Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

Change to rewards is a step in the right direction, but TTK is still way too short.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Change to rewards is a step in the right direction, but TTK is still way too short.
First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

Khoraji's Avatar


Khoraji
04.19.2012 , 08:05 PM | #31
if TTK is so short, why am I still getting games with only a few deaths per team on a regular basis?
Khoraji - Jung Ma - <Dread>
Ven Zallow refugee

Sweeet's Avatar


Sweeet
04.19.2012 , 08:18 PM | #32
I have to go to bed so don't have time to reply to you all, so I will just say this. Since 1.2, the time to kill, DPS vs DPS (forget about healers for a minute), feels like it has dropped significantly. It's a subtle change but it's there, and is only exacerbated the more DPS you have. A duel between me and another DPS could last anywhere from 20-30 seconds, now I'm lucky if I can last more than 15 before somebody dies.

Some of you think this is how it should be, I however feel the opposite. You're not going to change my opinion and I don't expect to change yours. I just think a longer TTK will benefit everyone overall - I guess we'll have to wait until everyone's free month is up before we see who Bioware agree's with the most.

vimm's Avatar


vimm
04.19.2012 , 08:33 PM | #33
TTK is fine - could be even faster (:
geeR
Phantom of the Operative

Arkerus's Avatar


Arkerus
04.19.2012 , 08:42 PM | #34
TTk is fine. Feel exactly where it should be.
Hooning in the rex : http://youtu.be/xtXUM6yPMCY

Khoraji's Avatar


Khoraji
04.19.2012 , 08:46 PM | #35
Quote: Originally Posted by Sweeet View Post
I have to go to bed so don't have time to reply to you all, so I will just say this. Since 1.2, the time to kill, DPS vs DPS (forget about healers for a minute), feels like it has dropped significantly. It's a subtle change but it's there, and is only exacerbated the more DPS you have. A duel between me and another DPS could last anywhere from 20-30 seconds, now I'm lucky if I can last more than 15 before somebody dies.

Some of you think this is how it should be, I however feel the opposite. You're not going to change my opinion and I don't expect to change yours. I just think a longer TTK will benefit everyone overall - I guess we'll have to wait until everyone's free month is up before we see who Bioware agree's with the most.
I like this post... i disagree with you, but I like the post none the less.
Khoraji - Jung Ma - <Dread>
Ven Zallow refugee

Maxican's Avatar


Maxican
04.19.2012 , 08:52 PM | #36
I think that it was an awesome change, it completely got rid of the boring lull pvp seemed to have for me personally. I completely understand if you are on the opposite end of the spectrum though.

Ushela's Avatar


Ushela
04.19.2012 , 09:07 PM | #37
Quote: Originally Posted by Doomsdaycomes View Post
I wanted to add; There is a way to "add" a massive chunk to your health. It's called -actually- planning/building your gear, and not just grabbing a complete matched set. Complete sets are good, but there are so many tools at your disposal to customize your gear and fortify your weakness, that I've found most pvp'ers dont/won't do,
good point! And many of us did that with BM gear. Now, with WH gear they have switched up all the power/crit mods on the pieces..so for example, maybe your BM force master gloves had power, but in WH they have crit. So if you want power on your BH gloves you need to get force mystic gloves. THE PROBLEM IS, in order to purchase force mystic WH gloves, you have to trade in force mystic BM gloves specifically. I dont have force mystic glvoes because I mix/matched my BM gear to get two 2 set bonuses, and the stats I wanted at the same time. The system will not allow you to trade in you BM FORCE MASTER gloves for a WH FORCE MYSTIC gloves. This is a big problem cos I shouldnt have to regrind BM to get the specific WH pieces I want. This affects some classes more than other I suppose, but inquisitors have 3 sets of gear to choose from for PVP gear.

Go here to voice your opinion if this matters to you too!
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=421725

TirjacShiki's Avatar


TirjacShiki
04.19.2012 , 09:27 PM | #38
The new TTK is definitely out of control. This new change to expertise severely benefits certain classes (warriors/powertechs) more than others.

Powertechs (I play a powertech) were changed in 1.2 in hopes to reduce the amount of back to back rail shots they got. Which they definitely did, but in that change they made our initial burst very high. In a fight where people die in literally 2-3 seconds, this is extremely overpowered and makes the change in 1.2 moot.

Other classes with 'god modes' because instantly superior because they have cd's that prevent them from being killed in those few seconds where any other class would be (guarded or not). Marauders and Assassins both have abilities for this.

Every other class in the game gets crapped on all day long because they don't have either of those.

People say this change brings more skill to the game, have you noticed wz's are tougher to win? Games that are much closer? This is because it takes less skill, not more skill. A team of 4 highly skilled players would easily dominate any 8 people pre 1.2 even with crappy pugs. The games are tougher fights now because it's easy for anyone to stack warriors and powertechs and blow people up in seconds. This has lowered the skill level of the game.

