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bad loot drop


Andex's Avatar


Andex
04.27.2012 , 10:36 AM | #11
Hard Mode Flashpoints no longer have a lock out. If you didn't get the piece you want, run it again. If your schedule doesn't allow for gathering that many people and you consider yourself "casual", congratulations, almost every class has a Cunning companion. That means that your buddy just ended up with a new piece of gear to make doing your dailies that much easier. Or whatever it is you do when you aren't playing with other people.

I can understand that there might be some frustration when Hard Modes locked out for 24 hours, meaning that the day could have been seriously wasted if your item hadn't dropped. Now that they're open for running repeatedly, there's less room to complain about it not dropping on the ONE run you did.

Pro tip: If you decide to take the party in multiple times or if you're running the instance with different people, try changing who the party leader is. Going in with the same people with the same party leader has proven, in the past, to be pretty effective in making sure you get the same loot.

Also, I don't remember "casual" players EVER getting /rage over the fact an item didn't drop for them. My experience has always been that they go "Oh, well, maybe next time " and continue on their way. If you consider yourself "casual" and you're getting this upset over it, maybe it's time for a little re-assessment. I smell excuses and shenanigans..
Doko prek anuda ten?

peterjohndevries's Avatar


peterjohndevries
04.27.2012 , 10:55 AM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by cbowsin View Post
How is it not relevant?
1) Yes, many gamers do not read the forums and MANY of those gamers do not make New Threads on the forums. However, there are a small few of them who bother not spending the time to learn anything about the game but then decide to make a new thread on something that has not only received a Dev response already but has been brought up several time by people who do read the forums.
2) 1.2 has been out for two weeks now. That is not a long time. Yes, looting is a basic component of many games, but actual coding and programming is not simple. I'm pleased you understand the logic required to accomplish such task but if you actually understood what was involved you wouldn't have made this thread.
1) There is no dev response. They said they fixed it and then didn't and have acknowledged that it is a bug. This is not a response - its a bug list
2) Seriously, I have been a programmer for 22 years and I can tell you that matching loot to team makeup is not complicated no matter how it might seem in your head but they are simply not doing it because they think for 'some' reason, that it is not important or 'important enough'. Not sure why you reference 1.2? This was broken when the product launched so either someone thought they shouldn't match loot to players or they have programmers that intended to have it work that way, it didn't, and they said they fixed it and it didn't which now points to even bigger problems that include the QA department.

People are giving BW way too much slack. I give them kudo's for beautiful graphic design but there is no excuse for the big ticket quality items. They are producing patches that are doing things like 'fixing companion stats' as if it really matters since playing PvE will never win or lose based on your companion stats but having people play for an hour in a hard mode flashpoint to get nothing is a big issue that should have an 'ermergency patch' .

peterjohndevries's Avatar


peterjohndevries
04.27.2012 , 10:59 AM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by Andex View Post
Hard Mode Flashpoints no longer have a lock out. If you didn't get the piece you want, run it again. If your schedule doesn't allow for gathering that many people and you consider yourself "casual", congratulations, almost every class has a Cunning companion. That means that your buddy just ended up with a new piece of gear to make doing your dailies that much easier. Or whatever it is you do when you aren't playing with other people.

I can understand that there might be some frustration when Hard Modes locked out for 24 hours, meaning that the day could have been seriously wasted if your item hadn't dropped. Now that they're open for running repeatedly, there's less room to complain about it not dropping on the ONE run you did.

Pro tip: If you decide to take the party in multiple times or if you're running the instance with different people, try changing who the party leader is. Going in with the same people with the same party leader has proven, in the past, to be pretty effective in making sure you get the same loot.

