Thanks for posting the article. There is absolutely nothing in this article that told me anything new. Peeps on these Forums had already worked out the math on the new 1.2 Expertise value right before patch release and came to the same conclusions that Ohlen stated.

However, the math is one thing. Actual gameplay is something else altogether. While the math may paint a clear "determinable" picture, the gameplay is not conforming. The TTK is certainly faster than it should be and the actual in-game combat has deteriorated into a DPS race (except for in Huttball). I think this article exemplifies what many of us fear the most in SWTOR PvP. The Devs really are largely oblivious to what's actually happening in their game.

And no mention of CC at all. CC is worse than its ever been. The current Resolve system is simply insufficient. Snares and slows are more popular than ever because Resolve does not handle them adequately. It needs a redux.

The Devs really are largely oblivious to what's actually happening in their game.

I submit this for the Post of the Day award.

I submit this for the Post of the Day award.

+1

I don't know why but I was actually excited to read that article hoping that there was something in there to give me hope and make me consider re-subbing.

Instead, I got one of the softest interviewers I have ever encountered. And Ohlen's answers....well it's just as I feared. The developers just don't acknowledge that their are major problems with pvp. There was nearly nothing in that article about:

1) TTK --- very insufficient answer (honestly play your game -- see for yourself)

2) Stuns, cc, mezzes

3) Dying servers

Oh well. Just 32 days left and I doubt I'll be logging in any time soon with D3 out.

I submit this for the Post of the Day award.

+1.

They also didn't talk at all about the utter lack of balance between force users and non-force users.

Thanks for posting the article. There is absolutely nothing in this article that told me anything new. Peeps on these Forums had already worked out the math on the new 1.2 Expertise value right before patch release and came to the same conclusions that Ohlen stated.

Yeah nothing terribly enlightening in the article, still I thought it was interesting , particularly noting how close forum d00ds were to the math developers are apparently designing around. I definitely found the stance taken in the article that generally PvP is "working as intended" at the moment, pretty disheartening. I enjoy the game quite a bit overall but between this sort of assertion that PvP in its current state is fine and dandy and issues tied to server populations I find myself increasingly looking elsewhere.

However, the math is one thing. Actual gameplay is something else altogether. While the math may paint a clear "determinable" picture, the gameplay is not conforming. The TTK is certainly faster than it should be and the actual in-game combat has deteriorated into a DPS race (except for in Huttball). I think this article exemplifies what many of us fear the most in SWTOR PvP. The Devs really are largely oblivious to what's actually happening in their game.

Sadly this is about how I feel. After reading the article I can't help but wonder what on earth he is playing if things are currently working as intended. I've never understood the desire for faster PvP or the assertion that short TTK = skill in MMOs. Pre 1.2 there were balance issues but of the same sort that I usually expect in games 2-3 years old, now it seems about what I'd expect nearer to release.

LMAO.....youll get nothing and YOULL LIKE IT!!

Did anyone notice his attitude towards the community? It was obvious that he has a dislike for the customers paying for this game and giving their own recommendations. He was darn right condesending.

Thank god... BW is getting this right balance wise... Im sorry if you feel UP at the moment but, honestly this is the best balance I've ever seen in a MMO and I've played most of them.

It isn't so much an issue of any one AC being under-powered (I personally just switched from heals to DPS and feel generally fine now) it's more an issue of a substantial change to the pace and focus of PvP. Pre 1.2 I found matches depended on strategy to some degree and team cohesion, though teamwork will always matter in 1.2 I definitely feel more free to just do wtfever and still win. Particularly on my Guardian/Marauder the game just feels like a button mash to victory at this point and unless I'm playing against an organized team heals/guard seem largely irrelevant.

SWTOR definitely used to feel about as balanced as I've seen in an MMO (it was a selling point to me for my PvP frineds) post 1.2 it is pretty clear there are substantial problems.

Squishy soft questioning, and answers that sounded like they were written by a political adviser. I am glad, though, that Ohlen is at least accessible. So many other higher-ups in previous games simply were not. Ohlen, while seems eager to answer questions about his game.

...healers are actually closer to target than they've ever been in the past...it's extremely unlikely that we'll go "whoops, we went too far" and undo what we've already done...it would be a fine argument to make that we've increased the minimum skill required to play a Sorcerer or Sage healer...

