The end of the arguement. Is SWTOR in decline? Can it be saved?

thisthisthisthisthisthisthisthis THIS.

Sadlly, challenge, consequence, risk and adenalin are apparently not wanted in the modern MMORPG.

For me...I get plenty of that in RL. I play a game to unwind. Now, I realise that isn't going to apply to everyone which is why I think some house needs to do some serious metrics, research etc. and see if they cannot come up with an MMO that works for those for whom your statement would apply. Maybe GW2?

If they made SWTOR like EQ was back in it’s early years, these forums would be full of people complaining, “why do we have to group just to kill things?” “when I die - why do I have to run all the way back to my body naked?” “why do I have to run everywhere it takes forever to get from Point A to Point B”.

WoW set the bar for MMOs by opening it up to the masses, now every dev team is copying the formula hoping to be the next big thing. I’m not sure what the next evolution is for MMOs, but until some dev team figures that out, the WoW model will be all we will get.

I don't think any of the above quoted (consequences, risk, adrenaline) can apply to any modern MMORPG without a high risk/reward PKing system. I don't feel at risk in a game where dying results in losing a few coins and a bit of backtracking here at there at most.. Just mostly annoyed.

If the majority of servers had population issues and the majority of those players were so inclined, then there could be a mass exodus. But I doubt that many servers are affected. Some are dormant while some are so crowded they have login queues. I'll hazard a guess that the two comprise about 30% (5% packed and 20% thin) of the total server count. The "masses" however probably lie inbetween and are neither dead nor crowded.

I feel for many of the players who are on low population servers now. Most were not here when impatient griefing cells started the login queue lynching party during early access that led Bioware to add WAY too many servers at launch. They inherited a mess other people left behind, so it's not their fault. Most who did the damage did so and then left. Bioware has been slow to respond to forum rants since, so they probably learned their lesson. But I seriously doubt the game will lose 1 million subs over this, which would qualify as the mass exodus you speak of.

My main server Mask of Nihilus is one of those in the middle. It is listed as standard and averages 30 - 50 on the planets and 175+ in Fleet during peak. We are a first day early access community who stuck out the login queues at launch that took Bioware all of 4 weeks to fix - and it was a real fix. The queues slowly decreased from 20 minutes (800+ in queue) to zip during that period and our pop did not change. So the extra servers BW added at launch had no effect on us. While we aren't Fatman we are quite active, with LFGs happening constantly and everywhere - leveling planets included. We even have frequent pug World Boss OP parties and stage our own RP-ins in fleet.

I think people should complain. If nothing else, it keeps developers on their toes, instead of letting them sit on their laurels.

"The game is dying" threads are just annoying though.

Honestly, I don't see any "risk" in any online game. It's all just pixels, imaginary stuff etc. So it always baffles me when I see folks saying how "real PvPing/PKing" is "risky".

Skydiving is risky and adrenaline provoking, getting into a fight in an online game with some other person...not so much.

The only way to save this game is copying planetary designs, crafting, housing, space, atmospheric flight, trading and foremost server architecture from Star Wars Galaxies, mark my words.

TOR won't win a price with small corridor planets, a ridiculous space starfox minigame and planets inhabited by 10 players. End of argument.

For you, perhaps, not for everyone.

I agree that the addition of some of your list would be welcome to some folks but that's up for debate, as so much is about any MMO.