Also, I don't remember "casual" players EVER getting /rage over the fact an item didn't drop for them. My experience has always been that they go "Oh, well, maybe next time " and continue on their way. If you consider yourself "casual" and you're getting this upset over it, maybe it's time for a little re-assessment. I smell excuses and shenanigans..
Thank you for your pointer to changing the party leader.
I think you are missing the point re: re-running. To do well in the up-scale hard flashes or in the operations, you need to work your gear up. WIthout getting predictable drops, you are getting blocked from being able to reasonably complete the harder encounters. SO yes casual gamers DO get upset - not a rage, upset. because it means we are stuck on playing the same things because this game is truly oriented around ensuring you have the gear to match the requirement of the encounter you are attempting

Andex's Avatar


Andex
04.27.2012 , 11:26 AM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by peterjohndevries View Post
Thank you for your pointer to changing the party leader.
I think you are missing the point re: re-running. To do well in the up-scale hard flashes or in the operations, you need to work your gear up. WIthout getting predictable drops, you are getting blocked from being able to reasonably complete the harder encounters. SO yes casual gamers DO get upset - not a rage, upset. because it means we are stuck on playing the same things because this game is truly oriented around ensuring you have the gear to match the requirement of the encounter you are attempting
I got stuck doing False Emperor for a literal week until I got my columi chest. I'd gladly do it 7 times in one day versus one time over 7 days.

If you want to see the harder content, you have to work for it. If that means re-running the flashpoint to get your gear, c'est la vie. Unless they were carried by a guild they joined, all fresh 50s have had to do this. The only other option is don't do it.

I also need to point this out: What do you think you're going to do once you finally move on to Operations? There are only 3 Operations in the game. You're going to be doing the SAME THING every week, at varying levels of difficulty.
Doko prek anuda ten?

Thoffs's Avatar


Thoffs
04.27.2012 , 11:57 AM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by peterjohndevries View Post
2) It has nothing to do with them POSTING that it is a bug....it has to do with the fact that the bug EXISTS and they have taken so long to resolve a basic component of PVE gaming
I find it mind boggling as well. These skewed loot drops were happening before 1.2, it seems that 1.2 made it worse. The ops group that I run with that does HM ops is totally frustrated by this. There are two possibilities:

a. Bioware is incompetent and just can't get it right.
b. Bioware is doing this purposefully to slow gear entry into the game.

Option 'b' requires wearing of a tinfoil hat, and generally I would not go that route, but.....I am starting to lean towards 'b' more and more as this persists.

Andex's Avatar


Andex
04.27.2012 , 12:02 PM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Thoffs View Post
I find it mind boggling as well. These skewed loot drops were happening before 1.2, it seems that 1.2 made it worse. The ops group that I run with that does HM ops is totally frustrated by this. There are two possibilities:

a. Bioware is incompetent and just can't get it right.
b. Bioware is doing this purposefully to slow gear entry into the game.

Option 'b' requires wearing of a tinfoil hat, and generally I would not go that route, but.....I am starting to lean towards 'b' more and more as this persists.
B. Working as intended. The developer post from above doesn't say anything about a bug, just that Hard Mode flashpoints are not taking group composition into account.

Once more: Hard Mode Flashpoints no longer have a lock. You can run them repeatedly. The loot system for normal mode Operations was changed, because it's a once-a-week event that had a bad auto-assign system.
Doko prek anuda ten?

cbowsin's Avatar


cbowsin
04.27.2012 , 01:03 PM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by peterjohndevries View Post
1) There is no dev response. They said they fixed it and then didn't and have acknowledged that it is a bug. This is not a response - its a bug list
2) Seriously, I have been a programmer for 22 years and I can tell you that matching loot to team makeup is not complicated no matter how it might seem in your head but they are simply not doing it because they think for 'some' reason, that it is not important or 'important enough'. Not sure why you reference 1.2? This was broken when the product launched so either someone thought they shouldn't match loot to players or they have programmers that intended to have it work that way, it didn't, and they said they fixed it and it didn't which now points to even bigger problems that include the QA department.

People are giving BW way too much slack. I give them kudo's for beautiful graphic design but there is no excuse for the big ticket quality items. They are producing patches that are doing things like 'fixing companion stats' as if it really matters since playing PvE will never win or lose based on your companion stats but having people play for an hour in a hard mode flashpoint to get nothing is a big issue that should have an 'ermergency patch' .
Acknowledging an issue exists is a response, even if it is not a response directly to you. It is one way the developers inform the customer what issues they are aware of, so that the customer does not need to make new threads complaining about things they are already aware of. Also, that list is not their actual list as they have a much larger list internally to track issues, every software company has this.