This is good news (re: Sorc/Sage healers). I'm glad BioWare isn't backing down, despite all the QQ about how hard the healer nerf was. Prior to 1.2, there was really no point in taking any other healing class into a warzone or flashpoint.

...we're not up all hours of the night pulling out our hair screaming, "How do we fix this?!" Instead, we're coming in to work each day calmly asking, "How do we fix this?" That's the job, after all.

This worries me. BioWare seems to be taking a metric-driven approach to balance and fixes, by examining spreadsheets and crunching numbers. This has been an ongoing issue since beta, where player feedback, especially at level 50, has been greatly diminished. Yes, I imagine it's difficult to sift through all the crap...but there are a lot of good suggestions tossed around by players as well.

Mr. Ohlen, you may not be pulling your hair out and screaming, but many of your players are. Why? Because they're actually playing the game. They're not reading an email about imbalance over a morning latte at the office, or watching a slideshow presentation in a cushy office meeting and discussing it over cream-filled donuts.

It isn't so much an issue of any one AC being under-powered (I personally just switched from heals to DPS and feel generally fine now) it's more an issue of a substantial change to the pace and focus of PvP. Pre 1.2 I found matches depended on strategy to some degree and team cohesion

I found that pre 1.2 matches relied on who had the most sorc/sages. Now, I enter a Wz and there seems to be a pretty fair distribution of every type of class. Personally, I like the variety. To those that aren't good enough to heal post 1.2 feel free to roll an easier class, cause god knows the healers that remained at least in my pre-mades are some serious BAMFs and a few of the less talented healers have become some seriously nasty dps also.

Hmnnn pre 1.2. I found that the only thing that really mattered was who had the most force sensitive pebble/lightning spaming heal monkeys. Everyone else was totally irrelevant. Now, everyone matters even thou healers are still the most important, it's like there's other classes now and fights don't stalemate into two triangles of healers endlessly engaging eachother and no one dying.

I've read this before and always found it pretty puzzling. Granted I'm on a PvE server so maybe it's just full of a different crowd but I never found these unkillable groups pre 1.2. Back then my Guardian had no problem chewing through people when coordinated with my group and my Marauder pretty much squashed whatever he ran into. Definitely some healers were a bit too good (both of which I'd argue were over-hit in 1.2) but DPS never seemed weak in this game to me (particularly melee DPS). Post 1.2 seriously most folks don't last through a single full rotation on my Marauder and my Guardian can chew through many in just a few seconds.

I'm not saying nerf X or Y class, or even buff X or Y class, just that PvP seems wrong now and distinctly too quick/easy as a DPS.

Did anyone notice his attitude towards the community? It was obvious that he has a dislike for the customers paying for this game and giving their own recommendations. He was darn right condesending.

Yes very true .

Yes very true .

Survey says:

Did anyone notice his attitude towards the community? It was obvious that he has a dislike for the customers paying for this game and giving their own recommendations. He was darn right condesending.

I agree as well. This is a major reason why SWTOR is floundering.

There have been countless references (wish I had time to look them all up and quote them) where Ohlen and team have referred to this as "their game", "their vision", etc. That is true with any game they have released prior to this, and they have mostly done a fantastic job at it. BioWare has some of the most amazing gaming titles out there, and a ton of awards and a loyal fanbase (at least prior to acquisition by EA).

However, this is an MMO. It's a different animal. Yes, they need to have vision and direction for the game. But because this is subscription-based, the players will absolutely hold developers accountable. Changes to the game can be made, and must be made, to keep players paying each month. $300+ million is a pretty large debt to clear, so they'd better start listening, and soon.

I've been in many betas over the years, and I have to say that my experience in this one was the worst of all. Player feedback was largely ignored or written off with cold pre-scripted responses. The current PTS is a complete joke, and there's no point in utilizing it. It can certainly be said that if this game does ultimately fail, the blame will fall solely in the developer's lap.

So he is asked a question about how PVP Sorc/Sage don't feel viable, and he specifically only comments on healers.

