The end of the arguement. Is SWTOR in decline? Can it be saved?

Screw spending the full 100K, I would drop about 60K on an Aerial Atom, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6v4YNkurhLk

I would then take the rest and do something else.......

Like attempt to make the Atom even more bad ***? Meh, maybe invest it into something...

What does SWTOR excel at? Voice acting? Being Star Wars themed? Every other aspect of the game is inferior to other products available on the market. I guess some people are okay with paying $15 each month for a single player RPG.

People who use car anologys are always on a bad footing, take for example my car and the engines i build, look at them and you think meh what an old car who would want that thing, but i have a cali with uprated everything, everything on the car apart from the body is less then 3 years old but due to it being a pre 93 model doesnt fall under the same regs as a new car. Kicks the shnell out of scoobys and scares the shnell out of everyone who i have let drive it.

So on that analogy something based on an old design can be improved upon, features can be added to the point where something on an old design goes far beyond what a new design can, it is what the owner does with it once they get hold of it that matters. Have something new and do nothing to it and it will just get stale and ultimatly break down, but get something and constantly update and look after it and it can only get better.

You forgot the element of paying to play making the player feel entitled to everything in the game because the player has payed to play. I honestly like the approach of the GW2 store, if you have money you can buy "gems" which can buy spcial items including gold and you can buy gems with gold. Creating a balance between the hard working guy and the no life having "HARCORE" 24/7 player. I like that.

I'm not "HARDCORE", but I am one of those people who is compelled to win, be #1, get it all etc. I stay up for days on end when stuff launches, I spend 4hrs a day doing pointless BS so I can craft stuff to sell before I do my 4hrs of PvP (which normally makes me really mad because I PUG a lot); basically I play 10hrs a day; do whatever I have/need to 10hrs a day and sleep 3-4hrs most days because I am compelled to always do something if I am not playing some game or reading a book I have to work on a program or game to keep my mind busy.

The thing is usually when I do something like study, write a program/game I gain a tangible lasting reward. This is what I like a long term lasting reward for my effort and work. I really hate washing dishes, doing laundry, and cutting the grass because I just have to do it again and again and again and nothing is really gained from doing it except time has been consumed and a minor goal was accomplished that will have to be redone in a day or a week. That is what an MMO is like it is like doing the chores you really hate except it is masked in a cool video game.

Anyway paying to do chores... there is the issue in my opinion game can be great and fun but end of the day at max level you just pay to do your chores.

Anyway I need to grind up 1million credits to buy legacy gear for my new toon gotta go chase that carrot

Wrong. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature_creep

Software isn't a car. A car for the most part has a known and defined set of available features that can only go so far. Software is not that way.

Anyway, the problem lies in defining what is part of the game and what is an accessory. You have a bad *** car great; did it have fuzzy dice when you bought it? Are fuzzy dice "part" of the car or are fuzzy dice something extra that you can just add later?

Are server transfers fuzzy dice? Maybe, that is hard for me to say. Personally I think there should be no servers and a cloud should be in place, but then I tend to want the best solution technically with out considering the little things like "community" pfft

I still say if you know you HAVE to have it and you didn't have it at launch you launched early for whatever reason. If I was going to "build" a car and I knew I had to have fuzzy dice (cause iz a pimp) you can bet the fuzzy dice would be ready and waiting when the car was ready to drive the first time.

I'm going to try and weigh on this without starting a flame war. First, just because WoW was the most successful mmo to date, doesn't mean that it needs to be cut and pasted to every new MMO. I know people want to blame the player, and there is something to it, but it isn't an "entitlement" mentality. People who were not avid gamers have come into the tent. The old schoolers are going to have to accept this. Companies want their money and they aren't about to go back to content made for people who are on 25 - 30 hours a week plus.

This is where I'm probably going to get flak. The next paradigm shift in the MMOs will come when some company finally gets over their risk aversion and codes a game that is a hybrid of the sandbox and the theme park model. I'm not suggesting SWG2 for anyone about to barf out that immediate response, but I think instanced housing with displayable items is a must if you want to keep people subbing for a long time. If the gear treadmill is all that the MMO has to offer, well, I'm afraid people just aren't taking that bait like they used to. You can't have a community and have no place for a community to gather. I'm not against challenging raids at all, I love them, but give the players some space in the world they can call and "make" their own, if you want them to have any attachment to your persistent world.

Open world PVP, or at least instanced PVP that resembles open world PVP, rather than these tiny pvp zones. That's what I lot of people expected from this game. The failure to realize Illum has really hurt this game, in my opinion. Again, the gear treadmill is all SW:TOR has to offer when it comes to PVP. Frankly I hate PVP gear. Crafting should provide the best gear, but it needs to be crafted with mats concurrent with the challenge of content. That is raid level gear should only be craftable with raid level mats or very difficult quest chains with challenging small group content.

I would like to see PVP and PVE servers go away. I think there is a way to do that so that 'griefers' are not making life miserable for those who have no interest in world PVP. If I had my way you'd flag at a major city and it would take 5 minutes for your flag to turn on. You'd have to unflag the same way. If you are running around the world flagged, then some unflagged player could not just ambush you at their convenience. People who wanted to act as though they were on a PVP server could flag all the time, and would have no immediate option to turn it off and on to exploit the system. Those who would normally roll on a PVE server, just wouldn't flag, but that option would be there for possible world PVP events or city raids.

TLR Hybrid of sandbox and theme park models. Better Crafting, Player housing, World PVP.

I resubscribed, so they're back in the incline.

When such notions are not (contrary to your claims) readily agreed upon? Not necessarily, no. Especially when taken in regards to the larger questions at hand.

When i bought it the car was a shell with steel wheels and no windows, but thats besides the point, it still stands as a valid point. The game we have now has a good base, it can have all the furry dice, spinning wheels and amped up ice and engine added to it, there is nothing to stop it being added and the only constraint is the time it will take to build and apply them.

Seriously, the point of my post sailed two miles above your head...