When I was in beta I would group up with others on Hutta, so as only Agents and BHs and we would still get drops with +Str and +Willpower. Like it is now, at that time this was not a bug, this is the way the game was designed. Random is random. From consumer feedback, they decided to change the design so that loot considers the group makeup in 1.2. This does not work as intended, so since 1.2 it is a bug which they have responded too, but before that, it was not a bug..

As a veteran software programmer you should:
1) Know the difference between software design, regardless if good or bad, and a software bug.
2) Understand the software development cycle to the point of understanding why somethings are patched before others. In addition, knowing the difference between a patch and an 'ermergency patch'
3) Understand the impact issues have on the consumer to determine their priority and what issues warrant an 'ermergency patch'
4) Have enough experience to know that even of the simplest of code can result in undesireable effects.

So you maybe a 'hobby' programmer but clearly not a professional programmer who works in the industry, else you would not have said anything you have already said. You are just a player, complaining about the current loot distribution, which is no different than the dozens of threads we have had in the past weeks and months. Trying to tell Bioware how to do their job, is not going to give you the outcome you are wanting nor is it constructive feedback. My advice, is to be patient and wait like everyone else, as they address the issue that they are aware of.
Yoda: I cannot teach him. The boy has no patience.

theBrayn's Avatar


theBrayn
04.27.2012 , 01:37 PM | #18
You always have the option to include one person of each base class in your group which guarantees that something will drop for at least one of your group members.

earthtoearl's Avatar


earthtoearl
04.27.2012 , 08:01 PM | #19
I will NOT be doing anymore Flashpoints until I hear that they are actually worth the time and effort.
I havn't played Flashpoints much. At lvl 46 I tried to help some lower level players on a lvl 30 FP and get 10 XP and NO useful drops.
After about 90 min on the Colicoid War (lvl 40) got 25k XP. I can get close to that in 1 PvP match, even with a loss. Also there were 2 special drops at the end and yet there were 4 on the team.

I compare this to similar missions in City of Heroes. EVERYONE on the team is auto-leveld to the mission lvl and you get good XP no matter what. Also everyone gets the reward at the end and you DO NOT have to roll for it. (COH also runs groups up to 8 players) .Profesionals should be able to program these Group Missions so they are worth it for all to play. Then it will never be hard to put a team together.

peterjohndevries's Avatar


peterjohndevries
04.28.2012 , 03:28 AM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by earthtoearl View Post
I will NOT be doing anymore Flashpoints until I hear that they are actually worth the time and effort.
I havn't played Flashpoints much. At lvl 46 I tried to help some lower level players on a lvl 30 FP and get 10 XP and NO useful drops.
After about 90 min on the Colicoid War (lvl 40) got 25k XP. I can get close to that in 1 PvP match, even with a loss. Also there were 2 special drops at the end and yet there were 4 on the team.

I compare this to similar missions in City of Heroes. EVERYONE on the team is auto-leveld to the mission lvl and you get good XP no matter what. Also everyone gets the reward at the end and you DO NOT have to roll for it. (COH also runs groups up to 8 players) .Profesionals should be able to program these Group Missions so they are worth it for all to play. Then it will never be hard to put a team together.
Thank you. Your point gets to the heart of the matter . These problems have been solved in many games and BW simply has ignored how to implement a game using 'best practices' and seems to have taken a giant leap backwards in game design. CoH autoscaled encounters to group size which was great and didn't implement a meaningless 'lets do it over and over cuz that's what we call gaming' approach to content!

Wow, I'm so tired of people who seem to believe that rerunning the same content over and over is called a game. Warhammer had 9-12 warzones....BW: 3 and comes out with a HUGE patch that adds ONE?

Entire worlds with 3 people on them....anyone feel insulted when it puts up 'PvP contested zone' on the screen?

Very Sad. $200+ Million dollars to develop and such great core elements that gets lost in the bigger set of problems