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Enrage timers just too tight on SM EC


MorbidAri's Avatar


MorbidAri
04.17.2012 , 11:56 PM | #1
So our guild was working through SM EC 8m tonight. We only have 3 people who aren't FULL Rakkata. Both tanks weren't full Rakkata and 1 healer. (One tank was full columi and the other tank and healer were missing just a few Rakkata pieces.) The mechanics are fun and engaging. The issues we had was with enrage timers.

This leads me to believe that either dps stats were nerfed of the content is slightly over tuned. Now before you yell baddies at us, we had EV HM on farm at the beginning of January and KP HM on farm the second week it was out, and have cleared them (save for Soa on the really buggy weeks) every single week since. So our entire 16m raid (or 8m since not enough people showed up.) are fully geared out for this, and it's not the mechanics but the enrage we struggle with.

A few core problems are because of the lack of a viable means in which to judge, record and deal with metrics. Since we can only look at our own dps, we have to go through great lengths to get every single person to get their dps at maximum potential. Now even if we knew everyone's dps, it doesn't change that BW's toxic attitude to theorycrafters has made them walk away. I spent an hour or 2 just trying to find some healing numbers to compare mine to and found nothing. Worldoflogs can tell me tons about healing and dps in WoW in a single easy to go place, And Elitistjerks can help me achieve that goal.

So you stand at a cross roads BW. You can man up and make a full team real time combat log so we can all improve as players and as a team. Or you can force us to struggle on invisible enrage timers which are too tight because metrics are shunned and theorycrafters are told to go away.

TL;DR: Mechanics are great and I love them. Making me jump through hoops to work on the dps of my team after you shun all of the theorycrafters is unacceptable, especially given how insanely tight your enrage timers are for people in FULL rakkata gear.

ViatorSWG's Avatar


ViatorSWG
04.18.2012 , 12:41 AM | #2
You obviosuly missed this for some reason - its been the talk for the last two weeks among the progression raid guilds:
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=402530

Btw. the new content has been live for *less than a week* - I think it's way too early to begin talking about nerfing it already, even the "story mode". As far as I have understood it you're supposed to clear the previous tier 1 content on all levels before you start on tier 2 content. I bet you'll have this on farm too in a month if you keep at it instead of complaining about it. Ofcourse, then the complaining about everything being too easy will start yet again. Rinse and repeat.

Zilkin's Avatar


Zilkin
04.18.2012 , 01:24 AM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by MorbidAri View Post
So our guild was working through SM EC 8m tonight. We only have 3 people who aren't FULL Rakkata. Both tanks weren't full Rakkata and 1 healer. (One tank was full columi and the other tank and healer were missing just a few Rakkata pieces.) The mechanics are fun and engaging. The issues we had was with enrage timers.

This leads me to believe that either dps stats were nerfed of the content is slightly over tuned. Now before you yell baddies at us, we had EV HM on farm at the beginning of January and KP HM on farm the second week it was out, and have cleared them (save for Soa on the really buggy weeks) every single week since. So our entire 16m raid (or 8m since not enough people showed up.) are fully geared out for this, and it's not the mechanics but the enrage we struggle with.

A few core problems are because of the lack of a viable means in which to judge, record and deal with metrics. Since we can only look at our own dps, we have to go through great lengths to get every single person to get their dps at maximum potential. Now even if we knew everyone's dps, it doesn't change that BW's toxic attitude to theorycrafters has made them walk away. I spent an hour or 2 just trying to find some healing numbers to compare mine to and found nothing. Worldoflogs can tell me tons about healing and dps in WoW in a single easy to go place, And Elitistjerks can help me achieve that goal.

So you stand at a cross roads BW. You can man up and make a full team real time combat log so we can all improve as players and as a team. Or you can force us to struggle on invisible enrage timers which are too tight because metrics are shunned and theorycrafters are told to go away.

TL;DR: Mechanics are great and I love them. Making me jump through hoops to work on the dps of my team after you shun all of the theorycrafters is unacceptable, especially given how insanely tight your enrage timers are for people in FULL rakkata gear.
Well said story mode is meant for people who don't have as much time to play as hardcore raiders, so it should be easily clearable on first try. Not something you grind week after week.

