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[PvE] Imbalanced DPS between DDs is laughable

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes
[PvE] Imbalanced DPS between DDs is laughable

Xyleya's Avatar


Xyleya
04.19.2012 , 08:53 PM | #1
Hello there. To begin with, I have all classes at LvL 50 and they're all Columi/Rakata equipped. I play a Merc, a Sniper, a Sorc and a Maro as DD in addition to my Assa-tank and Operative-Heal... yes I've got alot of time to play apparently

Now, that we can finally study the combat-logs all my previous calculations are backed up with hard evidence.

Given equal equipment it goes like this... Maro (Annihilation) 1800 DPS, Sorc (Madness) 1350 DPS, Sniper (Lethality) 1200 DPS, Merc (Arsenal) 1150 DPS. All tested fully buffed against the Boss-dummy.

I've tested hybrid-specs for the Sniper and Sorc, but there isn't much change and rotations are not as easy, so why not play it simple. The Merc deals a little more DPS in Pyrotech, but you run into heat-problems faster so it's not worth it either.

So, what should I say.... The Maro deal s the most damage, which is all nice and dandy given that it is a melee DD. What isn't right tho is, that the Sniper isn't in hte second place easily outdamaging the Sorc and the Merc.
Why you ask... well, the Sniper isn't a hybrid-class, doesn't have any healing-abilities etc... it's a pure DPS-class without any support-skills, just like the Marauder.

The Sniper should be somewhere at 1500 DPS currently to outmatch the hybrid-classes, or the Sorc and Merc should deal less damage then the current 1200 DPS of the Sniper. It's just not right the way it is currently.

Snipers need more sustained DPS and Sorcs should've a little less aswell as Marauders are way overtuned currently. The numbers should go... Maro 1600 DPS, Sniper 1400 DPS, Sorc/Merc 1200DPS.
Make the pure DPS-classes do the most damage and place them hybrid-classes way behind them, where they belong, due to their support-abilities allready being an advantage.

As we've now got all buffs in the raids without needing Agents or Bounty Hunters, we decided to simply go with only Inquisitors (1x Assa-tank, 2x Sorc-heal, 2x Sorc-DD) and Warriors (1x Jugg-offtank, 2x Maro), as this setup has the most DPS and the best group-heal, even if we don't have the 20% armor-debuff from the Sniper. Mercs aren't needed anyways from now on, as their armor-debuff only counts for themselves since the most recent patch.

So yeah... fix this imbalance.

trevah's Avatar


trevah
04.19.2012 , 09:59 PM | #2
Just a heads up, people are going to ask for screenshots for evidence. Just wanted to let you know before the trolls start.

Also, just as a heads up, the lack of dodge/deflect on dummies give maras a huge advantage as their OH weapon will always hit. Which will compensate for some of this skew. Not 2-600DPS, but some.
You're not as right as you think you are.

SamuraBob_Fl's Avatar


SamuraBob_Fl
04.19.2012 , 10:34 PM | #3
I'm somewhat skeptical about this, given my Tionese geared arsenal merc has homing missile crits of 5k. I don't have a parser, but I'm pretty sure I'm doing more then 1k dps. There may be a problem with your rotation, or you may simply not be reacting to procs quickly enough.
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savagedialects's Avatar


savagedialects
04.20.2012 , 12:16 AM | #4
but what if i want to dps as an assassin. I do less damage just because I'm an assassin?

No.
It is not enough for me to succeed -- others should fail

Aethyriel's Avatar


Aethyriel
04.20.2012 , 02:44 AM | #5
Marauder will outdmg anyone on the boss dummies because they are bugged and you can't miss. Marauders benefit the most here because all their skills have the additional dmg from the offhand which you wouldn't get that often due to the high chance to miss that it has. Normally you couldn't push accuracy nowehre near that level, not even when sacrificing tons of way better dmg stats.

Also, posting random numbers without insight in what you've exactly done rotation wise or what your actual gear and spec look like is just plain stupid, sry, but if you have all that data from all your funny little tests why didn't you come up with the grand idea of posting the data? You probably don't even know the bug or know about it but simply went on to ignore it in order to prove your point with false data. Only thing that's laughable in this threat is you.

Edit: Read the rest of your hilarious post and your oppinion on where DPS classes should stand and socalled "hybrids" There is no such thing. An Arsenal merc for example will not heal anyone effectively besides Soa when you jump down platforms, in any other situation this is almost guaranteed to get you absolutely nothing but overheating and doing less DPS to it without providing anything useful at all. Melee will always do more dmg or at least should do more dmg then ranged on stationary targets due to increased movement in bossfights. bioware decided to put almost all the stress on melee in encounters (for DPS, not counting healers).

You type in "support" like you are talking about WoW-shamans, no class in this game has real groundbreaking support beyond classbuffs (that in a raid with an altoholic can all be provided by a single person) except Bloodthirst by marauders and armor debuffs by Ars. mercs + Snipers. What support are you talking about? Some weak shields by Madnesssorcs? Knockbacks, Pulls, Stuns etc, all of that is not needed 99% of the time in current and probably future raid content.

