How come I can ROFL stomp Ops/Scoundrels?

Sadly that's not gonna happen with really any class, at least that's the goal of class balance. The idea is to fear specific players and not just any class in general. IMO if you fear any class regardless of the skill of the player, then that class is OP.

This is how I feel.

Two Operatives from my server were almost always raid marked and pretty much everyone feared them, Baited and Evilinside. You knew you were dead if one of them two caught you off guard. After patch 1.2 it's just like, meh, yeah there one of them are, so what. Maybe people don't like that kind of challenge, I don't know, but I did, it kept people on their toes. Playing against PvPers like those two made you a better PvPer. Any game I'm in with either of them, they still always do well, but that "OH CRAP, there one is!" is totally gone.

What you state makes sense. Sadly I think certain classes should always fear certain other classes, and that's what class balance is. Meaning certain classes are meant for specific things, killing healers, surviving mass group attacks, CCing people, etc. When a class has pretty much zero utility, like the Scoundrel, they made up for it by being the 1v1 kings... don't get caught with ur pants down if a Scoundrel was around, bad news and almost certain death. But who cares if a Scoundrel is running the ball, or capping a turret, or planting a bomb, because if they are not stealthed and they are not catching you off guard, their class is horrible. Removing their ability to be the undisputed 1v1 kings when catching players off guard... to me that's basically saying the Scoundrel class is now meant to be a healer and that's it.

sentinal/maurader is top dog at the moment. they have the biggest hardest hits in the game paired with the best "i can't lose defensive cooldowns"

tanksins and mauraders, who ever has more of these will win

scrapper ops are built around that big opener, they nerfed the crap out of our burst damage, but didn't give back anything in return for the parade of constant nerfs, NOTHING. The class is in trouble atm, but such is the ups and downs of an ever evolving MMO

Did you feel the classes were balanced prior to patch 1.2?

Its really easy to understand: the burst got toned down and the primary attack had its cool down increased.

When you open, its AB-HS-BS-Shiv-Lac-Lac-Shiv-Lac-Lac/Stim (if you got the proc)-filler-BS. Energy is a bit tighter, though not by a large margin. But if your filler is a grenade, that's 1/5th of your energy bar. On top of it, Shiv had its damage reduced via the talent and Lacerate had its damage reduced overall.

The point is that this isn't a bad thing because it extends the window of time that it takes to kill your target. What IS very problematic, though, is that there was no defensive compensation given. So, while it takes longer to kill a target, it also opens us up for more dps-time from our opponents. This makes their escape/control abilities that much more powerful. And when our cool downs are limited to 3s of "can't be hit by ranged/melee", Shield Probe which feels like it does nothing, and a reset that can be rendered useless via AoE, it is hard to put that same level of fear to people.

In essence, I feel like I am a less damaging Marauder/Sent with much less survivabilty, mobility, and only slightly better control.



PS> If you play Lethality in PvP, which I have dabbled in, energy is MUCH harder to manage, burst is MUCH lower, the attacks are MUCH easier to defend (Cull and Weakening Blast are ranged), and one of my CCs is negated entirely due to the tree's damage function (dots). So, you hit or less, work harder, and die just as quickly. Fun times.

So ur saying they took a glass cannon and removed the cannon part...?

Do you think that classes were balanced prior to patch 1.2?

I didn't feel like the class was balanced prior to 1.2 as it was too powerful too fast. I disagree with the intent of Hidden Strike, I don't like the knock down talent, and the class can be crippled in a hurry with a knockback. Now that the DPS has been kind of balanced (there is a lot that still needs to be done to keep it on the same level of other classes), being able to sustain DPS is the biggest priority.

Prior to my Op, I ran up a v56 Pyro Merc. I feel very much in the same boat with my Op in that my only defenses are a Shield (absorbs too little on too long of a cool down), a KB, a stun/mez, a ghetto HOT, and heavy armor. Comparing that to my Op, I have the same crappy shield, no KB, a 4m stun vs 30m stun, a 10m 3 target instant mez vs a 30m single target 1.5s castable maz, a ghetto HOT (ONLY if I'm Conc), melee/ranged immunity for 3s, a stealth reset, and medium armor. To add to that, all of my attacks are 4m vs 30m so kiting isn't really an option unless I spam Sever Tendon. Different classes are different, yes. But I'm comparing uptime and survivability and if you set the HPs to being the exact same and used yourself as a target dummy, the Op dies the fastest. So, if my DPS and health should theoretically be the same as my Merc, but I take more damage, am I supposed to be balanced out PURELY by stealth and 3s of immunity against damage done by the fewest ACs in the game?

There is a lot of weighting done by BW so as to balance classes. It just feels adversly unfair on the part of the DPS Scrapper/Op. Especially when some of the tools that we have aren't what we want nor are they wanted by teh community.

Scoundrels are the class I fear most even after patch 1.2.

Lemme see, can do face pounding damage.... check
heal themselves... check
combat/non combat stealth... check

No class that has the ability to go stealth should be able to heal themselves AT ALL, AND destroy you from it.

It must be a skill level thing, because the pub smugglers on our server absolutely tear people apart and are next to impossible to kill.

Just curious what server you are on? and why is it fair for other classes to be able to do awesome damage and have other abilities??? like all the other AC that have a healing tree or a tank tree?? And if you are fighting a scrapper that is trying to heal, did you ever think to stun or use your interrupt???