhen, Nightmare Lands republic guild.

Leovinus's Avatar


Leovinus
05.31.2012 , 06:56 AM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by DyasAlue View Post
http://www.swtor.com/blog/community-...ame-update-1.3

There dev said so. Rakata gear is not needed for story, no all who say it is, go learn to play. I am not normally on a high horse, but you just didn't listen.
That dev quote ALSO indicated that you need a solid guild behind you starting at HM EV/KP, indicating that they honestly believe EC is relatively doable in a true pickup, and I think we all know how likely that is (in case you're wondering here's a hint. Not at all, not in columi and not in rakata.)