Khaliras's Avatar


Khaliras
04.20.2012 , 03:45 AM | #6
Also the arguement that the so called "pure" dps classes should do more damage than those that have the option to spec for tanking/healing has been had ever since the game that shall not be named came out, and was pretty much in the end colcluded to be full of sheit. No matter what your options are, you should do equal damage if you are specced for it, since that is all that matters in the min/max world of raiding/opsing, and because you don't have the option to switch mid-fight, so the option is useless except for staving of boredom.
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Demwarala's Avatar


Demwarala
04.20.2012 , 09:09 AM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by Xyleya View Post
Hello there. To begin with, I have all classes at LvL 50 and they're all Columi/Rakata equipped. I play a Merc, a Sniper, a Sorc and a Maro as DD in addition to my Assa-tank and Operative-Heal... yes I've got alot of time to play apparently

Now, that we can finally study the combat-logs all my previous calculations are backed up with hard evidence.

Given equal equipment it goes like this... Maro (Annihilation) 1800 DPS, Sorc (Madness) 1350 DPS, Sniper (Lethality) 1200 DPS, Merc (Arsenal) 1150 DPS. All tested fully buffed against the Boss-dummy.

I've tested hybrid-specs for the Sniper and Sorc, but there isn't much change and rotations are not as easy, so why not play it simple. The Merc deals a little more DPS in Pyrotech, but you run into heat-problems faster so it's not worth it either.

So, what should I say.... The Maro deal s the most damage, which is all nice and dandy given that it is a melee DD. What isn't right tho is, that the Sniper isn't in hte second place easily outdamaging the Sorc and the Merc.
Why you ask... well, the Sniper isn't a hybrid-class, doesn't have any healing-abilities etc... it's a pure DPS-class without any support-skills, just like the Marauder.

The Sniper should be somewhere at 1500 DPS currently to outmatch the hybrid-classes, or the Sorc and Merc should deal less damage then the current 1200 DPS of the Sniper. It's just not right the way it is currently.

Snipers need more sustained DPS and Sorcs should've a little less aswell as Marauders are way overtuned currently. The numbers should go... Maro 1600 DPS, Sniper 1400 DPS, Sorc/Merc 1200DPS.
Make the pure DPS-classes do the most damage and place them hybrid-classes way behind them, where they belong, due to their support-abilities allready being an advantage.

As we've now got all buffs in the raids without needing Agents or Bounty Hunters, we decided to simply go with only Inquisitors (1x Assa-tank, 2x Sorc-heal, 2x Sorc-DD) and Warriors (1x Jugg-offtank, 2x Maro), as this setup has the most DPS and the best group-heal, even if we don't have the 20% armor-debuff from the Sniper. Mercs aren't needed anyways from now on, as their armor-debuff only counts for themselves since the most recent patch.

So yeah... fix this imbalance.
luls, did you try pt dd? at equal gear and player skil level, they are on par with maras, if not slight ahead in our raid at ec hm they're pulling most dps. just give it a shot

Teioh_White's Avatar


Teioh_White
04.20.2012 , 11:33 AM | #8
I could agree with that, my Pyro was normally outdamaging the Mara in EC the other night if I was making sure to play it non lazy, and he's get a good bit less gear than the Mara too.

That same Mara also completely destroyed my better geared Veng Jugg dps though.

demonskies's Avatar


demonskies
04.20.2012 , 12:31 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by Aethyriel View Post
You type in "support" like you are talking about WoW-shamans, no class in this game has real groundbreaking support beyond classbuffs (that in a raid with an altoholic can all be provided by a single person) except Bloodthirst by marauders and armor debuffs by Ars. mercs + Snipers. What support are you talking about? Some weak shields by Madnesssorcs? Knockbacks, Pulls, Stuns etc, all of that is not needed 99% of the time in current and probably future raid content.
A wow shaman hasnt really been a "support" class in a long time. Sadly there really hasn't been any support classes since the old days with classes like bards, mezzers, and the oddball hybrid support/dps like a necro.

To the OP unless you give us gear, spec, and pics/links to parse your point is pretty invalid.
Callisto/50/Bodyguard Mercenary
Decimate/50/Annihilation Marauder

Tigalo's Avatar


Tigalo
04.20.2012 , 01:30 PM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by SamuraBob_Fl View Post
I'm somewhat skeptical about this, given my Tionese geared arsenal merc has homing missile crits of 5k. I don't have a parser, but I'm pretty sure I'm doing more then 1k dps. There may be a problem with your rotation, or you may simply not be reacting to procs quickly enough.
When you dont even get the name of the ability correct, it is hard to believe you.
Nite Legacy (legacy level 50) on The Progenitor: Kir - 55 merc, Tigalo - 55 jugg, Kirana - 51 sorc, Jax 50 marauder, Rev - 50 operative, Nish - 50 gunslinger, Kenix - 55 sage, Manji - 50 assassin, Tigelo - 50 Commando and more