Zbendixen's Avatar


Zbendixen
04.18.2012 , 02:28 AM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by Zilkin View Post
Well said story mode is meant for people who don't have as much time to play as hardcore raiders, so it should be easily clearable on first try. Not something you grind week after week.
Not true at all, Story Mode shouldnt be easily clearable it should be something you have to work at regardless of how good your group is due to the fact that it is dropping rakatta gear/BH comms, and to answer the main question the answer clearly is that your dps is slacking a ton, I used to heal on my sorcerer for our raids till I decided it would be best for my guild if I were to dps and replace myself with an operative, I have full columi set for dps spec and none of my other dps are in full rakatta yet we had zero issues with damage, the fact that your group has full rakatta but cant down the new raid is a testament that the content pre 1.2 was too easy. I will continue to say it, hats off to bioware for getting pve right in 1.2

xenofire's Avatar


xenofire
04.18.2012 , 04:01 AM | #5
I think the enrage timers are too leniant in hard mode, and probably just fine for story mode.

Get MOX raid parser to see everyones damage not just your own.
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Boissi's Avatar


Boissi
04.18.2012 , 04:36 AM | #6
Well that's weird, because we didn't see a single enrage when we cleared the place, and we weren't in full rakata. Two out-of-guild guys had a little tionese on mixed with a bit of rakata and lots of columi. I was under the imperssion that enrage timers as a mechanic had been removed.
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alifaraaz's Avatar


alifaraaz
04.18.2012 , 04:37 AM | #7
The enrage timers were tight before, but they already nerfed it before going live. Personally I think they're fine - not had any difficulty with enrage timers on Story 16man and currently running with a pretty average geared guild.

So yeah as others suggested - use MOX Raid meter thing, and see if you can find out which dps are letting your team down.

DeathDiciple's Avatar


DeathDiciple
04.18.2012 , 05:10 AM | #8
We did not get to clear them but had issues with coordination/tactics not enrage timers, at least first 2 bosses dont seem to have that tight timers, might be later on tho but so far it seems pretty fine to me. It takes time and figuring things out.

As said above, there is no excuse not to use MOX its working fine, lack of combat logs/ability to judge dps is gone. As for theorycrafting...There's still sithwarrior.com with decent info, as well as some other resources all over., and why don't you do your own, instead of wanting to get it done by others and served on a platter anyways? DPS check is easily done on ship dummies for starters, etc etc.

SilverBlink's Avatar


SilverBlink
04.18.2012 , 05:32 AM | #9
SM is really easy, My 8M guild that raids for like 6-8hrs a week (6 this week)managed to clear 3/4 and that was with people not fulling in Columi. One of our dps was in his healing gear cause he's changing to dps now. We had some issues with the 3rd boss not resetting properly and we only got like 4 attempts on the Warlord. And as the gentleman above said MOX has released a 3rd party dps meter that your raiders can link together that will display the entire raids dps. Find the weak players and tell them to go read some forums and practice on the dummys or replace them. BW said 8M was going to be harder too, less people to coordinate so it was going to be tighter on the mechanics / enrages.
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Zilkin's Avatar


Zilkin
04.18.2012 , 06:11 AM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by Zbendixen View Post
Not true at all, Story Mode shouldnt be easily clearable it should be something you have to work at regardless of how good your group is due to the fact that it is dropping rakatta gear/BH comms, and to answer the main question the answer clearly is that your dps is slacking a ton, I used to heal on my sorcerer for our raids till I decided it would be best for my guild if I were to dps and replace myself with an operative, I have full columi set for dps spec and none of my other dps are in full rakatta yet we had zero issues with damage, the fact that your group has full rakatta but cant down the new raid is a testament that the content pre 1.2 was too easy. I will continue to say it, hats off to bioware for getting pve right in 1.2
What on earth are you talking about? BioWare themselfs have said that Story Mode is just that mode for players mainly interested in story. Anyway I'm 100% certain the SM of EC is getting nerfed within next 4 weeks since it doesn't really fulfill the function BW designed for it atm.