Well James, there are 3 friggin trees, and only one is a healer tree. What about the two DPS trees? Sorc/Sage healers are still viable, but where is the DPS at high level PVP? There are very few DPS Sage/Sorc in high level PVP, most top guilds will not take a DPS Sorc/Sage on their teams.

If it's supposed to only be a Heal class, then get rid of the 2 DPS trees and make them all heals I guess.

Basically he pointed out they have math to back up their changes. Expertise exists to keep people from using hawt PvP gear to steamroll PvE content.

Bad news for him in both counts. Your customers don't care about your math. They want to have fun. In 60 days when your X subs @ $15/month plunges again maybe you will consider that math.

Your PvE content has been steamrolled by those who cared to raid. Many are gone. Now what? Get your ranked WZs out and apply full expertise only to them. In unranked apply only expertise at the level of your Recruit gear for competitive balance. Or, more likely, arrogantly do nothing and watch the subs dwindle.

Amateur night needs to come to an end at BW.

Gotta love the complete evasion of the question:

Sorcerers and Sages were hit pretty hard in the update. Some players have said, "Good, they needed to be nerfed," because there have been instances of Operatives and Mercenaries being passed up for flashpoints and operations because Sorcerers could "do a better job." However -- and I'm sure you've heard it -- Sorcs and Sages are complaining that their viability in PvP has been greatly reduced because when they face, for instance, a Sentinel, he can literally prevent them from ever being able to drop their major heal. Did this change accomplish what you'd hoped, and why do you think players are having these reactions?

We've actually answered this question publicly several times, but it seems when players don't like the answer, they keep asking hoping it will change. The fact is, Sorcerer and Sage healers were in a position where they could completely bypass resource management, which is intended to be a large factor of successful healing gameplay. In PvE, they're right where we want them. In PvP, there are ways to counter the health hit you take in managing your resources, and short of telling players what to do and when to do it, we're comfortable with how things are playing right now. That's not to say that we're "done," and things won't change again. But healers are actually closer to target than they've ever been in the past.

 

In PvP specifically, I think it would be a fine argument to make that we've increased the minimum skill required to play a Sorcerer or Sage healer, but currently we're not buying that they are ineffective or have less potential than other healers. What I am concerned about and have my eyes on, specifically, is that this skill requirement is too high for comfort. The difficulty in addressing this issue comes from finding just the right way to improve ease of use and accessibility without affecting throughput and resource management. Again, we're never "done," and it's likely that future changes to Sorcerer and Sage healers will aim at addressing this specific issue, but it's extremely unlikely that we'll go "whoops, we went too far" and undo what we've already done. So don't keep asking if that's what you're hoping to hear.

No, Mr. Ohlen, all due respect, you haven't answered the question; you only changed the subject.

The question had to do with sorcs being overly vulnerable to interrupts because of the cast time nerf, not anything to do with resource management (and yes, the resource management nerf was needed). I still pvp with my 50 sorc, though I rarely solo queue anymore, instead rolling with a pocket tank on vent to cc the hordes of rootlocking dps on me so I CAN get my big heals off from time to time. So not a L2P issue, I adapted to the dev attitude...I just want to know why soloqueue is viable for some classes but not others.

I juke cast, interrupt, cast big heal, oh wait there's another soft interrupt for that, so knowing two interrupts have burned, try throwing my aoe, interrupt, oh now the first interrupt is almost off cd...

That question never did get answered...nice dodge from the devs...

But this is why I have a 42 op healer, so I can soloqueue again, and still be useful without having to wait and pray for a tank to come on. Operatives have viable instant heals, since apparently the devs conflate cast time (and just a bit much susceptibility to interrupts) with "resource management..." guess my Force stays full because I can never cast anything that uses it against a competent team.

Did anyone notice his attitude towards the community? It was obvious that he has a dislike for the customers paying for this game and giving their own recommendations. He was darn right condesending.

Absolutely. It really seems like Bioware has fallen into the classic "group think" organizational mistake. They need to stop turning inward, bring in fresh people who will challenge Ohlen, not disregard the community, and fix this game before it dies.

Did anyone notice his attitude towards the community? It was obvious that he has a dislike for the customers paying for this game and giving their own recommendations. He was darn right condesending.

Yes, because most players who play any game are bad at said game. If you cater to, and listen to, said bads then your game will be unbalanced and stupid.