Now don't misunderstand me, I am in no way saying certain classes should be nerfed. These classes only seem overpowered because of this expertise change that came with 1.2.

I suggest the damage multipliers be reduced back to pre 1.2, and the healing be nerfed as well to compensate. This way fights last longer but those less skilled players still have a chance to kill healers (not like it was difficult anyways). It gives people a chance to do something about being attacked. Currently if you get focused by 2 powertechs, you have absolutely no hope of survival. This needs to change

GeorgZoeller's Avatar


GeorgZoeller
04.20.2012 , 09:09 AM | #39 Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread. Next  
Hey guys,

A few additional notes on this topic, fresh from a meeting with Gabe and the PvP team.

(a) Expertise difference between combatants is the single most important factor in time to kill in PvP.

Having zero or little expertise on your gear (e.g. pure PvE gear) is the primary reason for people to experience a sped-up time to death in Game Update 1.2. While it was quite viable pre-1.2 to bring your Rakata or Columi gear without any added expertise into PvP, the increased focus on expertise in the PvP track of gear has made it much harder to compete with that equipment compared to even the entry level Recruit set.

Consequently, the single most effective step you can take to decrease time to death (i.e. increase time to kill of your opponent) is to gear for increased expertise. Coming from PvE, obtaining at least some pieces of Recruit gear is definitely recommended.

We're aware that this fact is not adequately communicated in the game and that the cost of recruit gear is perceived as too prohibitive by some of you. We're in the process of working on a solution for these issues at the moment.

TL;DR: Expertise is a lot more valuable than any other stat in PvP. Recruit gear easily beats Columi for PvP.

(b) In response to your feedback, we've re-tested all classes to ensure they are falling within our desired DPS targets and found one issue with Demo Round / Heatseeker Missile which was getting increased DPS, not just from other people's stacks but also from an unwanted interaction with other skills. That issue was corrected in the 1.2.0c patch this week.

(c) There has been some level of inflation in the overall DPS budget of the game as result of Legacy benefits and other changes. Over time, these add up and as it stands, we have established that the global burst potential across the game is slightly higher than we are targeting. We will likely take some minor to moderate action about this in the near future by adjustments to the magnitude and duration of offensive relics (longer duration, reduced magnitude, identical power amortized over time).

(d) When faced with groups of enemies, stacking debuffs can result a real TTK issue. We are in process of revamping the debuff system in the game to reduce the impact of multi player debuff stacking on TTK.

pwnshoppe's Avatar


pwnshoppe
04.20.2012 , 09:15 AM | #40
Quote: Originally Posted by GeorgZoeller View Post
Hey guys,

A few additional notes on this topic, fresh from a meeting with Gabe and the PvP team.

(a) Expertise difference between combatants is the single most important factor in time to kill in PvP.

Having zero or little expertise on your gear (e.g. pure PvE gear) is the primary reason for people to experience a sped-up time to death in Game Update 1.2. While it was quite viable pre-1.2 to bring your Rakata or Columi gear without any added expertise into PvP, the increased focus on expertise in the PvP track of gear has made it much harder to compete with that equipment compared to even the entry level Recruit set.

Consequently, the single most effective step you can take to decrease time to death (i.e. increase time to kill of your opponent) is to gear for increased expertise. Coming from PvE, obtaining at least some pieces of Recruit gear is definitely recommended.

We're aware that this fact is not adequately communicated in the game and that the cost of recruit gear is perceived as too prohibitive by some of you. We're in the process of working on a solution for these issues at the moment.

TL;DR: Expertise is a lot more valuable than any other stat in PvP. Recruit gear easily beats Columi for PvP.

(b) In response to your feedback, we've re-tested all classes to ensure they are falling within our desired DPS targets and found one issue with Demo Round / Heatseeker Missile which was getting increased DPS, not just from other people's stacks but also from an unwanted interaction with other skills. That issue was corrected in the 1.2.0c patch this week.

(c) There has been some level of inflation in the overall DPS budget of the game as result of Legacy benefits and other changes. Over time, these add up and as it stands, we have established that the global burst potential across the game is slightly higher than we are targeting. We will likely take some minor to moderate action about this in the near future by adjustments to the magnitude and duration of offensive relics (longer duration, reduced magnitude, identical power amortized over time).

(d) When faced with groups of enemies, stacking debuffs can result a real TTK issue. We are in process of revamping the debuff system in the game to reduce the impact of multi player debuff stacking on TTK.
Georg,

Thanks for the reply on this. I feel like expertise affecting DPS far more than mitigation or healing is what is making us feel so squishy. Myself I have over 1220 expertise and against certain classes, 1v1 even, like marauders I can easily be defeated in 4-5 GCDs.

Would you be able to tell from overall number of WZ kills now vs pre-1.2? I expect there should be a substantial increase. Hopefully you guys track this stat. Also any chance on sharing with us? : )